When the trees mature, I’d love to know whether you can ripen Saijo there. Also, I believe that Coffee Cake and Chocolate are examples of the PVNA type, so look for seeds.
Absolutely. I’m going from 4 varieties to ~10 this year, if I can make all the grafts work.
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OK. I will. I’m hopeful and I have pushed zones on some things that are doing gangbusters here and no one can understand how I’m doing it. I can’t either. But I don’t take it for granted. In farming everything can turn on a dime. And these out-of-zone persimmons may never fruit for me.
The seeds really aren’t too much of an issue unless you have small fruited varieties. Then a lot of the volume will be occupied with seeds. With 3 acres you could likely separate the pollination variant ones far enough from others to not have too many seeds in the ones you want seedless. Only 1 of my trees, Nishimura Wase, had a few male flowers this year, and even some persimmon trees 20 feet away didn’t have any seeds at all. It only managed to pollinate some of its own flowers and that of a neighbor 8 feet away. The pollination distance could change when something known to be more “potent” like Chocolate flowers. I guess it would also depend on how abundant your pollinating insects are.
You can grow pretty much any persimmon in your climate. Have you tried any previously that you liked? American persimmons and Asian persimmons are very different beasts. I can’t even really compare astringent Asians with Virginiana cultivars. What are your taste preferences? It might be useful to have ones that ripen throughout the fall. Do you plant on dehydrating them or storing them for fresh consumption throughout the winter?
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Keep in mind american persimmons will grow 3-4 times the height of most asians.
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The dynamic you describe applies to PVNA types. Seeds don’t affect the astringency of PCA Asians or Armeircans.
My problem is that I don’t know which variety fits in which group? That’s why I was hoping to get some help identifying the varieties.
And also how to plant them , in which order!
I really don’t care if they have seeds on them as long as they benefit from that and the flavor is better!
That’s what I would like to take advantage of the things that I have in favor. Like the climate and the space to grow them.
I can say that I’m not picky when it comes to persimmons. I would say that I like them all, although I have only eaten just a few varieties like Jiro, Matsumoto,Tamopan, Saijo, and maybe Coffee Cake.
Oh I know it! I love the rum taste of the American persimmons!
I would lean towards the sweet ones for sure.
Yes, this is a must! We already make the investment on the dehydrator a few months ago and my family love them that way as well. And that would be the best way to be able to keep as many as we can for long periods of time.
The other way I would like to try to make some Hoshigaki!!!
That’s why I was planning to plant the Americans towards the end of the property. Still their hight wouldn’t shade the other ones because the way my property is the sunlight would cover every one.
My best shot: Americans are biggest, so put them on the north side. PVAs / PVNAs on the leeward side, away from prevailing wind, to minimize random pollination of PCAs, PCNAs, and hybrids.
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Some PVNA types I’ve seen for sale before are Chocolate, Coffeecake, Smith’s Best, and Maru. There are others out there, but you’d really have to look for scions and graft them.
I’m pretty sure Rojo Brillante, Giombo, and Hachiya are PVA, but are mostly treated as regular astringents. There is a lack of pollinator varieties to bring out the characteristic in most yards here. That could explain why we don’t hear much about PVA types.
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Thank you for the clarification.
This is some of what I was looking for and it’s going to help me define where to plant them. Thanks for the info @PharmerDrewee
That’s great to know this, I have every one of them!
I hope to plant as many different varieties I can get my hands on and hoping to be able to bring more information about those varieties.
I have Rye Bread, from Marta who is on GrowingFruit and has a website. I don’t know if my zone is ok, but it seemed like a good fruit. I have Jiro [PCNA], Rojo Brillanti [PCA], Kyung San Ban Si [PCA]. Later I am trying if I can - Saijo, Miss Kim, Coffee Cake and Chocolate. Somewhere in there I will have fruit that grows well, and I will figure out how to reduce astringency. I don’t like the hard fruit, but the almost-liquid is a bit too soft. I do have an Excalibur dehydrator, had it for years and worth it.
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I have never heard of this variety before. I also don’t know who is Marta or her website, maybe you could share it so I/we could check it out.
That’s another one I have never heard before ( Kyung San Ban Si [PCA] ), I do have Jiro and just purchased Rojo Brilliante.
Last year I grafted quite a few varieties in to D. Virginiana rootstocks and most of them took, Saijo and Miss Kim are some of the varieties that I grafted.
Maybe in the future we could trade scions if you’re interested.
That is the same brand of dehydrator that we have, I’m pretty sure we’re going to have a good use out of it for years to come.
This is a tasty fruit. It’s not too liquidy at all when ripe.
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@Marta Really Good Plants
I found most of what I have been considering by looking at nursery websites and reading descriptions of what they are selling. Their zones can be useful and what roots they graft to. Most plant types are easier than apples, but even most of those can be sorted into your zone by who sells them- Fedco for north/colder and Big Horse Creek for south/warmer for instance.
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In that case I’ll be even more interested in growing this variety! Thanks for commenting about it.
Tamopan not my favorite. The ones I tasted were insipid.
That was my impression as well when I tasted them. But @RUenvsci commented that they ware great if dehydrated!
I’m wondering if the taste would change if they get pollinated ?
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All PVNA cultivars differ in taste when pollinated. I do not have any extra wood for Rye Bread anymore. The fruits of this selection are described here: Gardening : Tasting persimmons in November 2021
Click on the images to see the full size pictures
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