Bee Keeping here I come!

[Sean.CampbellNY]

I just did this yesterday for the first time. I just bought two hives and boxes of bees this spring to start up in beekeeping, when I got home from work yesterday I noticed a swarm in my apple tree. it was hanging in the shape of an ice cream cone off a branch and was probably the size of a volleyball. so I set up my extra Brood Box with a makeshift base and top (until today when I picked up new ones). I suited up, set up my apple picking ladder, gave myself a little pre-game inspirational speech, took a deep breath, climbed the ladder, used my hands to swab them into a box, and dumped them into my brood box. 1 day later (today) all looks good in my “free” bee colony. what an experience! I’m proud of myself!

[Derby42]

Very nice, bees in a swarm are really fun to watch and work with.

[Steve333]

Capturing a swarm is not as hard as some make out.

Many years ago (30+) I was headed into the hardware store in my town and there was a crowd of people by the door with no one moving. A swarm had landed on a tree branch right in front of the door. I asked the store person if they wanted me to remove the swarm and they said sure; I asked for a cardboard box and a piece of screen to cover it. I tore a flap off the box and used it as a scoop to move the bees off the branch and into the waiting box below. After a couple of mins, all the bees followed from the branch (or nearly so) and I put the screen on and taped it in place. As I recall the store owner was so grateful that they gave me the screws I had come for as thanks.

Put the box into the back of my wagon and went home, where they got transferred to an empty hive I had.

All this with no veil, suit or gloves. No stings either. Swarming bees really don’t have anything to defend other than the queen. They are not itching to fight nor do they want to drive you away, necessarily. They will just follow and protect the queen, so as soon as she goes into your box, the rest will soon follow.

Of course, it was helpful that this swarm was only 4-5’ off the ground. If they had been 20’ up it would not have been as easy a collection…

[MuddyMess_8a]

Kevin, I’m trying to think of things that might increase the chances of your small hive surviving. Since you don’t have any sealed brood to put there, what do people think of at least transferring a frame of pulled wax into the weak colony? I’d put sealed worker brood in as soon as it was available, too, because then you’d have young bees hatching out in there sooner.

I’m concerned that half of one side of frame is not enough laying room to keep the other bees happy that the queen is doing her job, and that your older bees will die off before the next group is available to carry on.

Yes, it is all fascinating to watch, even when things aren’t going well, but especially when all is well.

[Steve333]

Kevin

As far as helping the hive with fewer bees, sounds like you’ve done pretty much all you can. You got them some more bees, the queen is out and laying, and hopefully you are feeding them. While they may not have as many bees as you’d like to start, it sounds like they have enough as long as everything goes well for the next 3 weeks or so, until those eggs she just laid become workers. Adding more bees at this point may not work if the ones in there have setup “shop.” It could cause fighting and further disruptions. If you did add more, you would likely need to use a separate body and fram for the new ones, separated by newspaper to let them get used to eachother slowly.

Key things for starting a new hive are preventing robbing (I’d probably reduce the opening down to even 1" width or less until their numbers build), laying queen, and feed them until they stop taking the sugar water. I know of bkeeps that feed a struggling hive all thru the summer. I’d use a feeder which is inside the hive, not one that mounts at the entrance as those can cause robbing behavior. If you need, a qt canning jar with a few nail holes in the lid, inverted over the hole in the inner cover, with an empty super over it and outer cover on top works well. The source of the sugar is far enough from the entrance to not induce other hives to start robbing, usually. In addition to sugar water you might want to feed a pollen substitute, if there are not good pollen sources around you (are the bees coming back with their pollen sacks full?). Bees can’t grow new bees without pollen.

You may want to watch a few videos on bees robbing hives and what to do. That way you can be on the lookout and take action if you see it happening.

The other thing I’d mention is try to NOT open the hive for a couple of weeks, if possible. I have read that opening the hive sets the bees back about a day each time. The weak box especially does not need any more setbacks. It’s fine to observe from the outside, or open the top to replace a sugar jar inside when needed. Just don’t take off the inner cover or start pulling frames.

It sounds like they are making it. Good luck, bees are great fun, and a constant source of amusement (if not work).

[ChrisL]

I installed a package of bees about 3 weeks ago. When I checked on them tonite I noticed that they started capping a queen cell. I added a second box, and moved two frames of capped brood, and a half frame of sugar water/necter into the new box. I did not see the queen, but did find eggs.

My question is: should I let the bees handle things themselves ie. will they kill the developing queen?
or should I let the hive develop for a couple of weeks and pull the top box with queen cell/brood and start a new hive?

[MuddyMess_8a]

Chris, did they only make one capped queen cell?

You could do either one of the things you suggested if the original queen is still alive and functioning.

If there is only one queen cell that gets capped, it could be an emergency replacement for a failed or injured queen. In which case, the new one will pick up and carry on once she’s had a chance to do a successful maiden flight.

[ChrisL]

Yes there is only one queen cell. I saw a few others that were taller than surrounding capped cells, but one that was larger, downward facing and much longer than surrounding cells.

