I know other that have tried smartpots but I haven’t so I can’t comment on them. Also, since I only keep trees in pots for 2 seasons, I can’t address long-term use. I can say that I’ve had great results using the Rootmaker air pruning system using Promix and Farfard and seen some amazing rootballs at the time they were planted in the field. Beyond that I can’t contribute much.
@forestandfarm thanks! I decided to cancel the Promix after thinking about the anti-fungal ingredient. I try not to use too much chemical. So I guess I will stay with Fox farm. I will have to look into the Rootmaker pots to see if they are expensive and if they have the size I want. All my container trees will stay in their pots permanently. thanks again.
Hi Roundface, I’ve been using a lot of Promix BX and really like the stuff for both seed starting and mixed with pine fines and some compost for containers outside. When you mentioned the anti-fungal ingredient, I remembered reading that on the bag and looking it up, because I was wondering what it was and if it was a chemical. Here is the description:
“Biofungicide is a naturally occurring strain of bacteria called Bacillus subtilis and Bacillus Pumilus (MBI 600). This bacterium enhances plant growth and combats harmful organisms such as Fusarium, Pythium and Rhizoctonia.”
I don’t have as much experience as many here, so I’m not trying to convince you to use it, but just wanted to let you know what I had seen in my research.
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Promix has other similar mixes. I use the Bx version because of the anti-fungal for growing chestnuts from seed. They are very high in carbs and require cold stratification. They are very susceptible to mold when you warm them up to germinate.
The rootmaker pots are expensive. I but my first few from Big Rock Trees. Once I was convinced they would work well for my application, I got a commercial account with Rootmaker. That makes the price more reasonable but you are forced to buy in quantity. I will note that the discount is not as high as it initially appears when all costs are counted depending on what you buy. When you buy from a retail vendor, you pay shipping from the vendor plus the retail markup. When you buy from rootmaker with a commercial account, they are shipped directly from the factory and you pay actual shipping costs. With some products like the express trays, the trays come from one factory and the cells from another, so you pay a freight charge for both. In the end, it is still a substantial savings but not as much as it first appeared.
I was able to get a commercial account from them because we have a tree farm and it is set up as a business LLC. Even though I don’t sell the trees I grow in Rootmakers, that didn’t seem to matter to them. The only thing we sell is our timber to paper companies and such.
Again, I can’t speak for how they will perform for your application. They do sell both in-ground root pruning bags and above ground containers in a large variety of sizes.
@forestandfarm thanks for the info. I found this rootmaker in ebay. Can you please let me know if these are the pots you use? thanks! http://www.ebay.com/itm/Root-Routing-Pot-7-gallon-Air-Pruning-Potting-Container-Nursery-Pot-/321191376806?ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123
anyone using theTangle foot coddling moth traps and how do you find them? I use them, caught nothing and my peaches and apples are wormy! Do they work?
ps: I have used the red balls painted with sticky coating. caught "insects"but not the moths
No, those are not rootmakers. Here is the link to their retail web site: Rootmaker
I use the 1 and 3 gal containers shown on this page. The pots you show on ebay would require a lot of attention to watering. The Rootbuilder II containers shown on the this link have protrusions on the sides that direct roots to a hole in the end. The bottoms of the post are concave underneath (convex inside) and they have little ridges. When roots hit them they are directed along those ridges to the lower side protrusions.
Thanks for the links. I went there but the biggest they have is 3 gal. They have some that are fabric. I called but I guess everyone has gone home 
I will call them again tomorrow as I am looking for larger than 3 gal since they will be permanent home for my trees.
I think when you get to larger sizes most folks use fabric bags for above ground trees: Rootmaker Bags
These root prune a little differently. I think they assume the major tap root has already been air pruned in a smaller container. The inside is a fabric that traps tiny root tips and won’t let go. This keeps them from circling or j-hooking and forces upstream branching just like air pruning. I believe the outside of the white bags is PVC. This helps with water retention. They also have in-ground knit bags that work a little differently: Rootmaker in-ground bags
These root prune through constriction. Tiny roots can grow through the bag in to the native soils but can’t get any larger in diameter than the bag holes. This construction has a similar effect causing upstream branching.
Thanks,
jack
One more quick note. When you are working with root pruning container, it is sort of lather, rinse, and repeat if you want optimal growth. Here is a link to the underlying concept: 4" Rule
"anyone using theTangle foot coddling moth traps and how do you find them? I use them, caught nothing and my peaches and apples are wormy! Do they work?
ps: I have used the red balls painted with sticky coating. caught “insects"but not the moths”
Round Face,
Please post a new thread on this new topic. There will be a lot of people answering you. Almost everyone here has battled those bugs every year. They will share with you what have worked for them.
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thanks. I will take a look tomorrow . I am sure I have questions!
