Commercial Sprayers?

General Fruit Growing
#44

Nope. That would be an illegal application. Instead, the nozzles and pressure are adjusted to produce droplets that will not drift.

Nope again. Commercial pesticides are very concentrated and the dosage is per acre, not per gallon. The applicator will calibrate their spray by first making a trial run a few days prior, spraying only water. From that, the quantity of water per acre or total acreage is discovered. For the actual spray, the tank is loaded with the proper amount of water and the dosage for the amount of acreage.

As you probably noticed, these sprayers are tractor pulled or truck mounted. You need a pesticide applicators license to legally operate them and dispense non-retail pesticides.

Another option for you is to contract with an agricultural spray firm (not structural pesticide). These folks have all the equipment, permits, and pesticides. They will help you get a permit to have the pesticides applied at your site.

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#45

We do everything possible to try to reduce drift on our airblast sprayer but when the pressure is 150 psi or higher some drift is going to occur. Spraying when the wind is very low perhaps less than 2 MPH helps and adjusting the deflectors to force the spray where it needs to go helps too. We sometimes spray at night in order to take advantage of the low wind conditions.

Some large growers have very modern sprayers with electronics that will automatically adjust the nozzle flow and pressure depending on the crop and conditions. Electrostatic sprayers that charge the spray particles in a way that they are attracted to the trees are available too. I have seen this type of sprayer used on grapes and understand they are pretty common on Almonds too. I noticed almost no overspray when the vineyard next to me sprays with his European electrostatic sprayer.

I have an applicators license but none is required for my state when using an Air Blast sprayer with materials that are not restricted use. Not sure about other places.

We have a 50 gallon AB and adjust our nozzles and pressure in order to spray 50 gallons per acre on both Apples and Peaches in order to simplify chemical measurements.

Lots of useful info on the sprayers101 site

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#46

Hi Andy! Boy can I feel your pain. I have about 140 trees these days I dread spray days like you wouldn’t believe. I cannot imagine 350, let alone 579!!!

I wish I could be of more help, but I never bought any kind of air assisted sprayer. I did buy a new electric sprayer but its just a slightly larger version of the same kind I was using and is probably like what you said you are using. I did figure out a way to mount it onto my tractor and got a super-long hose. So, I now am able to just sit on my tractor, and drive through the orchard and pray all my trees one at a time. I get it done but it takes about 4-5 hours (which corelates almost perfectly to yours taking about 1.5 days for 350 trees. I’m still not happy with my system and would still love to upgrade, so by all means, keep me/us posted with whatever you decide to do.

BTW…I couldn’t help but chuckle when you mentioned your gator being covered when you finished. My tractor not only gets sticky with a thick coat of sticker, but then the spray itself dries (Imidan) and the whole tractor is absolutely white. Not just a thin shade of white, but rather its so thick that it looks like my blue tractor is a white one. YIKES! I can just hear our organic friends on here screaming and I get it, because I get covered with the same layer of sticky poison!!! (I do wear a jumpsuit, mask, cap, gloves most of the time, but of course that isn’t close to being foolproof)

@blueberrythrill That is an AWESOME resource, Rick. Thanks for that. I just scanned it for now (at work!) but will absolutely be fully reading all that later with more time and detail

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#47

5 hours is a lot of time behind a spray wand!

One of the best things I ever purchased was a powered pesticide helmet. It never fogs up and it keeps the spray out of my face when the wind shifts. A Tyvek suit and a pesticide helmet is a great combination. I hate to spray chemicals but in my area no chemicals means no fruit.

For comparison purposes I spray about 800 apple trees or 1 acre in just about 1 hour with my Air Blast. Takes a little less time to spray an acre of peaches. Don’t see many used AB sprayers like the John Bean model that Olpea posted for $1800.

I

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#48

I thought we were friends, but now that you rubbed in that bit about you spraying 800 trees in an hour, I don’t think I can talk to you anymore! hahaha Just kidding, of course. But that really is amazing!!!

