I was actually sharing the podophyllum blossom at the beginning…
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Nice! That means the edible fruits will soon follow right?
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Podophyllum delavayi fruits do not have documented edibility. They are at this time an unknown.
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True but it’s very likely edible just like P. peltatum (with only ripe fruit pulp edible). Also they are cross compatible with the edible Podophyllum peltatum, so…
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Possibly non-toxic, yes. Best not to outright refer to them as edible at this point though since we don’t know the reasons they haven’t been traditionally consumed.
so what are we doing not testing this shit out already, like come on people 
… how long must we wait till we can try these & confirm edibility???
Surely someone has already tried eating these fruits by now?
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Because if it isn’t edible the consequences could be problematic. We already know the genus produces a substance which inhibits cell growth in animals. The last thing you want is for the lining of your stomach to stop regenerating, even if only temporarily.
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This is true! The thing that gets me is why would Podophyllum delavayi/pleianthum Complex buck the trend that fully ripe fruits are edible (not seeds or skin)? Seems like a consistent trend especially when Podophyllum hexandrum & Podophyllum peltatum work that way. + Podophyllum ×inexpectatum is a Hybrid between Podophyllum peltatum x Podophyllum pleianthum. This strongly suggests a good chance both species are edible because both are closely related enough to cross.
Sadly I have no way of trying the fully ripe fruits of Podophyllum delavayi/pleianthum Complex, I can’t find them anywhere (not wild or for sale) and I don’t know anyone growing them who can let me try them.
What’s very interesting is the seedgel around the seed looks extremely similar to Podophyllum peltatum and I’ve also heard other people on here say the fruits smell sweet like Banana with some passionfruit!
I would be extremely shocked if the fully ripe fruits of Podophyllum delavayi/pleianthum Complex turn out to be poisonous. I know all species of this genus are poisonous, except for the ripe fruits.
I wouldn’t call edibility a consistent trend in Podophyllum. American Podophyllum peltatum is well established as edible when ripe and out of the Asian Podophyllum species, the only one with confirmed edibility happens to be Podophyllum hexandrum, the species most closely related to our edible American species. There is no trend of known edibility among the more distantly related species, so there is to trend to buck.
To be clear, I have no problem with you or anyone else sampling the fruits if your heart desires. What I do have a problem with is nonchalantly referencing species as edible when they are of unknown edibility with known possible risk factors.
Fair enough, perhaps Likely edible but not 100% confirmed yet. But it is weird than a confirmed edible species (P. peltatum) is cross compatible with an unconfirmed edible species (P. pleianthum). The hybrid offspring species Podophyllum ×inexpectatum is likely also edible?
But this does make me curious, why isn’t edibility of the Asian Species of Podophyllum not well known about or documented (Maybe there is in Chinese texts)? It seems most of the interest is about the Ornamental value with little regard to the edibility aspects?
It’s not weird for related species to be able to hybridize and it’s also not weird for related species to produce different concentrations and variations of various chemicals. Take the carrot family for example: Some are nutritious and delicious while others are deadly. In between are those which produce phototoxic effects, but even that can vary between subspecies of the same species.
I think it’s a good idea to explore edibility of new species, but given that even the edible Podophyllum species have a narrow range of edibility, caution is necessary. With growing AI loops, your frequent comments assuming edibility are likely to get picked up and republished by AI as if it’s a known fact of edibility. It was always important to be cautious with edibility info, but now with machines indiscriminately rewriting information it’s even more critical to be careful what claims are made online.
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Have you gotten ahold of Podophyllum hexandrum yet? I was able to get this one recently. Aside from having documented edibility, I like that its fruits turn red when ripe as that would hopefully make them easier to notice when they are ready. Also, being the closest relative of Podophyllum peltatum, it is very likely to be capable of producing fertile hybrids. It would be fun to get the improved fruit flavor of our native species, but with brighter coloration of ripe fruit. Who knows, maybe there would even be some hybrid vigor.
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Illicium species, several are culinary - some contain poison. A warning was published years ago not to assume a species is edible just because it looked and smelled similar to a familiar cooking spice.
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True! Potato berries are a great example, most are poisonous even if some taste sweet like melons (but then cause vomiting soon). It’s possible to breed an edible potato berry but that requires lab testing for alkaloids.