I only have one tree in a pot. It’s conventional. This fall I’ll move to a root pouch. I prefer them, they only last 4 years, but that is fine. I left a black raspberry out all winter in one and it is growing., They breath so well, looks like you can just leave it outside. I will experiment more before doing so with a valuable plant. Anyway I’m sold on the pouches, cheap, they work as well or better than other similar products. Air pruning is called air pruning because when the root reaches the fabric, the air stops growth. The cloth doesn’t hold it, it is “air” pruned.
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I repotted my Nadia with oxfarm K9 cube.I have not hacked it back to 4 branches. I was busy trying to save my bubblegum, maxine and nectarplum spice zee. The plout dapple dandy is dead! I think it could be lack of drainage that killed it. I got these last yr and did my own mix with pine bark, potting soil (some generic brand cant remember name) and slow release fertilizer. I did not protect them and came spring they were trying to leaf out and then suddenly they start to die back. This happened to my 2 Bing cherries 2 yrs ago. When I got the trees out, the dirt was very wet and soggy. Can anyone tell me why some of these trees died on me? The other problem I have is when I planted them last year, they were really struggling to leaf out. any input would be deeply appreciated. thanks in advance
Does sound like lack of drainage. In a pot drainage is key. Improve that aspect of your mix and results should improve.
@zendog, I just saw your response. I don’t always get notification when I get a response so if I don’t respond to an answer to my question, chances are I didn’t see it. I was not aware that it is a bio-fungicide. So thanks for this info. I will call the feed store and order it again after I cancelled!
I used a lot of bark on my containers but every year I have casualties and they struggle to leaf out and some eventually keel over. Every spring as mentioned in one of my thread, the dirt is soggy and wet. This yr I used Foxfarm for the 1st time, using it as it and sometimes mix with dirt that the dead trees came out of. Probably not a good idea? What brand pine fines?
To those who containerise, what zone are you in? I am in zone 6 and last yr, I lay some of my pots on the side and cover with a frost fabric which is quite thick (like the fabric used to make reuseable shopping bag) I don’t remember what is it call or where I got it from and I need to get more for next yr. Then I got something called agro something from ebay which is very flimsy and thin. I used to protect from light frost this yr. I dont think it will work well for my 1st application. as I type this, my ailing memory is coming back, I think I got it from Parkseed? It came a 2 in a pack.
I hope so. what zone are you in and do you keep your trees in containers, permanently
@Roundface, this is a reply to your question about 5:1:1 and Promix, etc. in the other thread. If you read through this whole thread you’ll see a lot of discussion of different mixes, most have pine fines/small bark in them. 5:1:1 is 5 parts pine fines I believe.
I can’t really say what happened to your trees last year and whether it was related to the medium or something else, but usually mixes with pine fines (which is basically just small chopped up pine bark) drain very well and the main reason they are used in mixes for outdoor container growing is for that reason. Indoors, most mixes use primarily peat since you don’t have to worry about big rains making your mixes too soggy and the lower humidity inside in winter, etc. tend to dry things out so you want the peat to retain water which good pine fines won’t do nearly as well.
If your mixes were mostly pine bark last year and they were very soggy, I would say maybe it wasn’t a very high quality fines product. I have heard that sometimes the pine mulch (which many use as the fines since very few places actually sell anything called pine fines) has a lot of wood in it, besides the bark. In that case it will retain more water and will break down faster which will reduce drainage. Another thing that may be important to consider with pine fines is that they are inherently more acidic so usually people add some lime to their mix. The pine bark doesn’t break down fast and produce a lot of acidity, but it is easy to have your mix be more acidic than you’d like if you don’t use some lime. I’ve heard of people using pine mulch from Walmart as a good pine fine product, but then finding out the product changed (probably same packaging for Walmart and a new provider) and suddenly had a lot of wood and less bark.
In terms of Promix BX, it is a pretty well drained product, but it is peat based so it may retain more moisture than you’d like if you get consistent rain. Rain can also compact peat based mixes, so the pine fines help give it fixed structure. Right now I’ve been trying 1/3 Promix, 1/3 Pine Fines, 1/3 compost plus a little lime as a starting place, just to make sure I get enough drainage. I’ll have to see how things look in the fall to see for sure, but so far I like the consistency and the drainage. I don’t know if straight Promix BX outside might have the possibility of holding too much water it you get consistent rain without a good break to dry things out a bit. But I do have some Blackberries in straight promix BX (well plus a little more pearlite for added drainage) and the ones that don’t appear to be dead from the nursery are doing well.
@zendog I called the feedstore that I ordered the promix BX, they dont sell pine fine apart from pine mulch. I thick what I used in my mix was cypress pine. Is there a particular pine that I shd be looking for? Does it need to say pine bark? Going to Walmart on Friday so I will look.
The dirt where my dead trees came out from were very wet! I am thinking maybe as it was coming out of dormancy, it was overwhelmed and died subsequently??? There were buds developing then it dried up and when I scratched the branch the cambium was brown. I called Foxfarm, the K09 cube is 70/80 peat and yes will hold moisture so I guess I had better add some bark…thanks!