I do use a tyvek suit…that is the coveralls I mentioned wearing. I probably should look into a pesticide helmet. @mamuang uses one and has encouraged me to do so. I’m sure I’d use it on most days but I’m thinking on those 95 degree, humid days I might not!

#49

Can you post a photo or better, a link for the one you have? Price?

I see a lot of different designs at different price points.

#50

We had to make spraying which is a task we hated into something we could tolerate.

It cost a bundle of money but a couple acres of fruit is worth a lot more.

Added electric valves to the AB too so we can turn the spray off or on for either side from a toggle switch at the tractor seat. Helps to save chemicals and overspray where we are missing a tree in a row and at the end of each row.

We used a standard full face mask before the pesticide helmet. The mask was hot and tended to fog up so we could not see where we were going. The helmet removes the requirement for a respirator “fit test.” Not sure if the fit test is a OSHA or a state requirement but its active when any label requires the use of a respirator when loading or spraying. I learned about the requirement when the pesticide inspector showed up to check my spray records.

The helmet is made by Kasco. It was reasonable when we bought it a few years ago

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#51

I know this is an old thread, wondering how you did this. I have rigged up a thing but mine kind of sucks. It’s basically that I added a long vinyl tube between the wand and the trigger. I then stuck the spray wand on a long piece of PVC. Unfortunately, I have to lower and raise the wand, because some of my trees are 25-30’ tall which makes it extra tedious. I have around 60 trees and it’s pretty painful.

I do wear tyvek coveralls with booties and hood, gloves, and full facemask respirator. None of which I find too uncomfortable. The part I hate is just how long/hard it is to spray each tree this way.

#52

Oh I feel your pain…I hate spraying more and more every year.

So I do mine 2 ways, neither of which really makes it easy. But first, what you need to know is that I’m not talking about any kind of stationary hose set up, which it sounds like you may be trying to do. Certainly there are some sprayers that have a boom attached and the boom can be stood up. But everyone I’ve talked to say that method doesn’t spray upwards much at all. I just use the $250 tractor Supply 25 gallon tank with an electric pump and a hand held hose.

WHen I say 2 ways, I only mean I have mounted my tank two ways. My favorite way is to actually set my tank (25 gallon) on top of my pull-behind finishing mower, and I use those elastic motorcycle straps to tie it securely onto the top of the mower. Of course I disengage the blade on the mower when doing this. I then just bought a 20 foot long hose - the regular, black rubber kind that comes with a sprayer and tank. Then I can sit on my tractor, hold the wand, and make a circle around the tree very slowly- spraying from top to bottom as I go around. Its the best way I’ve found, but its not great and a far cry from a ag air sprayer where you just drive up a row of trees and it fogs them. Those cost over $5k so I can’t justify it.

The only other difference is I sometimes mount the tank on back of my tractor without the mower attached, but it takes a long time to attach it this way since there is no good, solid deck to sit it on.

#53

I’m not sure if what I’m trying for qualifies as a “stationary hose setup”. I just need to be able to spray a tree which is 30’ tall. Will the TSC sprayer you have spray that high?

In order to spray these tall trees I have attached the wand to a long hose and I have a long piece of PVC. I then can hold the “wand” up at like 20-25’ to spray, as if I was standing on a big ladder.
However, this is very cumbersome.

I am nervous with something like this: https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/fimco-25-gal-pro-series-spot-sprayer
that when it says it sprays 25’ vertically it means that It will put out a tiny narrow stream that reaches 25’ and I won’t really be able to spray a tree with it. I don’t mind if it is a bit tedious - as long as it’s possible.

#54

I’ve been able to spray some wild crabs around the house by standing in the back of the Gator with the sprayer. This gives me enough height to reach the top of these large trees. You do have to narrow down the spray pattern / stream, but you can still get a bit of spread on the spray pattern at the end of it’s reach. That was with a pitiful 15 gal sprayer with a 1 GPM electric motor. This year I’m using a 40 gal sprayer with an electric 2.4 GPM motor and 60 psi. These are Countyline (Tractor Supply) and they appear to be re-badged Fimco’s.

