Planted out tomatoes and peppers

[BobVance]

@subdood_ky_z6b

Black Krim’s from your list. I grew them last year and this year. My batch from last year were pretty productive, but the flavor was so-so

A few minutes after saying that my wife didn’t notice much difference, I told her about my post and she said “that green one was good- sweeter than the others”. Of course, with only 3 tomatoes on the whole bush, I imagine that it can concentrate the sugars rather well. She agreed that she would rather have 20 Big Beefs

Does either of Yellow Brandywine or Orange KY Beefsteak stand out in terms of productivity? Maybe I should add one of them next year.

@subdood_ky_z6b

This year I was more diligent about staking and mulching, and my plants have seemed to do better, over the first 6 weeks or so. But, again, I have been lax in fertilizing them, and they seem to be played out, plus disease has taken its toll

I’ve usually been good about mulching them, but this year I’ve been better about keeping them in their cages and staking the cages when needed. I used to use landscape fabric or black plastic, but recently I’ve had good results with straw. I don’t normally fertilize much, if any- just turning everything back into the ground seems to keep it pretty organic rich, along with all the leaf mulch I put in when I first dug it. I’m sure at some point I’ll have an issue with planting tomatoes in the same spot again and again (maybe 4-5 years in a row now).

[alan]

The problem with buying starts is that most sources get their plants from corporate operations that don’t supply based on local conditions and tend not to be up to date. I’ve grown Big Beef in the past and it is quite productive, especially on years like this one where early blight has not been a big issue with most varieties in our region. As you already know, I grow Country Taste now as my mainstay producer but we eat a lot more of the better tasting Brandywine hybrids that have become available, which taste similar to the heirloom but are much more productive. Burpee’s Brandyboy is one of these.

Country Taste is similar in flavor to old fashioned beefsteak types but is twice as productive here as any tomato I’ve ever grown. Along with Sungold it is the last to succumb to blight and it is always twice the size of any other tomato plant by the beginning of harvest.

Here we’ve been harvesting since the third week of June (Sungold) and began picking the Brandy types and CT in the first week of July. Starting your own plants in February can almost double your harvest season, but I wouldn’t bother if I was only growing tomatoes so my wife had them for a single dish- Unless, she was completely ga-ga for that dish, of course.

You have an unusual palate, Bob. I don’t know anyone else who doesn’t enjoy fresh handmade mozzarella, locally baked italian bread, chopped fresh basil drizzled with cold pressed olive oil and topped with vine ripe tomatoes- and that is just one of many tomato based joys of summer.

[BobVance]

@alan

The problem with buying starts is that most sources get their plants from corporate operations that don’t supply based on local conditions and tend not to be up to date.

It’s a bit of a cost-benefit analysis- if you are only growing 10 plants, the $10 for the starts is about the same cost as the seeds (if you want several varieties). And a whole lot less work. The place I’ve been getting them is pretty big and has a lot of varieties. Just not Country Taste. They had Sungold and Brandywine though, as my father is growing both.

@alan

I’ve grown Big Beef in the past and it is quite productive, especially on years like this one where early blight has not been a big issue with most varieties in our region.

I did a bit of checking and found that almost all tomatoes are vulnerable to early blight. The closest I’m coming to growing a resistant one is that there is a strain of Mt Fresh (Mt Fresh Plus F1) which is resistant. And most of the ones resistant to early blight are susceptible to late blight. According to the chart, CountryTaste is vulnerable to both. Which means that either the Cornell chart is wrong, or there is some other factor which extends it’s productive life. Maybe it gets the disease, but is able to keep putting out new growth?

http://vegetablemdonline.ppath.cornell.edu/Tables/Tomato_2013.pdf

It’s a bit daunting to look at this chart- it has 32 different diseases and 7 other maladies that tomatoes can get. Eyeballing it, I don’t see any with more than about 10 resistances (Big Beef has 10 of 32), which means that 2/3 of the diseases can still affect it (it has none of the other 7 problems, like cracking, sunburn, heat susceptibility, etc, similar to CountryTaste).

Now, diseases aren’t necessarily even in terms of their frequency, so if you have resistance to the 10 most common problems (or the 10 that you see in local conditions) that is probably most important. I guess this underscores the importance of growing several varieties with different resistances, to decrease the chances of a complete wipe-out season.

@alan

Starting your own plants in February can almost double your harvest season, but I wouldn’t bother if I was only growing tomatoes so my wife had them for a single dish- Unless, she was completely ga-ga for that dish, of course.

She is, and I cook it at least 5 times a week while the tomatoes are coming in. Hmm- maybe I shouldn’t want a longer season, as that sounds like a lot more work

@alan

You have an unusual palate, Bob.

Undoubtedly true. Fruit is actually one area where I like a much wider range (just about everything, except a few of the tropicals). In terms of “normal” foods, I eat a much smaller range. I don’t like the smell of tomato plants or basil, but the one time I grew cilantro for my wife, the smell was among the worst things I’ve encountered.

[subdood_ky_z6b]

I’m confused about “the green one was good”, was that a Black Krim? Obviously, a green BK is unripe, they turn a purpleish color when ripe. I should mention the one plant we have is pretty productive, it had about a dozen fruit on a plant about 4 feet tall. But they’re still too green to eat right now.

