High Desert Group

My approach to growing fruit at home is much more old school: I wanted - & still want - to appropriate the attitudes & experience of our forebears. That was the prime motivation for selecting heirloom cultivars. They have largely proven unable to thrive & produce well in northern Spokane. Here I have basalt sand fathoms deep, little to no organic matter apart from what is being husbanded in this back yard, six to 26 days above 90°F most summers, 13% humidity in dry days & thirty degree temperature swings day to night from late June through most of September.

The oldest cultivars doing well are Hunt Russet & what I hope will prove to be Orléans Reinette, both dating to only 1750.
What experience has taught me confirms the adage that people raised what worked in their conditions. That has shaped this home orchard more than anything.

Zinhead: you know much more than I about biochemistry and fungus. I cannot answer all your questions. The trees are teaching me.

FungoliaFarms: Thanks, I will look into gypsum, as a diverse batch of fungi in the soil seems to be a hallmark of mature healthy ecosystems.

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The environment is changing.
What used to work may not in the future.
Test your soil & water.
Balance the pH & nutrients for optimal symbiosis for each species you grow.
Don’t be cookie cutter.
Prune for dense canopy, do high density planting & leave pull north side of trees just before heavy rains.
Good luck!

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I don’t mind more of em, I roast the roots and eat the baby leaves so it’s ok.

I have a gravenstein that’s doing pretty well here in Spokane and a few other apples- I would love to have more of the old heirloom style but like you said I’m uncertain about how well they’ll cope. we are in the middle of prime apple country though

@fungolia I’m starting shitaake in some oak logs here, your setup is amazing!!!

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I forget the name of this old aromatic apple.
I’m finding pics now under 4 different names.
Anyone grow it or know the real cultivar name?
“Apistar Alma” or something else?
20220607_184402

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It’s apistar apple. Yes i had it but a storm broked her and i didn’t plant another… the flavor is good, the perfume too but it’s too small for me.

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Thanks for starting this topic, NB. I find (have found since we started trading scions years ago) it interesting that you struggle with varieties that do well for me here in hotter, drier, and higher Reno. I know there are other climatic considerations that must affect success or lack thereof with some of the heirlooms you’ve had trouble with that do fairly well here, but I imagine your soil must be the primary differentiator. I’ve been procrastinating for years on testing my soil, much less my water (municipal), but ZinHead has convinced me to stop being so lazy. I’m sure there are varieties that have struggled here that would perform better if I correct whatever deficiencies might be present.

With respect to what does well for me, Claygate Pearmain is my most reliable apple, so I’m glad it’s doing well for you. Did you get Orleans Reinette from me? If yes, it’s the real deal. It’s inconsistent here, but in it’s best years, it’s in my top five. I’ve fruited six other apples on your list, Calville Blanc d’Hiver, Esopus Spitzenburg, Goldrush, Williams Pride, Rambour Franc, and Lamb Abbey Pearmain. E. Spitzenburg, Goldrush, and Calville Blanc are all excellent, with the first two better producers than CB, which is a coddling moth magnate, Williams Pride was pretty good the only time I fruited it, but I expect it to be good regularly as the new graft matures (lost the original), and Rambour Franc was regular and decent, if not great, when I had it. I got rid of Lamb Abbey P after repeated crops of smallish apples that had plenty of sugar, but were unpleasantly bitter. Maybe it was a cider apple that was mislabeled LAP when it came to me, though I believe I got it from the Geneva repository, so a mistake from them seems unlikely.

Other quality apples in the Great Basin:
Blushing Golden
Macoun
Pixie Crunch
Rubinette
Suncrisp
Sweet Sixteen
Wickson

I’ve fruited many other very good apples, but they haven’t been produced regularly enough for me to feel confident about them yet.

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Excited to follow this thread (zone 7, central Rio Grande Valley New Mexico). Late spring freezes, dry April/May winds, and intense summer heat are my biggest fruit growing challenges. Endless sunshine and clay soils to hold moisture are the benefits.

