I ordered a very cheap set of five off Etsy. Only one has ever leafed out - surprise, surprise, so I am planning on going the sown seed route. The primary spot I want them is full sun along a creek, but I’ll do some in my woodsy area too for the diversity.
I gather that the seedling crop favors male plants, so I’m expecting to cull some in a few years so that I have a majority of fruiting bushes. I’m with you @JohannsGarden in that I want to be able to propagate from the adults so I can know what I have where, although I have no current plan of doing so for marketing. But if I share or spread them, I want to shorten the waiting-to-know game.
I also like your forethought of multiple seedlings in the same place @TrilobaTracker, to guarantee more chance of pairing/fruitset. I presume that their alleged tendency to colonize means they’ll be more tolerant of crowding than other plants.
@Professor_Porcupine It was a thread in here regarding the original flavoring for Doctor Pepper that returned this plant to my radar. As you have separated out the two functionally different spices in the fruit, do you notice any trends towards one versus the other versus the combination that might be of interest in that conversation?
Thats interesting. Do they have a delicate root system or a long tap root? Or is it more so just difficult to keep them watered enough to survive in pots?
I don’t believe they have a major taproot. It’s not keeping them happy in pots that’s the issue.
I can’t put my finger really on a “why,” it’s just that in purchasing 3 plants in pots and planting them out, then a year or 2 later trying to move them, they seemed stunted the entire time. Never took off.
Another forum member privately told me of similar issues with container grown plants.
Conversely, direct sown plants have had amazing vigor.
I’m not issuing a blanket statement here
My experience with potted SB is limited as you can see. I’m sure it can work fine but seeds are so crazy successful here that I see no real need.
Seriously? Spicebush was used to flavor the original dr. pepper?
I’ve never tried dr. pepper so I’m not missing much if it taste like spicebush?
The Red Fruit Flesh part is not Hot Spicy, it’s more flavorful, oily & Delicious!
The seed is where the heat/spicyness comes from, eating too many has the same reaction as eating too much Mustard, Ginger, Onions, Garlic, Hot Peppers.
Most people leave them unseparated because it’s less work. If you don’t want heat & willing to do the extra work of extracting each berry by hand, that can take you 2-3 hours (You’ll need to find a more efficient way of doing it for sure + the fact it’s oily means it’s also slippery making your fingers tire out quickly).
Both parts of the fruit work well together but I think it’s still too hot, I would prefer a less spicy seed or more pulp to counter the seed. I suppose if you use little then it’s okay but the red part taste better in my opinion, very good quality spice.
Do you have a link? I didn’t know red flower variations existed. I only heard of Orange Spicebush berries.
I heard (maybe it was weird fruit explorer, unless i misremember) that the berry tastes akin to grapefruit rind, or something similar, what with all the aromatic oils and such… Is that sort of accurate by all of your tastes?
Further, there are many, many Asian Lindera species.
All populations of Lindera glauca in Japan are apparently female yet they produce fruits asexually despite being a dioecious species.
It is edible and used just like benzoin from what I can see… So there is some chance perhaps that a female benzoin could produce fruit alone also. Food for thought
To weigh-in on some of the flavor discussion:
I don’t find the whole dried ripe berries to be “hot”. They are just barely peppery, in a mild pink peppercorn kind of way for me.
I primarily use them in sweet recipes like ice cream where virtually none of the pepper is evident.
As for eating them raw - like find all parts of the fruit totally unpalatable (though it’s been a while so now I’m curious to try again LOL)
You can also use unripe dried ground fruit, as one guy once told me he does. I believe he said these are very peppery.
This discussion also definitely tempts me to try drying only the ripe flesh and skin. Have never tried it though I read about this long ago.
Same here i bought 4 as well off etsy and i got 2 to push leaves and one of them still looks ok (its in a pot) the other in the ground had the leaves wilt a couple weeks ago and who knows…
I also only had 1 of 3 persimmons push leaves, though one of the remaining ones still scratches green.
Wow! That’s incredible, does anyone know what the fruit color is (Red right)?
Definetly not grapefruit rind, that shit is Bitter like earwax, super disappointing.
Spicebush is not bitter in the slightest, only the seed inside is sharp & spicy (If he’s somehow refering to that flavor as grapefruit rind bitter).
