Easy and fast. And works most of the time. But, not the best option for bench grafting of bare root material.
1 Like
So true! For years I mainly dig just straight whip grafts because my whip and tongue grafts really were pathetic and usually didn’t work. Now I can pull off a pretty mean whip and tongue that has a high probability of succeeding and are undoubtedly a better graft than cleft graft. But they do require a little more care and I am lazy.
Is whip and tongue the best method in general for bare root material (I have done so few bare root grafts)?
Again clefts are not at all my favorite, but curious why you say clefts are uniquely less suitable for bench grafts (assuming i read that correctly)…it is where i began, bench clefts on pear and apple
There’s more than one way to skin this cat. But whip and tongue is the sturdiest, and leaves the least scar to heal over if done well.
From a scar standpoint, saddle graft would be just as well. But if a robin lights on the grafted tree the fist year, it’s not as apt to survive the weight.
1 Like
Thanks again everyone. Sorry for the delay in getting back to you all.
Some great advice on here. I have been practising the cleft, the whip and tounge and the saddle graft.
The cleft does seem the easiest but seems like a mixed bag in terms of folks opinions on it?
My understanding is that the cleft graft will suit when the scion is conaiderably smaller than the root?
With the saddle it seems like the rootstock and scion need to be very close in diameter.
What about with the whip and tounge? If the scion is considerably smaller than the root then i assume i just shift it to one side and accept there will only be one side of cambium yo cambium contact?
Thank you all again you have really encouraged me.
Jamie
Jamie, the tongue in a W&T is a nice touch and can be helpful to kind of hold the scion in place while you get started wrapping, but a simple whip is just as strong, much easier and faster to do, and takes much less practice to master. I follow @alan 's method.
He can correct me if I’m missing anything, but the first thing I do (after preparing a label so I don’t mix things up) is to stick a piece of tape, probably Temflex, on the branch to be cut. Then cut the branch with nippers, with the nippers pressed closely to the branch so the angle of the cut is as acute as possible. Match the cut on the scion, also with the nippers. Align the two parts, hold them in place with one hand, and start wrapping with the other. Put on the label. Dab wax on the cut end. And I should mention that I have the scion wrapped with parafilm before I start, and will generally overwrap the splice itself with parafilm. That’s it. You can make small adjustments in alignment as you go, and you can finesse modest size mismatches just as you describe.
2 Likes
I am curious about this apical dominance that was mentioned. Maybe that was my trouble last year why none of my grafts took except one on the leader of a plum tree in the ground a year. The rest I put on side branches of larger trees where I figured I could keep an eye on them. This year should I try an upper limb and cut it off and stick the scions in around the edges of the bark? I assumed with all the frankentrees mentioned on here that one could stick a scion on any part of the tree.
I don’t know the science on this but my thought is that apical dominance does hamper grafts done lower on a frankentree.It seems to me that I have consistently had better luck grafting higher on the tree, especially as the tree has matured. This has been more true on my apple than on my pear, but pears, well, pears can spoil a person.
I think it helps a lot to cut a nock in the bark above a newly grafted branch. You’ve probably read about this before, but just to be sure, nocking involves removing a strip of bark right down to the wood, which stops the flow of auxin from the higher branches. I make my nocks about a quarter inch wide and three times as long as the branch I’m grafting to. In other words, a one inch diameter branch would have a three inch strip directly above it. (I hope it’s obvious that the nock is horizontal and not vertical!)
Finglas (Jamie) yes, you could line up just one side of the whip, whip and tongue or saddle grafts. Just as you’d be doing in a cleft.
There’s something called a “side graft” that will enable a whip & tongue connection when the scion is smaller, and still manage to get the cambium on both side of the scionwood in contact with the rootstock.
And if sap’s up in the rootstock, you also can do a bark graft if you like when the scions are much smaller.
1 Like
Thank you everyone. I really appreciste you taking time to reply wnd help me out.
I am going to do some morr practise and then i think itll be near time to have a go at the real thing!
1 Like
Hi everyone, thanks again for all your help. I grafted the rootstocks about two weeks ago. I used various grafts because i felt some scion and roots were more suited to some cuts than others. Cut my hands a few times too! I have kept the rootstocks in a bucket filled with some compost and topped with newspaper. All kept really damp. They have also been in my shed which is fairly shady (there is only one window) but the temperature is probably fairly stable and they won’t get frosted.
Some of the buds have started to turn green and im really hoping thats a good sign!
My question now is do i keep them in the shed until the risk of frost has passed outside? I do have a greenhouse and i could keep them in there, but thatll get much warmer…
Thanks for all your help again
Jamie
1 Like
Having tried both grafting outdoors in 20 to 40 degrees …. and stashing bench grafts in a plastic bag with damp moss or paper for a few days before potting up outside…or heeling in a bin of damp soil…
and haven’t noticed any significant variations in ‘take rates’
2 Likes
Thank you. That is very interesting. I think ill wait another week or so then bring them outside.
Do you use cleft grafting even for same-sized scion/stock?
1 Like
Yes. No problems at all.
I have put plenty of grafts below “top level” to say apical dominance is not an absolute requirement, but for a given branch i try to avoid any “down-branch” growth
How do you avoid any “down-branch” growth?
In frameworking a scaffold I assume that if the tip of the scaffold branch to which I’m grafting is lower than the graft union it won’t have any influence, but auxin from higher in the tree might. I’m still trying to sort that out! If I’m grafting a scaffold over I think knocking upstream from the scaffold is probably pretty important, but I don’t have any rigorous data to back that up. I’m interested in hearing other’s thoughts and particularly experiences.
I also think some varieties of a given fruit might be more sensitive to apical dominance. For example, Prairie Spy and Stayman’s Winesap seem vigororous, but Macoun has been very shy for me.
No problem living. But, less scar tissue by not doing a cleft graft. If two whips are equal, and large enough to easily work with, I can’t imagine why I’d want to do a cleft graft. Even tiny scions…if I have some tiny rootstocks…I prefer doing a saddle graft when both are the same size. And save the cleft operation for scions that don’t match the rootstocks.
1 Like