FN came the closest to answering your question, NO.
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Could someone answer my question about the importance of finding seeds in the fruit? If the tree has fruit on it, why wouldn’t there be seeds in the fruit? Are persimmons one of those weird plants with odd pollination requirements?
And, if there are seeds, would that seed sprout a true reproduction of the original tree? Or would it be slightly genetically different, as in the case of an apple seed being planted?
There are male and femal persimmons (also some that produce both flowers). It’s somewhat rare to have a female persimmon produce fruit without the presence of a male. If that’s what ends up happening for you, that’d be a bonus since seeds tend to take up a lot of space in the relatively small fruits. I was more asking out of curiosity than anything else.
Persimmon seeds don’t grow true to type.
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@Lucky_P, so is there a danger in eating unripe persimmon fruit? Not that anyone would try that, considering the bad taste.
Ignoring the astringency issue, what would happen if someone did eat a lot of unripe fruit? Would it create just a big undigestable ball that could cause some kind of obstruction?
dood,
I dunno - I can’t imagine anyone tough or crazy enough to eat a whole bunch of unripe, astringent persimmons
Parthenocarpy is not uncommon with persimmons - seedless fruit without a pollenizer.
Pollenation is something of an adventure in these species. Somewhere at the office I’ve got some stuff that Lon Rombough and Jim Claypool collaborated on. I’ll see if I can round it up.
Put a couple pints of NC-10 pulp in the freezer last night, picked up enough to probably generate another pint this afternoon.
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There is a lot of variation in persimmons in my experience. Oddly some of my sites the trees are similar in a patch. One site in particular there are about 50 trees growing straight up with all the persimmons about 30’ and up where they are hard to get. The trees are absolutely huge! The bark is very rough on those trees. Many other persimmons I see are a loan tree in a field short and round not over 25’ in stature for the entire tree. Obviously people on here eat persimmons prior to cold weather but don’t try it at my sites. People might say it’s a coincidence and the fruit just ripens when it’s cold anyway based on days to ripen. I don’t think that’s entirely correct I think it’s like some pears in that the refrigerator temperature influences the taste and texture. The same is true of apples the later fruit is better up to freezing in the case of apples. Cold temperatures concentrate sugars in fruits in my experience. At every persimmon site I go to which is not over half a dozen the fruit are not good until after the first freeze for whatever reason. People have brought up wrinkled fruit and I agree that’s when they are good which for me is when it’s cold outside. Some persimmons are all seed practically. Those tall persimmons I mentioned sprout on a rock practically. I put some in a jar once to sprout them and they all sprouted but who wants a persimmon with fruit that high up? I thought better of my plan and didn’t grow them. The flat seeds are believed by some can predict weather. There are hundreds of other things I could mention about them. I’ve always been around persimmon and always eat them but let me say just that they so not make not huge amounts of fruit right away. People say pears for your heirs well persimmons are for your heirs heirs. The trees live a long time. When I was 2-3 years old my mom fed me persimmons at a park and that tree is still there and I’m in my mid 40s. My grandpa had a persimmon tree that was on property already when he purchased it in his 30s which I still eat fruit from sometimes and he died in his mid 80s years ago. That puts that tree around 100+ years old. Some family still own it and the tree will likely outlive his children and me. For some reason many persimmons I see grow in a field off by themselves away from other trees. There is still a lot I don’t know about persimmon but I consider them something very special. I can’t explain why they grow where other trees did not at some of those locations. Why at one sight are there 50 trees and more growing all the time and what makes their seed so viable? Likely just genetic differences. Why is that fruit so high up and bark so rough? There is a lot there I don’t know. I don’t like those trees much because I’ve never eaten a persimmon there that had not hit the ground first! There are plenty of those persimmon fruits and if you don’t mind leaves embedded from the impact they are good so instead you eat one side of the fruit! In some cases all the fruit splatted and there is nothing good left to eat. I’ve not seen anything but wild American persimmons. Once in awhile I see a tree in the woods growing amongst other trees but they never seem happy there. In a lifetime there is not enough time to learn much about anything but what I can tell you about wild persimmons is I’ve never seen an early one. Pears have early , mid season, and late pears depending on cultivar but with persimmon I’ve only seen late season. These type of persimmon fruit that people are picking before the freeze are not something I have experience with. Keep in my mind I don’t know anything about kaki or hybrids beyond what I’ve read. The persimmons I’m growing do not mature quickly but my soil is relatively poor. Wild cultivars are all ive ever been around and my knowledge is limited to my region. I am also growing lotus persimmons and should be able to tell you more about those pretty soon. I had a male bloom this year.
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My theory is that during warm nights respiration occurs in the leaves but the respiration slows as nights become cooler and more of the days gathered energy goes to the fruit instead of vegetative growth as a consequence. I’ve noticed that many vegetables also become sweeter as we move into fall- even before the first frosts- string beans are crazy sweet right now.
Probably the majority of my theories turn out to be wrong.
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Some regions, like Kentucky, where Lucky lives are really hot during the day and hot at night. The heat and humidity last long. Oregon, where I live is not hot at night, even during the summer. Some places like NY are hot in summer but not in Sept or Oct. So I think ripening is about heat units.
John S
PDX OR
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Clark,
I think it’s all about stem-density and crowding.
Open-grown persimmons tend toward a shorter, spreading, ‘orchard’ type habit.
Persimmons that happen to find themselves in a high-stem-density setting… like in a forest setting… have to grow straight up in order to get to sunlight.
I, too, have some here that are a ‘timber’-type tree - tall with first branches 20-30 ft above ground - but they’re in deep woods - or were in the woods before the surrounding saleable timber was cut from around them.
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Lucky,
I have a bunch of native persimmons close by. The migrating animals bring the seeds frequently. I made sure these seeds got into the dirt on the edge of the woods that were left by an animal in the driveway this morning. I guess if something leaves a pile of $&@& !!! In my driveway at least the $&@& !!! has fruit tree seeds in it! Guess that’s about as good a present as the animals could leave me if one of these seeds turns into a nice persimmon tree.
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Thanks for the lovely pictures of $&@&!!!. I’m happy it has fruit seeds.
Your friend, Chikn.
P.S. This doesn’t look like a crabapple either.
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Sorry Chikn it comes with the fruit growing. The same animals that like my place are bound to leave stuff like that in my driveway. I must have 50 mulberry trees that got here like that.
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My mulberries come by bird, I try hard to lessen the population of the critter that produces that… stuff!
I think you’ve discovered a new fruit…
Should I say it?
Wait for it…
Wait…
A crapapple!
{Rim shot}
Thank you, I’ll be here all night. Try the veal…
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It will be funny if those persimmons grow into something awesome! I won’t be able to give those scions away!
Well, who would have to know??
And if they did become a new variety, what name would you give it?? Hmm??
Makes me wonder now where some of those other named varieties came from.
Mmmm…maybe not, but I think these are. Just saw’m today…I think I need a scion…maybe even plant a couple for multi-trees.
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Those are loaded!
If those are crabs, have you tried any yet? Are they growing wild closeby?