Help me find a pear I'd like to grow

[clarkinks]

@Jessica4b,
I apologize for hijacking your post with an unknown pear. Hopefully we all continue to remember your original goal which was a cold hardy Abate Fetel style pear. Here is a video of Abate fetel at their best for anyone not familiar with the variety https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF8HraBLYtE. It is a difficult pear to match.
@Jocelyn,
I see very vague mention of the pears you mentioned in some old NAFEX threads. They appear to be Canadian pears RE: [nafex] Pear leaf spot & Re: [nafex] Minie / Miney pears. Another mention of the series http://cjoliprsf.awardspace.biz/Documents/SavignacPears96.pdf & http://www.cjoliprsf.ca/Documents/PearArticle07.pdf
Update
Finally found them and they are similar. Some of these are a cross of Zuckerbirne x Clapp Favorite or Kurskaya x Flemish Beauty which potentially would be high quality pears. The attached descriptions should help you identify your pears Jocelyn. The photos are not the best but ripening times are descriptive…
https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?accid=%20PI+617571
https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?accid=%20PI+318838
https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?accid=%20PI+617572
https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?accid=%20PI+541347
https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?accid=%20PI+312505
Thank you Jocelyn for bringing up a couple of these varieties because I was unaware of them. At least one of these are virus infected so be aware of that if you request the scion wood from the usda and make sure your requesting the ones that are not infected. I combed through the main catalog to find them http://www.ars-grin.gov/cor/catalogs/pyrcult.html. You can see some similarities in these pictures on the USDA website https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?accid=%20PI+617571
Enie

Miney

Moe

This was another picture they listed “Image for: PI 318838 - Scanned black & white figure from F.S. Howlett. 1957. Ohio Ag. Exp. Station Research Bulletin 790.
Taken by: Howlett, F.S., on 1957.
Inventory sample: PI 318838 **
Comment: Photograph showing fruits of pear cultivars: Enie, Miney, Moe, Tyson, Philippe Chauveau, Early Seckel, Caywood, Menie”

Phileson

The leaves on my unknown yellow pear shown below are similar and pears are somewhat similar. These additional pictures below may help to identify my pear.

If your trying to learn more about the Canadian varieties then you will also be interested to know in 1947 they sent some pear crosses out to be grown out such as savignac ronde verte which is listed here Savignac Ronde Verte Pear Tree - Flavourful disease resistant pear- Nursery. Researching these pears could lead to the discovery of many others. The unknown pear I have may in fact be an unknown cross from that series. A pear called Savignac can be obtained here in the U.S. http://www.sln.potsdam.ny.us/pears.html. I find it interesting that anyone would confuse the old fashioned kieffer with this variety but when I purchased my tree from the Arbor Day Society that is what they sold the tree as being. One notable characteristic you can tell about the pear I grow by the photos is it’s notably long stem. I will do my best to make sure this little yellow pear does not wind up being another exceptional pear lost to time. Of the above photos the pear 170084 is the closest in this series of pears to a match with my pear. The others seem to have a shorter stem or rounder form. They do appear to possibly be it’s siblings. My pear has thorns when it’s small if that helps with identification. I do have a possible theory as to how this supposed old fashioned kieffer came to be sent to me which is it may have been a rootstock that’s graft failed before they sent it to me because it did not show a graft union. Moe was actually used in Canada as rootstock. I suspect that’s why my pear is compatible with everything I’ve tried to graft it to and it looks like I was not the first one to notice the ease of compatibility http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/nafex/2009-January/033955.html. Additional testing was being done as you can see here "Pear. The following seedlings are undergoing extensive test: 0-291 and 0-292, both from Winter Nelis x Bartlett; 0-301 (Menic x Winter Nelis); and 0361 (Miney x Phileson). Grosses involving the hardy variety Karl Sabioski, Bartlett and high-quality 0-291 were effected in 1950. " - https://www.cabdirect.org/cabdirect/abstract/19561603667. These were pollination requirements "Author(s) : HUNTER, A. W. S.

Book : Progress Report. Horticultural Division, Experimental Farm Service, Canada, 1949-53 1955 pp.20-1 pp. ref.bibl. 3.
Abstract : The pollination requirements of the pear varieties Enie, Menie, Miney, Moe and Phileson have been studied. Enie, Menie and Phileson were each satisfactorily pollinated by any one of the other 4 varieties. Miney gave a satisfactory crop when pollinated by Enie, Moe and Phileson, while Moe was pollinated satisfactorily only by Menie and Phileson. Phileson, and to a lesser extent Enie, Menie and Miney were self-fertile, while Moe was self-sterile. All varieties were regularly capable of producing an appreciable quantity of mature fruits from emasculated but un-pollinated flowers; these fruits were seedless. Seedless fruits were also produced by self-pollinations, by Menie pollinated by Miney, and by Phileson pollinated by Enie, Menie and Miney.
Record Number : 19560302472
" - https://www.cabdirect.org/cabdirect/abstract/19560302472

[Chikn]

@clarkinks

Here is a video of Abate fetel at their best

Clark, as our resident pear genius, would Abate fetel grow in central Ia. z5a/b?

