Blackberry ID

Our berries aren’t huge, but good sized, I think. I’m guessing maybe TC. Somewhere upthread I posted a pic near a measuring tape- close to about 1” long per fruit iirc. I couldn’t pass up a combo pack marked down at Walmart on Saturday- for $5 it was a pack of one Black ebony king blackberry and one Jewel black raspberry. In my haste I didn’t think of checking and now I’ve seen descriptions between lightly and heavily thorned. Hmmm. I also grabbed a $5 combo pack of a patriot and blue ray blueberry… will see how they do. I usually go by “you get what you pay for,” so I’ll not hold out too much hope and just see what these plants do.

So there are both PA freedom and PA traveler? I’ve only read about the PAF, I think. I have to admit; I barely get the pruning of the already-fruited canes with these plants. I think a twice per season bearer might confuse me as to the pruning.

Thanks for the reply. Well, if they yours are TC, and they have been good sized and tasty, then that’s something to look forward to.

Never heard of Ebony King BB, but from what I just read it’s mostly thornless and upright. Sounds like a good berry, but I guess you’ll find out eventually.

Yes there is a PA Traveler, it hasn’t been out in the public market but for a few years. In my endless research on berries, I just haven’t found a lot of reviews on it. It’s appeal, according to UofA, is that it’s a firmer berry, so it’d be better than a PAF to ship. For us home growers, that’s not an issue. It is also a smaller berry than PAF, but supposedly pretty good flavor. Plus, a firmer berry means that it should be more impervious to SWD infestation.

There are other PA varieties, but I think the main one still being sold is PA45, but it is a thorny version.

Frankly, I’ve never been a big fan of blackberries, we have many wild plants growing around the farm, and they are way too sour for me. They have to be almost falling off the cane to be palatable for me, but still pretty tart and not very sweet. Plus the berries are small and the canes have gnarly thorns, which is why I hardly pick any. My wife likes them, so I let her pick them.

But, my mind changed when we went to an orchard last year that were growing some kind of jumbo BB’s and they were very tasty. I don’t remember exactly which berry, but they had a few varieties, one of which I think were Hull Thornless. Anyway, I thought we’d try a few this year, along with a bunch of raspberries. I hope I am out of my tree planting stage, but now it’s progressed to berry obsession stage! Maybe I’m too impatient to wait on my trees and want some instant results.

Me too, it’s a bit confusing. Even some of the experts are still learning how to best prune these primocane BB’s for the best production. That’s why this forum’s members’ experiences and techniques are so
invaluable.

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Howdy.

Just now joined, but I don’t see a way to post my first contribution. Sorry to bother you, but this is the only way that I can figure to get that info.

Thanks much.

Best,

Dan in New Orleans

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Well, it looks like I managed to post, after all …

Hey Dan, welcome to the forum. If you want to introduce yourself to the forum, post something on this thread:

Just tell us a little about yourself, or a lot. Also, if you want, tell us what you kind of fruit you are growing or are interested in trying in the future. Maybe some of your hobbies, whatever else you’re comfortable with.

After that post or reply on any of the visible threads. Use the magnifying glass at the upper right to search for a particular topic.

Welcome again!

I found these sites, which is a presentation from the U of Arkansas’ blackberry program. Some very good and useful info on them:

http://www.vsuag.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Salgado-Virginia-2015.pdf

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwi9j5Ho1ZraAhXDtVMKHSzpCrQQFgg1MAE&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.greatplainsgrowersconference.org%2Fuploads%2F2%2F9%2F1%2F4%2F29140369%2Fclark%2C_j_-_blackberry_cultivar_development.pdf&usg=AOvVaw1EEY80yCUTwC60aNGeeyNu

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Thanks so much.

Sure, no problem.

Tell us about your hybrid blackberry plants. Are they offshoots from known varieties, or some that you’ve tinkered with? Are they thorny or thornless?

I’m just getting into BB’s myself. I started my fruit obsession a couple years ago, and now I have probably too many to take care of. I’ve got 10 rasps and 4 blackberry plants coming in this week, and planted 3 pluot trees a couple weeks ago. I also planted 7 Triple Crown BB’s a month ago, and a couple of those are just now sprouting. We had a long cold winter this year, and it’s still hasn’t been that warm since spring started. All of our apples are still dormant, but most of our other trees/plants are starting to wake up.

We’ve had so much rain that I can’t get out there and break ground for the berries or our gardens, very frustrating. But complaining isn’t gonna make it go away, just gotta be patient.

