I don’t know where you are but where I am, central MA, most damages on my apples are from coddling moths. Damages on peaches are both coddling moths and Oriental Fruit moths. I don’t worry much about apple maggot flies.
I do not know when your new lures will arrive and I don’t know how many lures you will need for all your trees. If I were you, I would spray Surround about now since you said you peach are about at shuck split. Two years ago, I sprayed too late, most peaches were damaged. These moths work very quick and attack fruitlets when they are quite small.
I started spraying Surround last year. It’s fine clay. It’s safe. I ate a few peaches that had traces of Surround. I don’t worry about it. I could peel it but I was too lazy.
I’ve used footsies soaked in Surround, too. Again, my timing was a bit late that year. Also, after I get more fruit, putting footsies on them is tedious and time-consuming. To me, It’s good for up to a couple hundred fruit, Beyond that, spraying is a lot easier and quickly for protection.
Timing is everything. You can have all the lures and spray but if you don’t get the timing right, it won’t work.
Mamuang, I am in PA. According to the info from traps I need 2 lures. It maybe too late but I cant get it any sooner as explained, I know that Surround is safe, thanks you and everyone :) I intend to get Surround. The feedstore do not stock so it will be next wk at the very earliest before i can get it. The smallest amt they can order s 25lbs
Of course you may ask why will I probably never use Surround?
Because I have no issue (within reason) with the use of organophosphates which I feel confident is a more efficient and more effective solution. I do think however that Surround is probably your best bet in a truly workable organic solution.
May I ask you why you are so seemingly opposed to spraying insecticides? If it’s just the wildlife etc, may I ask, Do you make similar choices when choosing the type of car you drive, your home heating system, electrical consumption and just consumption in general?
I do, and applaud your desire to not injure any animals or the environment. I FULLY get that and as a person often referred to as a “tree hugger” I’m in your camp. Thing is, I choose very, very carefully what I use and how…everything has an environmental price…everything. Insecticides used on home grown fruits and veggies just so happen to comprise a very, very tiny segment (actually so small as to be basically irrelevant) of the environmental issues facing America today.
Point is, you’d do a exponentially greater service to wildlife and the environment in general by choosing a fuel efficient vehicle and spraying the insecticides than you ever would driving a Suburban and spraying Kaolin clay.
That’s just a simplified analogy. Does that make sense?
As far as Surround being safe, I’m certainly not the final word or an expert, but I’d say yes it is very safe. I remember reading about people eating it for treating diarrhea. I wouldn’t recommend eating it of course, but I’m fairly sure it’s harmless.
Remember too, fungicides are as important and maybe even moreso to us mid-Atlantic growers. You’ll find organic control in this arena to be equally, and likely more challenging.
You’ll be buying some sulfur…as to me, it’s fungicides moral equivalent of Surround.
That feed store at your place will have it on the shelf. Get the micronized stuff…the Bonide stuff works great and is as cheap as any of it. Price has went up…about $3 a pound for the smaller quantities. 4lb. will go a long way.
Oh…BTW, I looked a bit and your feed store it seems is offering you a good price on the Surround.
Of course you may ask. What I do is a personal choice/decision…by no means am I a “tree hugger”. I do realise that what we do not even make a dent on the environment. I think there is alot of hype about “globe warming” hence the name change to “climate change” with all the snow storms we have of late. I can go but I won’t as this forum is not for that.
For me the point of trying to grow one’s own veggies and fruits is so that I have control over what substance I use, if I use chemicals, I might as well just buy from the store. Though I admit that that what I grow is not self sufficient due to lack of space for growing
On the point of not wanting to injure animals, well the squirrels where we live have charmed their way into our hearts…other wildlife too! I do love wildlife, they are all God’s creatures… So I need to make sure that the product is safe or it would be like poisoning a friend, furry one that is. No, I have not gone completely mad, I can still distinguish between humans and wildlife. Not mad enough to be taken away by men in white coats. Also, common sense tells me if it is safe for wildlife then it is safe for humans!
We do choose fuel efficient car and heating systems because it makes $$$ sense.
ps: still trying to learn about organic gardening from all
Thanks for giving me the heads up on the price! I saw an online vendor selling 25lbs of Surround for $65 then there is shipping too! Only thing is 25lbs seems alot! I have to look into some of the fungicide you mention too. Everything has gone up in price !
Caught a moth in the codling moth trap. Anyone knows what type it is? Is it a codling moth? thanks. Sorry I can get a large picture. Zoom feature on my camera is going kaput
I’d guess it is a coddling moth. They first emerge during full bloom of red delicious which would be about right for your location I guess. It’s lost all it’s wing powder etc, but the long “whisker” seen in the photo makes me think it could be a coddling moth. The overall shape looks about right.