Last year the Yellow Brandywine was somewhat productive, but not as much the Orange Beefsteak. Both had very good flavor, sweeter than tart. But, this year the YBW has been very stingy while the OKB has produced more fruit per plant. None of the YBW are ready yet, I’ve had one OKB, and it was decent. I planted three Pink Brandywine’s and they’re put out more than the yellow version, but so far the taste has been bleccch. I don’t know if I’m picking them too early, but they’ve been spitters. They looked dark pink on the bottom, but maybe they’re just need to stay on the plant a bit longer.

I have read a lot of BW varieties can be notorious for low production, so if you want a lot of 'mater’s, keep that in mind. Some folks have tried different strains of BW that have been more productive, though. I think @Drew51 had mentioned something about such strains.

I used tack straw for mulch that I bought from Tractor Supply, a farm chain store. It’s got more " stickiness " than regular straw, which keeps it from blowing away as much. It’s been very good so far, has held up well and stayed in place.

I start all my plants from seed that I bought online from ohioheirloomseeds.com . I have done this the last couple years and usually start them in mid-March in peat pods. After they germinate, I grow them under lights for about a month, then transfer them to cups. Last year I planted out the first of May, this year first of June.

Our first year we planted mostly starts from Lowe’s or some other store. They did well, but deer devastated them, before we got a lot of fruit, but they were tasty. I think they were Mr Stripey and Pink Lady. I can’t say I wouldn’t try store/nursery plants again, but I just prefer to grow my own. It’s kind of satisfying to see them grow from a little one inch seedling into a six foot monster. But, I can understand why people buy the plants, it’s certainly more convenient.

[BobVance]

@subdood_ky_z6b

I’m confused about “the green one was good”, was that a Black Krim? Obviously, a green BK is unripe, they turn a purpleish color when ripe. I should mention the one plant we have is pretty productive, it had about a dozen fruit on a plant about 4 feet tall. But they’re still too green to eat right now.

The green one was Evergreen. Evidently they are completely green when ripe. I had forgotten which one was which and thought it was strange that animals kept taking bites out of the green ones. When I realized, I trimmed off the bites and cooked them together with some red ones.

But, there were only 3 large tomatoes on the bush- far, far less than the Big Beef. I see a couple more tiny ones, so maybe it will have a second round in September. I’ve grown Mr Stripey and some others (maybe Pineapple) which were very shy producers as well.

Sounds like I should give Orange Beefsteak a try.

[alan]

@BobVance

. Which means that either the Cornell chart is wrong, or there is some other factor which extends it’s productive life.

Cornell is not really useful for this kind of thing IME because they are talking about one thing and not basing it on actual field conditions, probably. Otherwise it would be obvious in their guidance that vigor and high yield is a big part of how a tomato is effected by early blight. I have tried varieties that were bred for immunity but whatever I grew was worthless for my purposes due to flavor and the fact that it was probably a determinate variety, which might be good for you but not very useful to those of us who eat lots of tomatoes raw, off the vine. They are more for the industry, IMO, because they can be mechanically harvested as most of their fruit ripens at the same time.

Country Taste is exceptionally vigorous and when I give it copper sprays through spring it has produced perfect looking and nice tasting tomatoes until the weather gets too cool for several consecutive seasons. Like Carmine in the realm of red peppers, it is in a class of its own as far as productivity here. This is out of a field of probably 50 varieties I’ve tried over the years. With Carmine, I didn’t even bother growing any other varieties for the last 2 seasons because it is both the sweetest AND the most productive sweet pepper I’ve ever grown. CTaste only wins the production category.

[subdood_ky_z6b]

Never heard of Evergreen, I’ll have to check into it. We growing a green when ripe version, Aunt Ruby’s German Green. Picked a 20oz fruit last week but had little flavor as well, and was quite pithy. Waiting on the others to ripen.

I grew Mr Stripey and Pineapple last year, all I got was puny little fruit, although the MS plants were 7’ monsters.

I was out earlier and picked some more ripe fruit, including a beautiful Striped Roman. It looks like a San Marzano, long small fruit, prob a paste tomato. Except this one was red and had orange tiger-like stripes. Very attractive, and the taste was very good. I have two of these plants and they’ve been hit by BER and apparently some deer browsing. But there are still some fruit left. That one tom almost makes me want to try it again next year.

[Drew51]

I have tried Carmine only one season, it was not very productive here. I’ll try again in a couple years. One season isn’t enough to evaluate.

[Moley]

Early blight has been terrible here, You aren’t seeing any signs of infection @alan up by you?
The humidity in the middle of June did mine in, they are still producing but it’s been a struggle.

[alan]

@subdood_ky_z6b

I was out earlier and picked some more ripe fruit, including a beautiful Striped Roman

I love the look and relative productivity of that one too. I don’t really know about paste tomatoes because the ones I’ve tried here never did well and Roman seems pretty juicy to be suited for paste compared to the store version It is fine sliced in salads or whatever- nice flavor. I’ve been growing it for quite a while and it’s one of only 6 varieties I bothered with this season.