Indeed! In most cases a monophyletic genus is safe like any species of the Osmorhiza genus. What’s crazy is even within the same tribe 1 genus is poisonous & the other is edible. Do you have any examples of carrot family where 1 subspecies/variety is poisonous & the other not? There might be a few so I agree anything carrot family requires due diligence (you gotta be damn sure you know what species it is)!
Interesting… wait so Ai is actually reading our comments?
Awesome! Definitely looking forward to you sharing your notes about it, how it grows, how it tastes, and everything else.
Indeed! but so are Podophyllum pleianthum cross compatible with Podophyllum peltatum as confirmed by Podophyllum ×inexpectatum March flowers bring May Apples, along with a Taxonomic headache - Juniper Level Botanic Garden.
This is the widest hybrid you can get in the Podophylleae tribe or Podophyllum genus, if this is in fact possible than every single species of Podophyllum is very likely theoretically cross compatible.
I think there certainly will be amazing fruit flavor & hybrid vigor from P. peltatum x P. hexandrum offspring. I wish you success & encourage you as much as possible to make these hybrids happen!
Indeed! That’s a very good example, Illicium is the genus you don’t want to fuck around with just to find out. Every genus works different & is a case by case. Even the edible Chinese Star anise species (Illicium verum) should not be eaten in high quantities as it’s also mildly poisonous (hence why it’s usecase is strictly as a spice/flavoring agent).
Another example is Cucurbita, different varieties are poisonous because of the bitter tasting Cucurbitacin in high concentrations. Thankfully the bitter taste is strong & obnoxious for anyone with taste buds so you can always weed out any bitter tasting fruits from your population (so the bitter trait dies out).
This aint no Rubus or Brassica genus where everything in it is edible.
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Not just the extremes of poisonous vs. edible because many plants are in between the two extremes with edibility + precautions. The example I was thinking of when writing my previous comments was phototoxicity. Many carrot family plants are well known to have phototoxic effects wherein if sap gets on the skin, it is not directly toxic, but if also exposed to sunshine afterwards, that skin can suffer severe burns and blistering. Some of these phototoxic species are still considered to be valuable edibles, and some are so phototoxic that handling them to process for edibility is just too risky to be worth while. Many plants within the genus Heracleum are phototoxic. Heracleum mantegazzianum is one which is highly phototoxic and very risky to handle. Meanwhile, other Heracleum such as Heracleum sphondylium have more manageable levels of phototoxicity which allow them to be regularly harvested (with care) as a vegetable. Even within the species Heracleum sphondylium, there are multiple subspecies which vary in phototoxicity. One subspecies in particular, Heracleum sphondylium ssp. sphondylium stood out to me in that I was able to find an obscure reference indicating that that specific subspecies is not phototoxic at all. I actually was already growing that exact subspecies, so I put it to the test and cut open a leaf petiole and rubbed it all over my arm and then sat out in the sun. Good news, it was in fact NOT phototoxic!
Interestingly, I read that naturally occurring hybrids have been found in Britain between the extremely phototoxic Heracleum mantegazzianum and the mildly phototoxic Heracleum sphondylium! I’m not sure what level of phototoxicity is present in these hybrids, but I don’t think I’d want to risk finding out.
Yes, it’s been brought up in various threads multiple times (and I’ve seen it myself) that AI is pulling from the Growing Fruit forum as a source for its write ups. Unfortunately, now at least one user is regularly posting AI generated data (including hallucinations) back to various Growing Fruit threads which is contributing to AI loops. Pretty messy stuff. Every new technology seems to produce pollution which then later needs to be dealt with. It’ll be interesting to see how humanity faces the growing junk information pollution that is now being created by AI.
Yes, it has already been proven possible to produce hybrids with more distantly related Podophyllum species, but that’s kind of a moot point for purposes of ediblity. I’m more interested in crosses between P. peltatum & P. hexandrum because both already have fruit documented to be safe for consumption when ripe.
To be clear, I do not want to discourage you or tell you that you shouldn’t be attempting to create hybrids with other species. I am only trying to convince you to avoid referring to species and hybrids as edible when their actual edibility is not yet known. Anyone who wants to knowingly consume the fruits with unknown edibility can do as they wish. I just don’t want to see any folks become accidental/non-consensual guinea pigs because they read that all Podophyllum have edible fruits.
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