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#55

Sorry its been a week since I checked in. I use the exact sprayer @AndySmith just described (2.4 GPM, and 60 psi. And yes, just like andy said, I can reach the height you are talking about (30 feet) and more with it. Again, as Andy said, you do have to narrow the stream a bit to get really high, but not to the point you are thinking of in your post. It still delivers a good stream of spray even at 35 feet. You have to sort of move it around more to get good coverage (meaning it doesn’t just spray a big mist or wide shot) but it doesn’t take long to cover tops of a tall tree.

On the downside, though (there is always a downside!) when you shoot a stream (even a fairly thin one like we are describing) it uses your spray in much higher volumes and empties your tank much faster than if you choke the spray down in a mist/wide umbrella pattern.

Good luck!

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#56
  • have the same tractor supply sprayer and 15 feet is really pushing it.
#57

Thanks @thecityman & @AndySmith! I did end up getting this FIMCO sprayer from TSC:
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/fimco-25-gal-pro-series-spot-sprayer?cm_vc=-10005 (It is 25 gal sprayer that’s driven with 12V battery, has 2.4gpm pump and a spray gun instead of a wand.) It did work fine for my tall trees - I started at the top with spraying so excess kind of dripped down. The biggest problem I had was not accidently blasting off fruit/blossoms.

It is a huge improvement to what I was doing before. I have ~65 standard size trees that are full grown (and overgrown in some cases!) and I was able to spray in about 4 hours (but I am new to all this, so I’m sure that will get shorter). I also got way less on me and my stuff with this sprayer. Before, I was really struggling to even get coverage on the trees. I don’t have a gator, but I hooked a cart to my zero turn mower and put this in the cart.

I will say I sprayed at a time when there was very, very little wind. When there was zero wind it was actually kind of a problem because I’d just kind of end up in a cloud of spray. When there was a tiny bit of wind it was better because I knew which way it was going and I could stand upwind of where I wanted the spray to go.

I read the this and other threads and know the caveats about making sure to put -20F wiper fluid or RV antifreeze through the sprayer before winter (my manual actually did say to do this) and about cleaning the sprayer after using it.

The manual suggested for cleaning: filling the tank half full of water spraying that out, then putting some more water for a rinse. I read people are adding dish soap, should I do that?

What are people doing when they clean the tank? Do they spray that somewhere specific? just in the grass? do you pour out the cleaning water somewhere specific? There are still diluted chemicals in there so I hesitate to just dump it out wherever.

I’d be curious to know what people get told to do when they are taking the special pesticide use classes - where to put wash water.

#58

That would be telling.

Suffice it to say, I use the powdered Tractor Supply tank detergent concentrate rather than any household cleansers. A little goes a long way and preserves the “rubber parts” in the sprayer pump.

As far as effluent goes … well, there is some, and the compost pile is nearby. That’s all I say.

#59

I looked up my own question about certified people should do with the rinse water. The “National Pesticide Applicator Certification Core Manual” says you should either spray it on something where it is on label, use it as a diluent for future pesticide mixture, or dispose of it according to the label as if it was the concentrate.

#60

Can you lower the height of your trees, or hire it done? 60 trees sounds like a huge orchard to me. How will you pick the fruit or thin the fruit or scout in the tops for blight, etc?

#61

I’m surprised your sprayer will spray that high. I’ve owned two electric motor Fimco sprayers and neither one would spray near that high. They would spray about 10 high at the most. I ended up making my own 6’ long wand so that I can spray my backyard trees more easily.

It sounds like they have maybe improved the pumps on the pro model you got. The older pumps wouldn’t take spraying dormant oil (or even oils in emulsifiable concentrates). The oil would ruin the seals after a couple years. I got tired of rebuilding the pump every two years, so I bought a different pump with Viton seals for the current Fimco sprayer I use.

If the manual says it’s OK to use RV antifreeze, then it’s probably OK. But RV antifreeze has alcohol in it. Alcohol can be really rough on some seals, so I wouldn’t use it, unless the manual says it’s OK.

