Apple rootstock diameters 1/4",3/8",7/16" Which is better?

Has anyone used larger diameter rootstocks 3/8" and up? I have always used 1/4" and I was wondering if you get better 1st year growth with the larger rootstocks.

-mroot

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IME, once you get into 3/8" plus rootstocks W/T gets more difficult. If you like cleft grafts, then the larger the rootstock caliper the better IMO.

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I’d recommend you stay with 1/4".

I bought 5/8" pear and the majority of scions I was able to come up with either from the USDA or members didn’t go much larger than 1/4" and grafting became more work and I had to do a modified cleft 10 of 10 times.

The root-systems are also much-much larger on something like 5/8ths in fact they’re huge and have to be stuffed into 14" x 4" wide Treepots after they’ve been pruned… so a lot to think about if you’re going in a certain direction. Personally I’d stay with 1/4" and use Stuewe’s 14 x 2.7" Deepot for all rootstock needs.

I built this from Chain link fence and ripped landscape timbers if you need to hold a lot of them or they sell holders for them, too. I beefed it up more after this photo was taken:

Dax

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The primary advantage of smaller rootstock is that grafting is easier and can be done with different methods. Apple and Pear generally work best in the 1/4 to 3/8 inch range. Pecan and other hard to graft species generally work better with slightly larger rootstock, mostly because scionwood 3/8 to 5/8 inch diameter tends to be better matured than smaller stock. For example, whip grafts with pecan in the 3/8 to 5/8 inch caliper for rootstock and scions of similar size tend to give more takes than smaller rootstocks and scions.

I’ve had much better results when the root system was relatively large compared to the caliper of the stem. I have seen and tried to graft rootstocks that had large stem diameter but very few roots. This almost always results in a slow growing tree and/or graft failure. For this reason, I suggest focusing more on the root system than caliper.

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Yep, and I’m trying to preach all the time to pot up your rootstocks a year in advance no matter what it is and/or establish them in-ground & then graft. I’m going to have awesome persimmons to graft on this coming winter thru Spring that are well-rooted in 14" x 2.7" Stuewe Deepots. That size Deepot also lays flat and at the right height for my Hot Callus Pipe DIY I lay on my concrete basement floor in complete darkness.

If you’re going to graft nut trees in the 1/4" range, a hot callus pipe will make all the difference in the world.

Hot callus pipes were designed for denser wood tree species which will always take more time to callus than softer wooded trees/shrubs. oak, & hazels are common hardwoods done on callusing benches. Certainly all nut trees, included…

I was enlightened that folks in the south (Texas anyways) don’t have basements due to high water tables, and therefore wouldn’t be able to use hot callus devices. I think you guys surely could use them if you kept it off the ground such as on a work bench in your garage & even if you have to construct a temporary frame to keep the inside area dark during callus.

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Hi Dax! Thanks for linking your Hot Callus Pipe DIY. It’s a great post, and I’m planning to try it this summer with apricot if I can pull off air-layering a Marianna shoot. I was just getting ready to start searching for it.

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Be prepared for overwhelming success, Mark!

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Thanks for the input-guys.

-mroot

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Dax, in your opinion, is the depth or volume of the pot more important? I’m considering using either the deepots or the 3"x8" or 4"x9.5" treepots for persimmon, peach, and quince rootstocks. I’m hoping to graft on to them this spring for planting out in fall or the following spring.

Having them stand up on their own is something you may need to consider. Otherwise, 14" is the right choice. You can always clip the roots back and the tree to balance one another, also.

The correct answer is depth every time. If all you need to do is build a square or rectangle from recycled materials to hold up a 14" tall Treepot or Deepot, that’s what you should do. I know you’re not grafting a lot of trees so that’s my recommendation.

Dax

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Generally agree with Dax but note that the longer a tree has to be in a container the larger the container should be. Also, I’ve tried 10 inch, 14 inch, and 16 inch deep pots for pecans and found that the 16 inch work far better. This is only for pecans, species that do not produce a huge tap root would obviously have different requirements.

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Thanks for the good advice, as always. I do have a hard time envisioning the rootstocks fitting into a2.5" diameter pot, but I’ll have to trust your experience on that one. Sounds like it’s probably the Deepots for me.

You’ll get a sapling with a not very fibrous root on most occasions, that is unless you fork out the money for plugs from Mossy Oak for example. Either way it’s still the right pot for the trees you will be getting from State Nurseries as bareroot seedlings. You might need to give the roots a 2" haircut but come Fall that haircut will have produces points for fibrous roots to grow. Here are 80 persimmon from Kansas State Nursery I potted Spring of 2019 and now going thru winter in my greenhouse that I heat a few degrees above freezing.

To the right of the persimmons are 10" tall mini-treepots which is easy to see the 4" difference. I grew Kanza nuts in those as well as the Deepots to the right of them. There wasn’t any difference in pecan seedling size, however, the extra 4" is necessary every time you’re buying bareroot seedlings. 14" is the minimum you should have.

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Ah, root pruning! You’d think I’d have thought of that, but apparently not. I like your setup. it looks much easier to keep them upright than I’d been thinking. I was thinking about the official Deepot stand, but the one available at Greenhouse Megastore isn’t listed as suitable for the 14" pots by the manufacturer. Maybe I’ll order double the pots and jerry rig a corral out of cinder blocks instead.

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I like the 4 x 14 tree pots for growing nursery stock .
They will not stand up by their self is one of their faults .
Things I have done to get them to stand up ;
Duct tape 4 together
Put several in larger pots
Milk crates hold 9 , and can be moved
Build wooden frames ,of various sizes.

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So many possibilities! I guess I had my buying goggles on and not my thinking cap.

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@Hillbillyhort @jcguarneri

I use 14 x 4 Treepots for Walnuts, Pecans, Hickory, oaks, and any larger trees that I know are going to be large when shipped. I also use them to shift a 14" x 2.7" deepot if necessary… I will give the deepot a haircut and up-shift it to the 14 x 4 for another 1/2 season’s growth or however long it will be happy enough in the larger Treepot vs. the Deepot.

Good luck fellas.

Sincerely,

Dax

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Hi Dax,

Where did you buy the white deepot?

Try drain pipe cut down. Black corrugated cut to length works too.

Stuewe carries a wide range of pots. https://www.stuewe.com/