Blackberries, Raspberries and Hybrids

Hi all,
I love reading about all of your berry experiences and many of you have given me great advice and info in this forum over the last few years.

I’m looking for suggestions on a third blackberry variety to grow. I currently have PAF and Ponca. I’d love a suggestion that is not from U of A. I don’t mind thorns but prefer erect canes. What is good but different than what I already have? I used to have Triple Crown but I did not love the flavor and it was way too vigorous for my small garden.

Hmm thats a tough one. As far as whats available to purchase… i would say Ebony King or Rosborough… or you can wait until next year i think the USDA in Oregon may release a primocane blackberry called Thunderhead.

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adding Brison on top of @krismoriah 's reccomendations

you can get Brison from womack nursery
you can get Rosborough from ebay from one seller, or womack nursery or bob wills / sorelle farms but they never have it in stock
you can get Ebony King at Walmart/Lowes in February


also on Amazon… at least its listed there… no clue if its true to name etc.

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the raspberries are not liking the Texas heat
kind of knew this was coming but still wanted to see what would happen

the ones worst affected appear to be Fall Gold, Red Heritage, and Double Gold. The Jewel isn’t very happy either but it’s not as bad

Thanks @krismoriah and @PcChip for suggestions.

If I were open to trailing varieties would you have additional suggestions?

for trailing: obsidian, marion, maybe olympic if you can find it. @krismoriah will probably recommend newberry as well

also, for another erect variety, consider Triple Crown. I always read that everyone that grows it thinks it tastes amazing - plus it’s thornless. It does ripen later than most varieties though

That’s really tight depth-of-field. Was this taken with a smartphone or a real camera?

I stopped in Lowe’s today and found Columbia Star plants for $15. Decided to try it out.

@Drew51, I see from prior posts that you’ve been growing it for many years but back in 2016 you were disappointed with it. How do you feel about it these days?

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I might have short changed it. I should have let it grow a few years. So many plants improve with age.

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I see you are in 6B - do you think Newberry would handle 6A, or should I find a different thorny blackberry? I’d like to try Newberry, but where do you get plants?

I got Newberry and “Victory” from @krismoriah


hmm i may be in Z7 now. But I can say that i probably have every blackberry that you can imagine as well as hybrid and rasp… and out of all of them the only one that didnt fruit was Phenomenal and it gave me about 5 berries. There could be a polar vortex or anything that could change it totally next year… so to be honest i have no idea… theres elevation and frost pockets and all kinds of stuff to consider before ruling this or that out i think… i dont trust zones myself.

Having said that… i think Ollalie is worth a try… if it doesnt work then likely none of the trailing ones will. Ive been snacking on them and they are sweet and tart both… at least my crops are. Very tasty… and i can imagine make a great pie or jam.

Ive been tasting my floricane crop of PA Horizon and i think its wonderful. Its thorny but sparse thorns. Sweet and full of flavor with very little tartness. at least mine are.

I might get a primocane crop of Black Magic… we will see.

Having said all that… Kiowa is hard to beat if you are wanting thorns… easy to trellis bc its erect. Nice big berries that some say are the healthiest.

While it may do well in someones Z5 it may not do well in another’s Z6…etc etc.


I might give Ollalie a try, since a local farm has it growing and I’ve heard about it here a couple times.

@krismoriah Will you at some point have some extra rooted tips or cuttings from Victory and Newberry? It could be fun to try those out. From what you’ve posted before on Victory, it looks like a monster!

Would you also know of any source wyeberry? or potentially dissuade me if it’s not completely worth it.

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Can anyone growing Royalty clue me in? I was at my local garden center recently and saw a plant labeled as such. Was clearly some sort of Rubus but boy oh boy, was it thorny…big spiky thorns as well as fine fuzzy ones everywhere…even had thorns on the leaves. Made me wonder if it was a case of wineberry being sold as something else—or maybe that’s just how Royalty looks?! Enlighten me, please!

i have tried to get rid of the Newberry that i have and really not many takers. I think i have 40 or so plants left.

Same on Victory… only a few folks were even interested… i had 30 or sum plants…i think maybe 5 plants are out in the world. I may have 5 or so viable plants left.

Yeah Victory is a monster… i really thought at some point it was some kind of mutation of Triple Crown but its not. This year is its first year of full maturity and its beyond productive. Its erect… which is unlike Triple Crown… Canes are the size of baseball bat handles. Its a freezer filler for sure.

Wyeberry- Honestly ive been asking Drew for probably 4 years or so now… i hit dead ends on every lead i had. Just by pure luck a few years ago Boston Mtn Nursery sent me some and they didnt even know if they were Wyeberries. I had a long lengthy talk with Gary Pense Sr and he may have sent me some from his collection. But he did tell me that he sold some to some local u-picks but other than that nobody wanted them…so it was a waste of space for them. I think like Drew said its a more hardy Boysenberry… other than that its a novelty. I will propagate it out…it looks like i have two plants and they are honestly more vigorous than my Boysens and Rudys Original Boysens… at least here they are.

So heres my honest take thus far… and im not factoring in anyones growing zones or anything… just my take.

Siskiyou- is wonderful. Its a big berry that is just loaded with flavor. Truly amazing taste.

Kotata- Smaller berries about half the size of Siskiyou… but wow are they packed with flavor. The thorns are nasty nasty… and you cant even get near the canes without welding gloves.

Newberry- Very Large Berries that are packed with blackberry and raspberry flavor… mine are super sweet and tasty. Super vigorous canes that are a real chore to deal with.

Victory- Such a nice plant that amazes me. The wow factor on pumping out berries and they are very tasty… probably in the Navaho range of taste for me… maybe a bit more complex. Everything about it just wants to go… its like a berry plant with super powers. Im not doing it justice trust me. Pruning time- its a real chore. I am not even sure i could get the ‘spent canes’ out in July/August…

I have Victory’s cousin going now…its also thornless and i have high hopes for it. Several of the other Euro ones are flops to me… not worth talking about.

Tay and Logan or Boysen arent really worth growing if you have Newberry…that is just my honest opinion.

No other trailing so far are worth fooling with if you have Kotata and Siskiyou.

I think all of the Prime Arks are worth growing for their Fcane crop… due to them all being early and very productive and nice sized berries. Flavor is pretty good…

Purple Rasps- arent worth growing if you have Newberry…

All of that hinges on if you can grow them in your climate… and are willing to risk losing the whole crop due to a very cold winter etc… if so then its handy to have those ‘not worth growing’… just in case.

Taste is subjective and i try to be honest. I dont grow my things to take pictures or boast. If so i would load the water to everything and trade taste for likes. The sizes of my berries should reflect a water deficit unless otherwise noted. I do not water during fruiting and hope that it doesnt rain… as i want taste over likes.

This past year i was blessed with a fairly mild winter which allowed me to have just about everthing fruit… next year i may not be so lucky…as i am somewhat pushing zones or whatever they call them on alot of these things.


If you have any pictures of the canes I’d love to see them. That’s wild!

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Scored a healthy large flowering Black Satin plant at Lowes this evening for $7 before tax. Honestly not sure why it was on clearance.


Had my first real batch of loganberries today in Portland Oregon - pictures sorry we are then too fast. All members of my household agreed that they are very tasty and worthy of keeping. They were not tart but rather tasted like raspberries with pineapple or fruit punch hints. Very juicy and the plant is healthy living in the shade of a plum tree, fence and my house. I am impressed and want more. They ripen well before the summer drought and hear here and also before fruit flies ravage other blackberries in August and September.

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im not the best at pictures… my ol trusty quarter is my unit of measure most times.