For winterizing our pumps, we pump all the water out that we can, an just run a very small amount of cheap automotive glycol anti-freeze through them. I save the old antifreeze I change from automobiles and orchard tractor and reuse that for winterizing spray pumps.

In terms of cleaning the tanks out, we never do, until the end of the season. If there is a little bit of spray left in the tank, I just use it as a dilute for the next batch of spray. As you get more experience, you’ll find you have less and less left over.

#62

Yes! It is! Totally overwhelming at times. I bought a house on 10 acres. I knew there were some fruit trees when I bought it. There were trees planted in clear rows - that looked like maybe apple - and at the time it looked like maybe 20 of them. I had always wanted to try some fruit trees so I signed up here and tried to decide how to proceed. Here’s my first post: 40 sad and neglected apple/pear/asian pear trees need your guidance! or should I get rid of them?

Since I don’t even know what I’ve got, I decided to wait on that. In the future, I may decide to “lower” some of the pear and apple trees, or top work them, or remove some to create space between them.

I am leaning strongly towards removing all the peach trees I have (they are between 12-16 years old and most are VERY TALL - 25 feet at least - with one ‘short’ one which is about 20’) and planting new peach trees.

For the first year, for all the trees, I decided to:

  1. Cut off dead branches and obvious crossing or really badly malformed branches.
  2. Take copious notes and pictures of each tree to try to figure out what they are, what problems they have, what diseases I need to treat
  3. Learn as much as I can about growing fruit from these and try out some of the things I will have to do (more pruning, spraying, thinning - if I get any fruit set, clearing weeds around bases of trees, etc.)

If I have to pick or thin this year I will be excited! I got a very long pole for attachments on recommendation of Clark, who has tall pear trees. So far, I have a saw attachment for pruning. It does seem that pears need less spraying and thinning than other fruits, which should help me in the distant future.

I do worry about not being able to see problems at the top of the trees, but I’m trying to proceed with one thing at a time.

@Olpea : Thanks for the tips! I was also surprised at how well this sprayer worked. I will keep updating with it’s long term performance. I would have liked a nicer sprayer like the one you described above, but I am going from 0 to 60+ fruit trees very suddenly and can’t afford it at this time.

In a few years, if I still have so many trees and things are going well, hopefully I can get something nicer.

I was interested in rinsing the sprayer because the manual says to do so. But the concern seems to be mainly the pump. I don’t know why I thought I had to rinse the tank! I should just take the hose end from the tank and stick it in a bucket of water to rinse the pump. I can’t believe I didn’t realize until just now!

Fortunately or unfortunately, So far I’ve had the opposite problem! I get to the end of the tank and there are 3 trees left! I do hope experience will help fix this.

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#63

It’s almost impossible to get perfectly match the amount of spray volume with the amount of trees to spray, but you get closer with more experience.

When I spray with the airblast sprayer, I start out spraying every other row (i.e. odd rows 1,3,5,7, etc). When I’m done spraying the odd rows, I go back and spray the even rows. That way, if I run out of spray before I’m finished, I have at least 1/2 of every tree sprayed, theoretically (Really it’s more than 1/2 because the spray blows farther through the tree than 1/2.)

Then the next time I spray, I start with the even rows to make sure the few sides of trees I missed the last time, get sprayed the next time, if that makes sense.

If you wanted, you could incorporate something like that, even with your backyard sprayer. If it just sounds too difficult (because of tree layout or whatever) then you might try spraying the outside trees first (whole trees) then spraying the trees more on the inside. That way if you run out of spray before you are finished, the unsprayed trees on the inside will typically have less insect damage. Just make sure you start with those trees you missed the next time you spray.

It’s documented most insects fly in the orchard from the outside, land on the outside trees and migrate toward the inside trees. The exception would be if you had a lot of plum curculio infection from the previous year and and allowed the fruit to drop with the larva in it. The larva will exit the fruit and pupate in the ground, where the fruit fell, so that the next year they will emerge right under the same tree.