Except for a week or two at the start of January, we have not had a winter that last past the month of January. But, one BIG difference was that we had an usually cold night in the first week of January. In past years, our average lowest temp was about 28 degrees. But, we had a night in the first week of January 2018 that went down to 21 degrees, and stayed that way for many hours. We have to replace our Queen Palms every 10 to 15 years when low 20’s temps happen to occur.
What’s this got to do blackberries? My blackberry plants grew and bloomed and fruited pretty well for the first two years of the their now 3 year life span. But, this year, due to a being a year older, plus another year with no winter to speak of, they are in turbo mode.
Kiowa bloomed right after Mardi Gras, in the 3rd week of February, with fruit starting to set the last week of that 28-day month! Blew me out of the water, and, the first fruits started to turn dark last month, about Good Friday. None of the fruits are black yet, but they are well on their way to being that color.
Plant width of the “trailing” Kiowa was about 4 feet last year, but now is at least 7 feet wide. Plant width including

Sorry, accidentally hit the send arrow…

Width now, including suckers, is about 10-12 feet!
I put the word trailing in quotes earlier in this post for a reason. I bought the plant as a Kiowa. But, when I started to research Kiowa, I was dismayed that every description said Kiowa is an erect plant. So, I figured that my memory of what variety it is was faulty. So, I crawled prone on the ground under the trailing branches to get to the metal nametag that would certainly tell me the REAL id of this plant. I finally found the tag and couldn’t wait to discover the REAL name. Well, turning the tag towards me, my spirits sunk lower than my prone body. The tag read “Kiowa”. Either the plant that was sent to me was wrongly labelled by the vendor, or, I mislabelled it at planting time. Aaaaaarrrrrggghhh! I knew that I would never be sure of the true id of this wonder plant, and, that did not sit well with me, at all.
The plant has sent out at least 5 suckers, but they were starting off as vertically oriented, but, they would obviously have to tumble to the ground eventually to match the previous 2 years growth.
Still very p.o.'d at the loss of the plant’s real identity, I came across a post on a website – I believe it was this website – that “saved the day” for me. Poster happened to mention one providental detail. He stated that Kiowa is an erect variety, but that IT GROWS IN A TRAILING FORMAT FOR THE FIRST COUPLE OF YEARS.
Wow! All my prior id anguish was gone in a flash! So, my wonder plant does indeed have the correct pedigree, and, all those vertical suckers won’t soon have to tumble to the ground, after all…

So much for my first post, Folks.

Dan

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OK, thanks. Some aspects of Kiowa are (and you prob already know this), is that it produces a very big berry, maybe the biggest of the UofA varieties, and that it is thorny. Does this sound like your plant?

Wow, you’re right they are monster plants. Hopefully they will straighten up in the future. Do you have them trellised? They may still fall over if not tied to a wire, even when they become more upright. I’ve read of some folks on here who grow PAF, and even though it’s upright they still have to trellis it.

Thorny? BIGTIME! When I shimmied under it to reach the nametag, it was not without exiting it with bleeding arms, trust me. But my old skin is extremely thin, and, adding the blood thinners to the situation doesn’t help , at all…

The vertical stalks are still not woody yet, but the stalks are quite large in diameter. No, it is not trellised, but I may put a tomato cage around center new stalks after harvesting season.

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Oh, and the fruits that are starting to ripen now are not large, at least, not yet. But, lets not forget that these are the very first fruits, and these first fruits came to exist when the weather was still pretty cool, mid-February.

It’s very easy to pick them early, so let them hang after turning dark. Usually the calyx is a crispy brown before they are ripe. They become dull in color and come off fairly easy.

Great info about the calyx! I do have a dilema, though. Mr. Possum and Mr. Raccoon get a large percentage of my crop, and the longer the fruits stay on the bush, the better the chance that the 4-legged ones will pick the berries before I pick them. I have bought a Hav-a-Heart trap, to reward the critters with one way trip to the woods on the other side of the Mississipi River.
Last year I did have trouble discerning the ripe ones on the Osage plant. The ones that were ripe did have a delicious flavor.

My Prime-Ark Freedom started flowering after my Kiowa, but, the berries on PAF are developing much faster. PAF plant looks ok now, but, it does suffer a lot trying to get through our hot summer weather.
If I remember correctly, the few berries that it made last year were quite tasty.

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I planted mine where we get afternoon shade and they do great with it. You’re a zone and a half lower than I am. I’ve got some this year that won’t get much afternoon shade. They are going to suffer…

Wow - these are great slideshows. I think I need to try each kind of blackberry now :wink: Actually, no, but I feel a bit less intimidated of trying a primocane variety, and in fact they sound pretty appealing and the huge 16g berry from the PAF in CA in the second slideshow nearly sold me lol. Anyone in my area growing Primocane blackberries? I’m in very northern VA. I already feel practically over my head so may not pursue the PAF but I’ll certainly be thinking about it more! :slight_smile:

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Yes, I thought the slide shows were nice. Lots of good info on them, they sure make them all sound like you must have them!

Yeah, the primocane blackberry is an interesting beast. You’d think only a fall bearer raspberry would produce fruit on the present year’s canes.

@Drew51 said that these primocane BB’s are actually a cross between a raspberry and a BB. I haven’t read the material, but that sounds interesting.

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Pretty buds starting to open and a few fully open.

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