Well, that and the fact that you caught it in a coddling moth trap.
Thanks! I was looked online and the codling moth didn’t look like one caught in the trap. Like you said, it has lost it’s wing powder, so maybe that is why?
The apple tree I have in bloom is Jonagold and I can’t remember what the other one is. Both have lots of blossoms. A few buds in ??Honeycrisp (lost label) Suncrisp and Scarlett Sentinel. The rest have none due to insufficient sun
I have 2 traps. will try to remember to check the one hanging on the peach, tomorrow
Jonathan blooms at the same time as Red Delicious so I guess that puts the time about right if we assume an early emerging adult. You’ll likely catch more of the same thing and maybe future ones will be in better shape for a more positive id.
Very much the right shape/size, but lacking the mottled appearance I’m familiar with. My guess is that it’s a CM, perhaps a little atypical and beat up. Sometimes the details get muddled but the outcomes are the same. So treat as codling moth would be my recommendation.
It doesn’t look like the standard CM to me, based on the pattern on the wings. But its hard to say for sure.
Appleseed, Re: chemicals there are many reasons to not use various chemicals. I have small kids playing only a few feet from my trees and I would never think about spraying any bug poisons on them. Similarly for poisons on grass, etc. The problem with bug killers is we are evolutionarily close enough to bugs that its hard to slam them dead and at the same time not have any effect on us (or pets, bees, birds, etc). Diseases are much further genetically and so there is relatively less of a risk from chemicals targeting diseases (but there can be some, particularly with the runoff).
Thanks Scottfsmith. 5/6 yrs ago a rehabber friend in in Bloomington Indiana that told me that they have wild rabbits coming in with tumours and she thinks it is due to lawn chemicals. a few wks ago I heard on the news that that was some research that shows a correlation between cancer and roundup weed killer. Of course the mfr denied it. The chemicals will not kill you outright because of the ratio of chemicals to our body size.If you were to drink the bottle, I guarantee the person who drank it would not be alive to find out if it affected them. It is the accumulative effect I think that can cause all kinds of diseases.
For a long time now I hand weed cos I do not want the chemicals to leach into streams and such… Dandelions are easy enough to kill with a teaspoon of salt in the middle of the rosettes!
@Appleseed70@marknmt thanks for your input. If I catch another I will post another pic.
Question for those of you who use Surround. I have various kaolin I use as soap additive. Can I use this to spray my trees. If I can, what do I do? Thanks in advance!
I realize that Scott, that’s why I asked. He had not mentioned any of those things you mention, just about animals. To my point though there are also many other things dangerous to one’s health, and the health of others, which people do not avoid with such tenacity as pesticides. There are also many, many things worse for the environment and our animal friends. Of course that does not diminish the attention we should pay to insecticide use. It just needs to be kept in perspective.
I consider myself quite well educated on environmental issues. I see Americans all the time placing extreme importance on things of little significance while glossing over issues of dire importance. Was just making sure that was not what was going on here. It seems it was not.
What makes your neighbor think it is from lawn chemicals? How does she know they are tumours?
The issue with glyphosphate is an old one and there is little for the manufacturer to deny. I do seem to remember that the issue was not with the glyphosphate itself, but rather one of the carrier ingrediends that posed the most risk.
I too wonder about it, as it is used like water everywhere it seems. If it wasn’t used in such vast quantities, I doubt there would be any risk, but it truly is everywhere.
Not my neigbour but a friend who is a wild life rehabber in IN (I am in PA). They have rabbits coming in with tumours all over them (wild life vet made the diagnosis) As we know rabbits, grace, and they have many around that area use lawn services and they use a lot of lawn chemicals to give you the "lush green lawn). Then a couples of wks ago, I heard on the news that Round Up can cause cancer too.
FYI, sometimes what looks like tumours on wildlife are not tumours but rather wobbles caused by the Botfly larvae. They are the most vile disgusting beasties and if you accidentally kill them in the process of removal, they release toxin and can kill the hosts (depending on size of host)
One reason I ask is that I have seen local fruit clubs sell small amounts of the kaolin clay to members. I have heard that once a bag is broken, it can’t be still called Surround ( but is same stuff). I wouldn’t use the soap you mentioned earlier. You should mix things like oil with it either as it is the powder that bothers the insects. If you ever try using the sulfur that was previously recommended, be sure to research it extensively before you use it.
Carole
I intend to get Surround. The feedstore do not stock so it will be next wk at the very earliest before i can get it. The smallest amt they can order s 25lbs
