Deer pecking order

You know, you’re right! Although I’ll argue that if they’re eating grass then they are grazing.

It’s a distinction I make when hunting, in fact - elk do more grazing than browsing and deer the other way around, I think. So when I see well-grazed grasses I start thinking elk. Not that it does me any good anymore - I sold my rifle and just go out to keep my friends out of trouble …

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Hmm - NO! Since deer are known as browsers, they would still be browsing rather than grazing. It is what it is. I grew up on a dairy farm so I know what grazing is and it is not. Cattle and deer just do not eat the same. Cows eat around then take a step or two and then eat around and so forth. That is grazing. Deer on the other hand tend to take a bite at a juicy clump of growth and then walk to another juicy clump of growth for another bite. That is browsing. See the difference! I know little about elk but I suspect that they eat the same way as deer since they are in the same Cervidae family.

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Oh, OK then.

I have to tell you, this is the kind of, uh, discussion that could keep my family going all through dinner, until my mother would put a stop to it!

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I vote along with Mark. I keep a herd of goats who like deer are “classified” as browsers which, according to the online MW dictionary, means : 1aof an animal : to eat (tender shoots, twigs, leaves of trees and shrubs, etc.). The verb has additional meanings, such as doing something in a casual manner. I take the goats on hikes on the weekends, and they browse mostly—but when we get to a certain grassy area, they’ll tuck in and graze with gusto. I’ve had sheep in the past, and they would only graze, no browsing.

I think when we learn our first language as children, we don’t use dictionaries and create our own definitions with context—so we’re all correct :nerd_face:

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Is there any money in keeping a herd of goats or is that just a hobby?

I have two separate cousins that have small herds of goats. Why in the world they have them - I don’t know. Have thought about burning one of them with my 243 and checking the critter out rather than sitting in a tree waiting for the deer. Of course that would tick my cousin off and he would want $$$$. But in the end it would not be any more expensive than deer hunting. haha

And i don’t think that I would have to worry about the goat having CWD. :grin:

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My guess is that it is mostly a hobby.

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some people hire out their goat herds to clear under brush from properties. they dont damage mature trees and can get to hard to reach areas on uneven ground.

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My dad kept goats and chickens for a while. Said the goats could climb a wire fence. Young goat is pretty tasty, and for a time my sister did better with goat’s milk then with cow’s. They’ll walk on top of your car, escape in a heartbeat, and drive a little boy crazy trying to catch them.

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@marknmt

The old men I knew cried when they recalled eating Wethers fattened on american elm seedlings and under brush. So then if goat is good why deer you might ask? Well the permits are expensive so I really see no point to hunt them unless they are tearing up your young fruit trees. The population of deer is here and it must be controlled. That’s not our problem really and I don’t love deer meat. Had a woman once leave abruptly in dinner because I fed her deer, she returned with tbones her dad raised shortly after. She was literally angry that old deer tasted so bad. That rutty old buck deer was tough as nails, missing half an antler and wreaked of Osage orange apples and urine. Jokingly I said to a friend I believed that deer had the last laugh on me. In those days I had little money and a deer was the majority of my food supply for the year but by the time I finished eating that monster buck deer I vowed to never eat another. Stick with goats or deer that feed on grain and not Osage orange is just my two cents. In case someone never heard the term wether I attached a link. An old man I knew shot one on a hunting trip and it apparently had been eating sage brush. When I told him of the one I cooked it brought back memories for him. They never could eat his sage brush deer. Someone from Colorado will understand. Save your marriage or relationship and stick to the grain fields if you must have a deer. https://www.outdoorhappens.com/what-is-a-wether-goat-benefits/

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If you’re going to feed “company” venison, make sure you save some backstrap. I shot a buck about a week ago, dressed weight was 202 lbs. He was at least 5 years old. The backstraps from that buck will be every bit as delicious as they are from a young doe.

