The application of Surround: are you spraying only in the fruit areas, or all over the tree? If the surround covers the leaves too much is it a problem?
No, spray it all around, I aim mostly for the fruit and branches, but hitting the leaves is inevitable. I think they said it does not hurt photosynthesis and actually helped prevent sunburn on the leaves.
In order to save spray labor I include a scab/CAR control in my Surround spray tank and I need to get at least a bit on all the leaves for that control. So, I get Surround all over when I am doing that dual spray. I could save a bit of $$ on Surround by doing two separate sprays but that will take longer. It now takes me about three hours to spray my orchard which is a long stretch of time.
My current Surround coverage is not so good given all the rain, but in observing the relatively minor damage I don’t think the curc is as active when it is actively raining. It has been near-constant rain all week here. In the middle of the week I hit the areas where I have been seeing the most curc activity, and there is still a good amount of coverage there. The coverage on the internal parts of the trees is also still good. As of Saturday eve the rains will lessen and I will coat everything well then.
Scott, I was going to include powdered sulfur in my Saturday night spray for peach scab as per your low impact spray schedule. I can get by with one gallon of spray for my orchard right now, so if I sprayed the apples, pears, and plums with the Surround, Spinosad, and sulfur mixture, do you think there would be any adverse reaction?
No - I have done that exact spray many times myself! In general nearly anything can be mixed but there are exceptions with sulphur/oil, sulphur/captan, and a few others.
My sulfur has a note about not spraying on Cox Orange. I have a graft of that on one of my trees. What should I do?
The sulfur label directions are lbs per acre. Not smart enough to convert that to 3 trees. So how much per gallon?
Spinosad says max number of applications per season is 6. I’ll be doing alot more than 6 surrounds, right? So when is the Spinosad needed?
How much dish soap are you adding in the terms or drops per gallon?
If i add hort oil what is the rate there?
For the Spinosad, I don’t think I will spray more than six times. If you do need to spray more, just leave it out. I would try and space out the Spinosad in that case.
I put just a few drops of dish soap into my one gallon sprayer, except yesterday I subcontractor the job of adding soap to my four year old, who put in way too much, maybe two tablespoons before I could grab the bottle. It seemed okay when sprayed on the tree none the less.
I use Bonide sulfur which is, off the top of my head, two to three tablespoons per gallon. I’m not sure how to convert per acre either. I would just try to avoid spraying the Cox Orange the best I could. Maybe make your Surround and spinosad mixture, spray the Cox, then add the sulfur and continue on your way.
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For the amounts to add. Elemental sulphurs are all similar so something close to those listed will work.
I don’t count my spinosads, but when I look at my past logs its nearly always less than 6 without thinking about it. 4, 6, 8, something like that is good. 12 is bad.
In most conditions so-called sulphur sensitivities don’t happen, my view is it depends a lot on conditions. I just use best effort to avoid. Apricots they say never use sulphur on, it will kill the tree, etc, but I sprayed a lot of sulphur on mine and it didn’t make a lot of difference. I similarly sprayed many grapes supposedly sulphur sensitive and generally noticed nothing.
I use horticultural soap as I have a 2.5 gallon container of it (its my main control for aphids). I use around 1/2-1tsp per gallon, this is much less than the standard 3tbsp/gallon rate.
FYI, Anyone looking for the best price on surround I ordered some from Planet Natural for $52 shipped. It was $37 for a 25lb bag and $15 to ship FedEx.
How do you decide when each of these is appropriate to add to your surround? I think I read hort oil only if below 90 degrees.
Advice for first time surround user.
the mental state a person brings to the experience, like thoughts, mood and expectations. the physical and social environment. Social support networks have shown to be particularly important in the outcome of the experience.[They are able to control or guide the course of the experience, both consciously and subconsciously. Stress, fear, or a disagreeable environment, may result in an unpleasant experience Conversely, a relaxed, curious person in a warm, comfortable and safe place is more likely to have a pleasant experience.
Of course, the dose does not produce the experience. It merely acts as a key , mood at the time. — the weather, social — feelings of persons present — prevailing views as to what is real. It is for this reason that manuals or guide-books are necessary.
— Timothy Leary, : A Manual Based on the Tibetan Book of the Dead
Hort oil is good when the aphids come out. Other than that I am mainly doing sulphur. But be careful when using those two as you can’t put oil down when there is sulphur still there.
This year I am experimenting and for the first time am not using sulphur, instead I am using Regalia and alternating with a synthetic (e.g. Indar, Elevate, Eagle). I will probably be back with it next year but I want to see how much “wear” it puts on the trees. When it gets hot no leaf likes having sulphur on it a lot.
@scottsmith which sprayer do you use to disperse surround?
Random dust and/or more clay. It’s at least 95%.
I use a Solo 485. I like it because its 5 gallons (more like 5.5 to the top really) and so I don’t need as many refills compared to the usual 4-gallon backpack units.
I received my surround from Planet Natural yesterday and sprayed for the first time today. I just used a 1 gallon pump sprayer with 2.5 cups of surround along with about quarter teaspoon of dish soap. Sprayed amazingly well and I ran into no problems at all. I primarily targeted the fruit this time and was able to get two coats on everything. Next time I will try mixing in some Indar or Immunox and spray down everything. Curious how well it will work against the upcoming jap beetle onslaught.
Well . I have never used surround.
But am " curious "
Just wondered. If anyone has tried , BENTONITE . Clay
I can source this locally for ~ $ 10 per 50 lb. bag.
It is commonly used for sealing water leaks in ponds. A drilling lubricant, sealer. Etc .
I have experienced it mixed with water and blended .
Very slippery , gel like (…snots ) hard to get off tools , hands ,etc.
Thinking of trying it on say a apple after bloom.
Much cheeper than surround.
Anyone tried this ?
Or other( even native ) clay ?
Unlikely. Surround sprays easily and dries into a field of insect sized legos and broken glass.
I was wondering the same thing when I started looking into Surround. Or just straight Kaolin clay?
Scott