A couple of updates. First fruit taste/type. I talked to Andy Mariani (and ordered some sour cherries for tasting, so I can get an idea). He was of the opinion that Montmorency was too tart to eat fresh. That was a surprise, so I’m really curious to taste the fruit myself and see if they are what I’m looking for.
Regarding Stella cherries going bad on the tree - at first I thought it was not brown rot, because I have never seen any browning twigs on it nor any mold/spores on the fruit. However, I have a nectarine near by and while the fruit is perfectly fine, I do see some twigs browned. I’m still not 100% sure though, because cherries from afar look perfectly fine. Only once I touch them to pick them, I can feel that they are squishy and browned on the inside. There is often a small hole in the fruit, even though there is no worm of any kind that I can see on the inside. I’m not sure if I can post any photos here.
Just wanted to offer my perspective on Belle Magnifique. I had some from Andy’s Orchard. They are both sweet and sharp and enjoyable to eat in larger quantities. The true tart cherries, like Balaton, are rather sharp and one probably would not eat a pound at once.
Belle Magnifique in contrast was both sweet and sharp, and somewhat like eating a raspberry, it was sweet enough to balance the acidity and quite enjoyable to eat them in larger quantities.
For me I would definitely desire to grow tart cherries and Duke cherries if possible in my region. Many nurseries in So Cal sell Kansas Sweet, and report that it is productive here. That being said, I think it may be a sweeter tart cherry rather than a true Duke. I found this online:
Willis Nursery, Ottawa, Kansas introduced Kansas Sweet as The flavor is somewhat sweet for a Prunus Cerasus or Sour Cherry.
The L. E. Cooke Co brought in the cherry in 1960 and put into production in 1965. The tree is a small growing pie cherry which sets heavily even in the mild areas of Southern California.
The selection is not considered a sweet cherry but is sweeter than all other pie cherries, self fertile, and produces in a broad range of climates from the cold Midwest to the mild winter areas. The fruit is large for a pie cherry, has red skin and flesh making it colorful.
Just saw this, Andy told me that he does not grow May Duke anymore. They tried it 25 years ago and they think the scions available had a virus and they got rid of it. He does grow Almaden Duke so that could be this variety.
Adding some insight here:
Late Duke, one year in the ground from Trees of Antiquity, has already set fruit for me in San Diego. Maybe we will soon add this to the list of low chill tart and duke cherries? Kansas sweet is known to produce here, as is English Morello.
I want to try out Belle Magnifique next year, along with Reine Hortense and some others but I don’t seem to see any sources online. I think there is great potential for tart and duke cherries in lower chill areas of California.
I am glad you are getting fruit in a low chill area. If it does well in low chill areas maybe it will end up planted more frequently. I think there is certainly demand for more cultivars of low chill cherries. The Late Duke probably has not been tested in low chill areas since it is a fairly rare cherry.
This year my Late Duke flowered and will probably set fruit but it’s not reached shuck split yet. I am planning to pick most of the fruit off since it’s pretty small. I planted it last year so it’s age is the same as your tree.
The Arboreum Company carries Belle Magnifique but I am not sure if it’s available from them every year. I would suggest trying to buy it as soon as they put inventory online on the Fall. The inventory sells out quickly and that was before the Pandemic started.
I have never seen Reine Hortense offered as tree only as scionwood unfortunately.
I think your best bet is California Rare Fruit Growers. They have annual scion exchanges at the local chapters and I have seen Reine Hortense on one of the scion lists.
They have a local chapter in San Diego too so it would be a chance to meet people in the local area that are growing fruit. It might be worth joining. I considered joining at one time but since I am in rural Illinois most of the fruit I can’t grow here at all. Duke cherries are an exception (I hope ) .
Also if you have success with your Late Duke could you post on one of the low-chill cherry threads on the forum? Or start a thread of your own? I know the guys in low chill areas struggle and any information on your successes and the number of chill hours you have would help them out.