[clarkinks]

@Chikn

Abate fetel

By no means am I an expert on Abate Fetel but I can tell you It’s a little to cold in your climate. It prefers Zone 6-9 and it’s even picky about where it grows in those zones. I grew it very well last year but my graft was broken off by a storm. I’m looking for another opportunity to try again this year. If your looking for a difficult and highly sought after pear to grow I would recommend you try Forelle which will survive in zone 5-9. It’s going to be a stretch to grow it there but I think it would be worth a try. It’s susceptible to any and every disease.

[hoosierquilt]

Clark, any idea where I might find Abate Fetel? I know Trees of Antiquity had it, but think they’re sold out

[clarkinks]

Patty,
You will want to order it pretty soon abate fetel is also known as abbe fetel http://www.raintreenursery.com/Abbe-Fetel-E.-Pear-OHxF333.html

[hoosierquilt]

Thanks, Clark, done!

[Chikn]

Thanks, Clark. I just bought one too. Feed the addiction!

[jocelyn]

I didn’t take photos of pears on our trees, it will have to be the fall now.
Moe as a rootstock sounds plausable, likely even. Interesting about the seedless fruits, I do get those here…some even on the Boscs.
Abbate Fetel is in a pollination group with Bosc and some of the other cold hardy pears. It will be interesting to see what those two seedlings I have do.
Commercially, growers want a good pollinator, so may no have planted a good eating pear as donor…but they might, grin, so I plant seeds. having checked out hardyfruittrees, Nova pears caught my eye. Cold hardy desert pears, sweet, sounds good. Might have to order one in a while, grin

[clarkinks]

@hoosierquilt,
In your situation Abate fetel should be excellent due to the wonderful California climate. I would caution others some of these high quality pears are extremely difficult to grow outside of perfect conditions. I have a location where even Seckel was difficult to grow due to disease and pest pressure. I removed my first seckle trees and planted a new strain of Seckel again in another location where they have done well.

[Matt_in_Maryland]

Clark,

What was your source of the second strain of Seckel?

[clarkinks]

I got the strain of seckel I’m using now from @39thparallel who lives a short distance from me. We frequently exchange scions in the spring. I requested another child of seckel this year from Grin which is PI 541184 aka Early Seckel.

[hoosierquilt]

Thanks, Clark. Yes, I read all about this cultivar’s finikiness. But that it performs better in warmer climates (hence why it is almost exclusively grown in Italy). My biggest concern is FB, so it will be a tree I keep my eye on, closely. So far, I’ve only had one FB strike, and oddly, it was on my Seckel, which is supposed to be resistant to FB. Apparently, I have the same Seckel cultivar you must have had. I was able to cut it out, and it has not returned, but I also watch my Seckel. It is well established now, and was the first pear to bear for me. Crossing my fingers every season with this Seckel, and will also do the same for AF.

[jessica4b]

Wow, thank you for sharing all that info. I don’t understand a thing they are saying in the video… but my eyes get it! Wow… such a beautiful fruit… These Enie, Menie, Miney, Moe pears look very nice and… they were bred here, very close to my home in fact! So that’s great for me… ! Yours look like Tyson to me. Thanks for sharing again.

[jessica4b]

Interesting! I asked the opinion of Ajetteaqua (https://poirespetitsag.wordpress.com/) today. He actually recommanded Early Seckel to me; “excellente et parfumée. Le goût est beurré et un peu différent de celui d’une Abbé Fétel et surtout, le fruit est plus petit. Mais leur parfum est exquis et le fruit est fondant et délicieusement sucré.”

Translation:
“Excellent and fragrant. “Beurré” taste, a bit different than Abbé Fétel, smaller. Exquisit perfume (aromas), melting and deliciously sweet/sugary.”

Note: He is in zone 3/4. He grows this variety, but says it doesn’t like the occasionnal -35 C … !!

[wildscaper]

I grew it for a few years in the Austin, Texas area. I grew it on Quince BA29C. It made a small shrub with thick branches and it fruited in the third leaf. Very, very good quality. I never had FB even when some of my other trees did. That could have been luck for sure. In my experience FB is very random. Also South Meadows nursery has it in there catalog at least and they appear to grow it on Quince also.

Drew

[clarkinks]

Jessica,
Which pears did you decide to order?

[jessica4b]

Well…not sure yet…

[Lizzy]

Extra thank yous to @clarkinks for these links and videos! I’m getting schooled in pears

[clarkinks]

@Lizzy,
Some interesting pears In this thread. Have a feeling Jessica will wind up with some good pear trees. Thank you for the kind words Lizzy.

[MikeC]

Raintree Nursery has some of the Abate Fetel pear trees. FYI. Oooops, sorry. I didn’t see someone else sent you the same info. I read the entire thread and saw that. Hope you ordered one though. Too tough for me to grow here in my zone.