Perhaps, I was thinking of grafting a Male Branching into a Female Shrub & call it a day
Or vice versa, fix a male bush by grafting females into it.
Very interesting, perhaps your eco-type taste different from mine or we have very different taste buds. When I eat like 20 Spicebush seeds raw, i feel the burn big time like if you ate a whole Clove of Garlic or a lot of ginger raw.
Perhaps cooking it really mellows out the flavor (Which I never did cuz I’m no cook).
gosh I’d love seeds+ I got stuff to trade… whatcha need?
my uncle had to send me some from their place as I’ve never seen it growing out here, they might get to live at the edge of the shade line where the pawpaws grow just so they stay damp enough. they’d get a little sun but not the full day blast
from my memory and what my uncle sends I think the seed is spicy young then mellows out over time and ripeness. I dry and grind young seeds for zing, and use the mature seeds as a baking/sweet spice like cinnamon or nutmeg etc
I never liked the fruit itself, not enough meat for me on that bone. but the young leaves were always a trail snack
@TrilobaTracker Oh wow, I like how tightly clustered your berries are getting (Which cultivar is this?).
Have you tried eating the green berries as a Breath Fresher? I often do when I see some, very enjoyable especially after a big meal.
Are you also considering just taking out the one with the virus (I never seen that on my Local Spicebush)?
hmm… interesting. I wonder where I can find the orange fruited forms like this ( Lindera benzoin forma xanthocarpum). I also wonder crossing these with Red Flowered forms creates… what? Cool plant!?
Young like when the berries are green? In june they make excellent Breath Fresheners kind of like mint. Legit feel they can be domesticated for this purpose as well.
I see, I don’t cook so I wouldn’t know how nicely the flavor mellows out. Eating lots of the seeds raw is too spicy, 1-4 seeds raw is usually good enough for my spicy kick. I mostly eat the red flesh & spit out the seed in strategic areas.
@resonanteye Fantastic, I love trading seeds. I like seeds from Edible Plants, especially those that taste good (Wild Edibles, Tree Crops or Garden Veggies).
I have beach plum and sand cherry; let’s take it to messages, so we can figure out if you want seed or scion and how I can send things! I also have pineapple mint and a few others on your list, but for seeds we have to wait until they’re ready to collect
These are random wild seedlings from the Cumberland plateau in Franklin County, TN.
I’ve never munched a raw green fruit - may have to try that.
I suppose if might be wise to remove the infected plants to prevent spread to my other planting. I haven’t considered it up to this point. However, since these are seedlings from “Luckys Gold” I should save and plant the seeds to see if any come up with yellow fruit. (Though perhaps the virus is passed in seeds …)
I’d like to make a request for fresh seed once everyone whose got an abundance starts seeing ripe fruit.
I’d like heavy fruiting varieties, preferably.
I’m sure I’m not alone.
Willing to pay postage, a price or who knows, perhaps I have something you’re interested in. I don’t know if there is a way for this to also be cross posted in the trading forum.
How are the peeled sticks as skewers on things like shisk-ka-bob? I remember the first time I used rosemary stems and how wonderful it was.
Does anyone know the germination rate of fresh seed?
I can save you a bunch, fresh seed but just keep in mind they will go rancid fast if stored with minimal air circulation. I’ve lost a Batch once by giving them 2 months to dry (It still wasn’t enough due to the oil). I’ve learn it takes about 4-6 months to fully dry enough to be store in plastic ziplock bags without rotting/molding.
That being said, As far as I know fresh seed isn’t required for germination. Seeds dry fine & should re-hydrate fine too. I sowed some dried seeds in a pot & forgot about it, some germinated in Late May.
I’d happily trade with you, I’m sure you’ve got soem seeds I’d love to get. I pretty much like all kinds of good Edible Plants (Tree Crops, Garden Veggies, Fruits/Berries, Wild Edibles, ect).
I have never tried this nor did I know you can do it with Rosemarry??? Soo… how do you exaxtly eat a grilled Rosemary Stick (How do you peel it too)?
Stems when the flowers open are used in teas altho I never tried it.
I’ve never documented fresh seed germination, I just spit out seeds when I eat the berries to strategic spots I think they can grow. I’m sure some have germinated already.