Varieties that have done well for me so far:

  • Apples: Macoun (so good!), GoldRush
  • Peach: Elberta (when there isn’t a freeze)
  • Nectarine: Fantasia

Helpful growing tricks in this area:

  • Painting the tree trunks white to protect against sun scald.
  • Mowing everbearing raspberries to the ground in February for a single September crop (June is too hot and dry for the second crop)
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The variety name is Apistar. “Alma” simply means “apple” in Turkic languages (Turkish, Kazakh, etc.).

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Thanks

That has been labeled Api Etoile in most of the print I have encountered so far: Star Apple from French, I believe. Most characteristics of the Api or Lady apple, with super ribs. Never had the pleasure of trying Api Etoile, although Lady is really good.

There is a German apple called Weinachtsternapfel (Christmas Star apple), which is quite a different fruit from this one, being medium sized, dark red and with heavily russeted lenticels that typically have rays in several directions, suggesting stars. Its flavor seems more like Lord Lambourne: strawberry. Not sure it is to be found on these shores.

High & Dry: Welcome, Buddy! Good to have you on board. The OR scion you sent did not take; as I recall that was the year of weather challenges which ruined my grafts. This Orléans Reinette possibility came from a local scion swap & was the loose piece in a bag - the only one of three cvs, in that bag to callus. The other two were yellow fruits, so it is most likely to be OR, since the twig wood is deeply red. Once its ID is assured I can send you a scion so you could make a comparison.
Interesting that Lamb Abbey is a bitter pill for you. Here it seems to shine with all the complexity & nuance of which it is capable. I have to patiently curb its abundant fruitfulness so it will grow. (I know, but sometimes character building is just the worst.)

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Api Etoile, that’s it.
Thanks!

I’ve been working for 4 decades on symbiosis.
One of the areas of research has been microbial watering & fertilization.
The most successful method in the desert of most plants is an undocumented form of yeast symbiosis on leaves, branches & nodes.
If nutrients are correct, yeast call water & fertilize plants even at 117°F with 8% humidity.
We are in a 22 year drought.
My location has received (0.75) inches of rain (Jan 1, 2022 to June 12, 2022) this Bougainvillea has not been watered since June 2020.
Once a month I mist it lightly with a solution to optimize yeast symbiosis.
Not so little water not even the wild bermuda is alive.
This is the direction that agricultural work will need to take for a sustainable future in arid environments.

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that’s incredible that just misting can do that

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Misting with micronutrients balanced for yeast symbiosis, can.
Has to be balanced for nutritional needs of wild yeast like what grows on grape skins!
Plan water is only slightly beneficial.
The right nutrients helps yeast get water from the air via osmotic pressure.
Moisture will condense on the plant early in the morning when humidity is high.

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watching all the zone 7+ people posting food already is making me impatient. this waiting time of year it’s worse than winter!

I did get a cabbage today. it’s been pecked over a little but it’s still food

edit I look a mess and so does the garden

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You look great and so does your garden…!! Gotta love that hat.

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we are coming into a heat wave. fussing over when to water.

anyone else get blossom drop/fruit drop during that hot week up north here? I lost everything. things are just now starting to flower again but our frost is October, not sure what will ripen

bonus photo, beans are trying again. valiant things


trying

It seems this is a good time to recapitulate my growth as a grower of fruit. This started in late 2007, thinking it might be worthwhile to grow some apples. None of the first choices remain on the property.

I have had no blessing when it comes to establishing cider apples with one exception, Harrison. It is planted at the orchard of friends & is slowly gaining size. GoldRush (seems to do well almost anywhere) & Redfield are multi-purpose & both do well in this region. Hewes Crab looks as though it may have succumbed to the newest record hot/dry summer in the orchard nearby. I’ve tried quite a lot of cider apple grafts and a couple ready-grown whips. No go.