[Steve333]

Chris, probably best to let the bees sort this out themselves. Just because you see eggs in cells doesn’t necessarily mean all is well with the queen. She may not be laying those eggs (could be a worker has taken over, but all a worker can produce is drones). Or the queen may not be producing enough pheromones to keep the hive in order. It is usually impossible for a human to tell if or why a a hive would choose to supersede an existing queen, but they have their reasons…

Especially since this is in a 3 week old hive, it seems unlikely that they are so crowded that they would be making a new queen in order to swarm, which is the only non-replacing reason to make queen cells.

So unless the girls are shoulder to shoulder in that hive and are over crowded, they are likely making themselves a new queen, which you should probably let them do. But if its only 3 weeks old, you might consider putting a claim in because the queen you got isn’t viable (although it would be easier to just go with their replacement than to requeen manually, but you would not be getting a known breed of bees).

[Isaac-1]

I don’t mean to hijack this thread, but I am hopeful some of you bee experts can tell me what I need to do. There are some bee hives that a bee keeper set up on our family farm many years ago, and they have not been tended to in years, the bee keeper in question is getting up there in years, and does not seem responsive to doing anything with them (messages have been left with his family about the hives over the last couple of years and we have heard no response). Is there anything that needs to be done to maintain the hives? As of the last time I checked a few months ago there were still lots of bees in proximity to the hives so I assume they are actively being used.

[Auburn]

Is there anything that needs to be done to maintain the hives?

My suggestions are for just the minimum upkeep and I’m assuming that you are not interested in getting into beekeeping yourself. Unlike bees in nature these are most likely located low so grass/etc needs to be removed near the hive occasionally (especially at the entrance). If you are interested in keeping bees yourself you might get a good deal purchasing these hives along with some extra supers to accommodate the honey flows. Just like growing fruit trees it is an enjoyable hobby but best learned by reading and asking questions. I like your approach in that you are attempting to get the urgent task taken care of first. Bill

[BobC]

I added a second box, and moved two frames of capped brood, and a half frame of sugar water/necter into the new box. I did not see the queen, but did find eggs.

Are you creating a split or adding a box on TOP of the current hive?? Either way not sure why you would split things up on a 3 week old hive. If adding a box to the top of the original box, splitting up the frames is a new concept to me. I’ve always waited till about 8 frames are drawn on a 10 framed box and then add another box of 10 on top and either feed lots of sugar water unless there is a good nectar flow.

[BobC]

Depending on what state you live in, you might have a bee inspector come look at them. Contact your local agriculture office and see if there is one in your area. He can at least come out and check them out for you. You may or may not want to mention they are abandoned.

[Isaac-1]

Thanks for the replies, these hives sit at about tabletop height, my wife has a cousin that lives about 70 miles away that keeps bees, there is a family reunion coming up next month so I may see him there and ask about local contacts, etc. I know that there is some form of registration or licensing to keep bees in this state, Louisiana, I am not sure how that is effects the abandoned hives issue, etc…

[thecityman]

I’ve taken enough of everyone’s time and I really appreciate the fact that you’ve been thinking about my situation (esp @MuddyMess_8a ). I’ve about decided to take the advice of just letting the bees work it out and if it fails I’ll still have the one good hive and a place to put a swarm if one comes along.

But I’m listening! Meanwhile, I thought I’d post a photo of just how “weak” the weak hive is to help better demonstrate how bad (or good) things are in there. Besides what you see, there is about 1/2 of the amount you see on the frame on the other side of the same frame.

UPDATE: I accidentally uploaded a photo I took 2 days ago when the queen was still in her box in there. But the amount and location of the bees looks pretty much exactly today as it does in the photo (except the queen is out and working and her little box is removed) So today it looks identical to the photo but without the little queen box,

[MuddyMess_8a]

Do you have one or two boxes on that hive? Is it an 8 frame or 10 frame?

[thecityman]

It is a 10 frame hive. Right now I just have 2 boxes on it but I have 2 more to put on. For whatever reason, the lower 2 aren’t deep like most brooder boxes are (as I understand it). Its just a stack of 4 regular boxes. On my other hive, I already put the queen excluder and a 3rd box and they are already working in it. The difference is shocking

[clarkinks]

Kevin,
One thing I noticed is no one gave you a really inexpensive place to get supplies yet and I use http://westernbee.com/. The hives and frames will save you a lot of money that they sell and I build my own hive tops and bottoms from scrap lumber such as oak pallets. I can build a 2 story hive for about $30. Good luck with your beekeeping. My family has been doing it for a long time. My grandpa on my moms side and my grandpa’s dad on the other side were all beekeepers. My grandfather taught me before he passed away. It’s a rewarding hobby and the honey is wonderful in comparison to what you buy at the store. It’s the difference between homegrown tomatoes and greenhouse raised. He taught me little tricks they don’t teach in books like face the hive east so the sun wakes the bees up early in the morning shining in the door because they have a tendency to sleep in. Wake them up 10% earlier every day and they make 10% more honey. When they made comb honey they used black bees like german blacks aka wild bees or Caucasians or carniolans. Italian bees make thicker yellow comb instead of thin white comb and the comb honey is not as good.

[MuddyMess_8a]

Just use one box for the small hive for now. There is far too much space for the number of bees. If you had a divider, I’d even suggest compartmentalizing the single box to shrink their space to half a box for the time being.

[Auburn]

Agree with Muddy. One box is better until the population increases. Keep the entrance small and feed. You might be surprised with a vigorous hive in a few months.