[quote=“Moley, post:202, topic:6191”]Early blight has been terrible here, You aren’t seeing any signs of infection @alan up by you?
[/quote]

A couple of my plants have succumbed but given how early I stopped spraying copper I’d say it’s a low blight year here. My garden obsessed neighbor says the same.

[Moley]

I think I didn’t start spraying early enough, will be on the lookout next year. Snuck up on me, I’m using new table tops and new growing medium this season, I think they are probably draining too fast, will add vermiculite and some organic matter next year.

[Antmary]

Not tomatoes, but in the same family. These are not the first eggplants but they are the largest so far.

[subdood_ky_z6b]

My two San Marzano plants were prob the first ones this year to get diseased, and it was one of my first varieties last year to get it. The plants tend to be shorter than the others, and more dense with the foliage, so I imagine that contributes to the problems.

I did pick a full sized ripe fruit today, and it was very good, like it was last year. But, it doesn’t look like I’ll get much more off the plants. I really like the flavor, and it’s a good paste tomato, but its susceptibility to disease may get it left off of next year’s “rotation”.

[BobVance]

@alan

how early I stopped spraying copper

@Moley

I think I didn’t start spraying early enough

Wow- I’ve always thought of tomatoes (and potatoes, beans, squash, corn, etc) as no-spray. What timing do you normally do it at? I can’t imagine getting out and mixing up the fungacide just for tomatoes, but I suppose it wouldn’t be much trouble to spritz them, if I can do it as part of sprays I’m already doing for grapes or peaches.

I did find this guy (tomato horn worm, I think), but he was easily squashed. Though I almost got myself in the face when I stepped on him…

[subdood_ky_z6b]

I understand how you feel about the weather and early blight. It has been like living in a rain forest here over the last month. Ocassional downpours mixed by periods of scorching sun makes for a fertile ground for tomato disease. I did spray before it got too bad, but haven’t stayed on top of it, and it’s taken its toll.

Plus, getting out there every day in such an environment is not a pleasant experience. I just get soaked being out there maybe an hour, and I’m not a person who sweats a lot. Friday I was out picking green beans and then tomatoes, and the sweat was just rolling off my nose. Now I’m reconsidering thinking the heat + humidity wasn’t so bad back in Dallas!

[subdood_ky_z6b]

I started this year with the spraying. Folks on the GW forums recommended Bonide copper spray, so I bought some in a ready to spray bottle for about $9 for a 32oz (?) jug. You are supposed to spray before any disease shows up, because it’s harder to control once it gets going. Plus you’re supposed to spray all leaves, top and bottom. Obviously, that makes for a lot of work, and uses a lot of product. I went thru that first jug in just a couple of sessions on maybe 50 plants being treated. So, it doesn’t seem too economical. I have since bought a 16oz jug of concentrate for about $15, but haven’t used any of it yet.

Yep, stepping on a hornworm is disgusting. I haven’t seen that many on my plants, but have seen plenty of what appear to be stinkbugs on my fruit. Today I was out in the patch, which has got kind of weedy, and I almost stepped on a rabbit! It seemed to be reluctant to leave even after I shooed it. Of course my dog was no where to found, when I really needed him…

[alan]

@BobVance

Wow- I’ve always thought of tomatoes (and potatoes, beans, squash, corn, etc) as no-spray.

Tomatoes were no-spray until early blight came to stay. I used to grow your Big Beef and Beefmaster without spray, cover them with plastic in Sept and harvest perfect fruit into Nov. with no spray. Then I’d bring the vines and tomatoes into the basement and use those till Christmas. The last of them were better than store-bought. Back then we didn’t need to fence out the deer either. A lot can happen in 25 years. There are new pests in my fruit trees as well.

[subdood_ky_z6b]

OK, @BobVance, here is one of our Orange Kentucky Beefsteak’s we picked yesterday that hadn’t rotted on the vine yet. It really is that orange. I’m letting it ripen a bit more before trying it out. I think I may have jumped the gun on some of the other fruit and picked them too early, and weren’t very good. I’ll give you a taste report later.

The remains of another tomato, a Paul Robeson, are on the plate as well. It is kind of a brown/purple-ish fruit. It was pretty good as well, but my plants are pretty much toast due to blight, and I don’t have a lot of fruit left that’s not rotted because of the intense sun we’ve been getting. Actually, right now, it’s been raining pretty good for about 2 hours, so I’m sure that’ll contribute to more split fruit. But, what can you do…

[subdood_ky_z6b]

Today, we’re taking our ripest tomatoes and making salsa. I think we’ll have enough to make about 20 pints. We had to buy our jalapeño, green peppers and onions, but we needed to do something with all the tomatoes that seem to ripening fast. We’re sparing some of which I want to sample, like the OKB above. I’ll post pics when we get the salsa done.

[BobVance]

@subdood_ky_z6b

here is one of our Orange Kentucky Beefsteak’s we picked yesterday that hadn’t rotted on the vine yet.

Nice! Are there any which have been particularly healthy with regard to rot? If so, do they intersect with the group that is most productive? I suppose if all are rotting, it isn’t really a mark against the OKB.