Early on I caught the heirloom bug. Most have not done well enough to retain in the yard. This past season again Hunt Russet produced little wooden globes, entirely inedible. Same for debut samples from Rosemary Russet, which in half the years is three times the size of the Hunt “tree”. Rosemary is grafted onto Bardsey, which produces juicy apples. None of the few fruits on that branch in the past several years has been edible. I reluctantly conclude they must go.
Same with Bardsey, but for other reasons: It is a codling moth magnet, comparable to Liberty when it used to live here. Again this year every apple was infested with codling worms, even though I began to cover them with orchard socks as soon as I thought it possible to cover the fruitlets. Incessant rain in May slowed me down & abbreviated sock sessions. They all fell off through the course of the season, sometimes the evidence of invasion was just detectable through the calyx. Bardsey must be stringently thinned, due to miniscule stems which break away from pressure of two apples on the same spur or another spur too close. I do this when covering with socks, so isn’t a deal-breaker in itself.

When things work out Bardsey is wonderful: juicy, nice size; lemon overtone remains when cooked or baked or stored.
Connell Red (Fireside sport) is easy to grow, handsome, big & tasteless. Reading about it when grown in the Upper Tier states of MN or Wisconsin, a box of Fireside or Connell emits an overwhelming apple aroma. Well, here that aroma must escape in the low oven temps we’ve been subjected to since 2000.

On another thread years ago I wrote about the mystery tree that arrived mislabeled. At least I know first hand why Honeycrisp has demanded such a high price. It must be a marketing nightmare.

I will hack & graft & hope next season for another GoldRush (can’t have too many of those gems) & start fresh with a Lost Apple Project recovery: Shackleford. Found untended in this region, I have every expectation for it to manage in this yard. I will also shift an Otterson whip to replace one of the russets. Otterson is a bit of a gamble, but Winekist & Redfield, both red-fleshed, do fine, so it has potential.

What does well?
GoldRush/Bud118: tough little tree that has needed minimal pruning to set lovely crotch angles and scaffolds. The first 26 apples harvested this year are all I could hope for, if a tad smaller than we learn to expect at the supermarket fruits. Maybe that will change as the tree matures.

Lamb Abbey Pearmain/Bud118: tree has endured a poor situation, an accident & keeps on keeping on. Its fruit is unforgettable, somewhat larger than the first lot of GoldRush.

Claygate/Gen30: runt of a tree, just a few apples each year, but O, what apples! Juicy, complex (filbert & provolone) along with distinctive tartness and sweetness, biggest in this yard so far.

Twenty Ounce/Gen30: this graft hasn’t fruited yet, but I bought a bagful three Septembers back from an organic orchard 50 miles away. Wow, huge uncomplicated apple taste, big juicy fruits. Here is one that seems to concentrate flavors in dry summers.

The wild card?
Maiden Blush/Gen30: brought over the Oregon Trail long ago (long ago in Far West parlance) & displaced by Big Ag before my birth. I cherish hope it will supply the first apples for this property (soon after Winekist, which isn’t nearly as multi-purpose & lives in a neighbor yard). It is six feet tall & might try blooming next year. I think it bears some round blossom buds now.

Oh, nearly forgot Kandil Sinap/Gen890, grafted three years ago. It grows slowly (not during heat of summer here? will check next season). It could go either way, boom or bust, from all the literature gleaned so far. Lots of time will tell.

Lastly, not apples:
Ersinger plum/St. Julian A gave its debut sample plums, about 20 of them. Completely freestone, it offers a floral aroma in its little treats. Excellent eaten fresh, next year maybe I can try drying some. Or jam?
Next year Kirke’s Blue plum/St. Julian A is on order from Raintree. Kirke should begin blooming just days after Ersinger & ripen about 12 days later, with larger fruit. It seems to have quite the reputation & if so, these two plums could offer several options: fresh, pie, prune, jam & perhaps every few years, wine with black currants added.
BTW, St. Julian A prunus stock brings dormancy earlier, which can be a help here. Twice in recent years killing frost has arrived mid-October. Ersinger on it had no leaves October 13 at a low of 16°F. Mt. Royal standing on Mariana 2624 had retained all leaves, but was unaffected because Mt. Royal is so winter tough. (Mt. Royal was grafted for friends & since been planted on their property.)

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