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@smsmith

That Backstrap on that buck was like shoe leather and I’m not exaggerating. There never is much back strap meat either. Once your out your out. She was the daughter of a big beef farmer.

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???
The two backstraps off the buck I shot each weighed over 7 lbs. after being trimmed of tallow and silver skin. If backstrap is like shoe leather, it was cooked incorrectly…sorry.

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My problem with deer is the texture and dryness, unless cooked quite rare. And some animals are just plain gamey or even rank. I’ve had deer in rut that weren’t gamey, go figure.

My wife asked a friend which he preferred, deer or elk. He answered “Beef”! Moose can be pretty good (sweet and mild). I don’t hunt any more because of chronic wasting and the fact that we’ve just lost our taste for it. Sold my rifle/scope. Picked up a pistol in case I get fidgety about bears (we have grizzlies moving in) or cougar or wolves, but truth is I’ve never felt menaced in the woods. Had a moose once I wasn’t too comfortable with, but he moved on.

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Any venison cooked beyond medium is overcooked IMO. Medium rare is better

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@smsmith

No some deer is just not worth eating. I’ve eaten a lot of them most are ok but someday you will understand. We would cook most in some cream of mushroom soup or whatever and it was OK low and slow. The meat on any old animal is tough and that deer was tough. I’m not an inexperienced person to living on the land. If you can eat an old deer like that one and I did your pretty tough yourself. That deer you will not enjoy one bite of. The old timers knew exactly what I meant. Have you never had a squirell that ate Osage orange seeds from the fruits? That deer ate what we call hedge apples here as a primary diet and stripped bark. Don’t hunt deer in an Osage orange forest. All the things that say wrong deer that deer had see reason #3 add in location https://www.realtree.com/deer-hunting/articles/12-reasons-why-your-venison-tastes-like-hell

Is what you call hedge the same as Osage orange and the same as bowdark? If it’s what I’m thinking of it’s very hard, burns hot and clean, and can be used to make bows. But I may be confused.

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@marknmt

Your exactly right it is the same. We call Osage orange hedge in this part of the country. So hedge apples are fruits of Osage orange. Just boil some up and that’s what that deer tasted like. Yes the wood is a Yellow or light orange burns hot enough to melt your stove if your not careful. It gets cherry red if you burn to much. Yes there are people that still come here looking for the wood to use for bows. The natives in this area knew it was the best it won’t break. We use it for fence posts which stand in the ground 100 years+. Once the wood is dry and not green there is no working with it. Dried hedge is to hard to drive a nail in. The wood grows here very easily like nowhere else.

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It´s a hobby now, though the original thought was to do farmhouse cheese as a livelihood.

I was living in DC and between jobs. Thought it was a golden opportunity to escape the city and return to rural living. My main interest was in raw milk goat cheeses, and having some measure of self-reliance.

What killed it as a formal business was a mix of things : the overwhelming, multiple layers of regulation with very little to no return. First food production, then dairy, and then top that off with raw milk – very suffocating for a one man show. Add to that the skills of accountant, salesman, mechanic, etc., etc. with just a trickle income stream, and burden of a regular job to pay the bills. I have the skills for making good cheese, but lack many of the other ones.

Despite the failure as a business – I did achieve many of some important goals: extracted myself out of the city where I was unhappy; while not exactly self-reliant – it´s a start, and I enjoy sharing the product with friends.

I tend to idealize the life my parents and especially the grandparents who eked out a life on a farm. Getting up at 4 AM to go milk in a dark, 15*F barn, then off to work at the clinic helps to temper that with a dash of reality. Still, it´s much more satisfying than urban life–for me.

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One of my work assistants was required to make a move to another location and he asked if I wanted the deer meat that he had frozen. He gave me 8-10 of what we called tenderloin. Our first cooking was less than great. The next one we added beef broth and it tasted almost like a beef roast.

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Yep. Osage will burn a bandsaw motor up. Don’t ask me how I know. :slightly_smiling_face:

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