I am a member! The Bay Area chapters have the best selection but when there are Dukes or even any rare cherries, they tend to be gone quick! I will keep an eye out in the future.
I also last year emailed the ARS-GRIN and asked that they import the May Duke from the few remaining sources in the UK. It did not sound like they were willing. But I am going to find an exact source for them and then email them again, maybe they will be willing if I make it easy for them.
How does you Late Duke look now. Do the leaves look okay?
I having a strange problem with my Late Duke. The leaves yellow at the margins and stay that way for may be a couple of weeks then the rest of the leaves yellow with the veins being the last to yellow. It happened last year too. I have one tart and two sweet cherries with 20 feet of the Late Duke and they look completely normal. I am kinda at a lost as far as what is wrong.
I just wanted to update everyone. A healthy May Duke specimen is present in the UK and the owner agreed to donate scion to the US ARS. They agreed to import it, certify it virus free, and then add it to the tart cherry collection in Geneva, New York.
That would not have happened if not for the discussion on this forum and the sharing of our interests. I think it will probably take several years before any of us can grow it, let alone taste it. But this cultivar was at risk of being lost and now will be saved. Just wanted to let everyone know. It will probably be at Monticello again in healthy form one day.
Thank you for taking the time and effort to bring the May Duke back to the United States. I think the Duke cherries have a lot to offer growers that want sweeter cherries in challenging climates.
How hard was it to get the US ARS to agree to start the process of importing it?
Honestly, not that hard once I reached the right guy. When I reached the wrong people, there was not a ton of exertion to help me find the right person. But once I found the right person, he was like “yeah, we definitely want that, send me your contact and we will take care of the rest” and that was that.
It might have also been easier because it was one of Thomas Jefferson’s favorites and Monticello was interested in it also. So there was some serious cultural importance to it. And it sounded like they were down to 2 sources we knew of in the UK so it was definitely at risk of being lost for good.
in case you missed it, here’s a youtube video on the ars tart cherry repository. the presenter cites the perishability of cherry trees as a major challenge for them, they’re constantly losing trees and having to graft and replant or whatever
@mroot, I began studying Duke cherry trees about 20 years ago, after I discovered an apparent wild Duke cherry growing in the backyard of where I was staying as a guest. A next door neighbor had been telling the household for years that the red berries were poison, so no one had ever eaten them - I quickly put those concerns to rest! The tree was young and produced abundant loads of VERY delicious bright red cherries! I moved out of the state, but vowed I would return someday and propagate the variety. And I did. But when I returned years later, the tree was badly infected with bacterial canker. I tried and tried to bud scions to rootstocks, but no luck, until one day I noticed a bud was absolutely thriving, and with not a sign of disease! But no sooner did I notice the new growth, I turned and somehow, don’t ask me how, managed to bump the tree and knock the new growth right off! Since then, the tree has only become eaten up with the bacterial canker, and impossible to collect uninfected wood from. ChatGPT recently gave me instructions on how to process budwood to kill the canker bacteria, so maybe I’ll give that a try.
There are a couple of things that I can tell you about Duke cherries that I have witnessed or been told: 1) the cherries I have seen exude a wonderfully strong and delightful smell, and 2) Duke cherries, in general, are very susceptible to bacterial canker. So, I’d advise to be very careful not to plant one near an already infected tree.
As for my current attempts at getting a tree from that mother tree, over the last ten years the mother tree produced, with help of the birds, a number of nearby ‘babies.’ Within the next few weeks I’ll be transplanting the only surviving young tree that was never mowed down to a new home. And fortunately, as of the last inspection, it was still free of bacterial canker. There is yet more to the story, and perhaps I’ll share it with you, later.
I had ‘Kansas Sweet’ in the '90s, did fine but I wasn’t wowed by it. More tart than sweet but no strong flavor or aroma. Rather squashy texture. Might have been better in full sun all day.
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