I think I might get AB, and if they send me the wrong version, I will end up with WD. I first need to give one Lang tree to my brother to make space. He has one acre, he can take more than my tiny urban/suburban lot.
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Or you can just top graft your Lang to something better.
Fruitwood Nursery will have AB wood in the Fall and they may have gotten their initial wood from me, so they might have the real thing.
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Interesting, I was just looking at that website, what do you do with a scion, do you graft them to a Lang or do you root them.
I was looking at @tonyOmahaz5 thread about rooting jujube cuttings, I plant to do that as well. I have been successful in rooting some rose cuttings recently.
Itās a lot easier to graft than to root, and the grafts grow much faster than the rooted cuttings anyway. Rooted cuttings are important for growers in areas where the tops may freeze (Tonyās problem) in the winter so that growers donāt lose the entire grafted tree. But in SoCal, the only reason for a rooted tree is for creating root sprouts of the cultivar to plant elsewhere or to sell. But not all cultivars produce a lot of root sprouts so thatās not always going to be a benefit of a rooted cutting.
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Do you have any video to show how to graft to a jujube tree?
I found this video very informative for jujube grafting:
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The one that NCDabbler just posted is very good.
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Thank You!
I have a question, I have a tall tree, do I cut it completely to the ground like that. Itās going to be hard for me to do it. How about try on some portion of the tree, but not so drastic.
You donāt have to graft that low and cut the whole tree down to ground level. I have a 10 year old Li that has never been very productive, so itās become the rootstock for about a dozen other cultivars. Most of my grafts on that tree have been on branches at about eye level. Graft to vigorous shoots that are growing upright rather than side branches for best results. My jujube grafting success has also been better on mature trees compared with using small root suckers as rootstocks. The wood is hard, but I think theyāre still one of the easier trees to graft (not as easy as apples and pears, but still fairly straightforward).
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Or do both. I posted this pic of a persimmon in a different thread. I completely grafted over it (a Virginia rootstock which got big) this spring. 9 grafts, 7/9 took and I eventually pruned away all of the growth from the original tree.
If you are just starting, a bunch of grafts increases your chances that some of them will do well, rather than just making 1 (or a few bark grafts) and hoping.
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I graft to vigorous green upright shoots. Green shoots are soft and easy to cut, and heal fast. I made this Honeyjar graft in early May. It started growing in early June, and now has over 2 ft of growth and a few fruits on it. Graft was whip and tongue, but simple cleft grafts are fine, as long as you wrap it tightly.
Late June
Now
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Iām definitely going to try a few ways just to insure success.
Personally I prefer bark grafts for jujubes once the bark is slipping in the spring because itās easy to get good cambium contact. Most of those grafts take for me, but I try to reinforce the graft areas a few weeks later with bamboo stakes so that they donāt snap off in strong winds or when birds perch on the scion.
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Just few days ago, I posed noting that I had much lower set/productivity/precocity (some combination? hard to say for now) for jujube cultivars with large fruit (Li, Shanxi Li, Redland, Sihong, etc).
Yesterday, I noticed something which could be a key to explaining it. At 2 different sites (different towns even), I noticed the same thing. The large cultivars on a tree were shriveled, while the small ones seemed to be growing normally.
At one site, 11 of the 12 Li on the tree were shriveled, yet all (3 or 4) of the Texas Tart (reputedly a small fruit) on a new graft were healthy looking.
Li:
Texas Tart:
That was enough to get my attention. But, then, at the other site, there was a large tree with a number of existing grafts (So with Sugar Cane, Fuicuimi, Sihong, Redlands, etc). Everything on the tree looked great, except the Sihong and Redlands fruit which were almost all shriveled.
Redlands:
Sihong:
Uploading: Sihong_ph_08-18-2022.jpegā¦
I watered the tree heavily and will try to swing by the property today to see if it made a difference. From a Roger Meyers video, I remember him saying that when stressed for water trees make fruit shrivel. I think he mentioned that if it is close to harvest, the fruit is ruined, but if it is earlier in the season it can be saved. So, Iāll be interested to see if a deep watering has plumped them back up.
Hereās another one (fro 3rd site) which may also be an example, except further along, with the large fruit dropping. It is a new Bok Jo graft on an Alcalde #1 (AKA Autumn Beauty, which has large fruit). Early in the season, it looked like there was a decent set of Autumn Beauty. But, now, the only fruit on the tree is on the 2 Bok Jo grafts.
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The big ones need a lot of water.
I canāt evaluate how climate influences flavor, but in California a Li fruit from a tree that has been well watered can be superb. A Li fruit from a poorly watered tree may still be crisp and look fine but it will not have the flavor of one from a well watered tree. Also, generally speaking, the older a Li trees gets, the better the fruit quality becomes as well.
Hereās what I think is happening -
Grafted Li and the other cultivars with large fruits (and maybe all jujubes do this) tend to produce flowers as they would if they were a mature tree. They set too much fruit for their root system to adequately water. (This one reason why jujube flowers donāt always set fruit and often abort small fruit.)
This is why small Li trees in particular, and Shanxi Li as well, are notorious for having poor quality fruit. Even if you water them constantly their root systems are too small to adequately water or nourish the large fruit and the overall load. As they get larger, their root system is better equipped to provide adequate water and nutrients to the fruit. The fruit quality on all of my in-ground jujube trees improved over 20-25 years.
If you want to test this, take off at least half of the Li fruit from your trees. The quality of the remaining fruit should increase, especially if the trees are getting adequate water.
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I think this is true, but I think there is also something more interesting at work here. There is a Li at the same site as the multi-grafted So (with wrinkling Redland and Sihong). That Li doesnāt have a huge set, but isnāt bad. The one thing it is missing is a massive set of the small/mid sized jujubes. It does have a few grafts (one of which is Redlands, another is Dong, which has been a stingy setter), which also have fruit, but not a massive amount like the multi-graft So.
I think the heavy set of small jujubes is taking enough water that the plant doesnāt have sufficient water to supply the more needy big ones. Maybe jujube trees divide up the water by saying each of you fruits gets 2ml and the big ones need more. Or maybe it is proportionally distributed and big ones just need a higher overall water level.
Also worth mentioning is that the So tree has a pretty extensive root system and didnāt struggle to ripen a ton last year, including a bunch of Sihong. But, this year it has been very dry, so I guess I needed to water more than I have. I had only watered this site once, as everything is always green here (good soil?). There isnāt an outside spigot, so the one time I watered, I flushed out a hot water tank with a hose (good to do every now and then anywaysā¦). This time I bought an adapter for the laundry basement sink in the basement and ran a hose off that. So, that should make it easier to water more here in the future if needed.
Most of my Li have so little set that thinning them means removing 2 of the 4 fruit on the tree 
The one I mentioned above is probably among the heaviest sets and it is still pretty light compared to most other jujus. But, both Li and Shanxi Li were better last year than they were in the past- maybe over the next few years they will continue to improve.
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Makes sense.
I swung by after softball (we unexpectedly won and had a 2nd playoff game so it was dark). We won again (5th place team beating 3rd and then 1st place teamsā¦), so Iāve got reason to pass by again next week
It looks like about half of the Sihong and Redlands re-inflated and are now shiny. It is mostly the smaller ones where the shriveling appears terminal.
Redlands:
Sihong:
Here are 2 of the other grafts on the same tree, which didnāt have any shriveling (even before being watered).
Sugar Cane:
Fuicuimi:
I also took a closer look at my Autumn Beauty/Alcalde trees/grafts:
1- The one mentioned above with 2 productive Bok Jo grafts dropped all itās fruit
2- One in my yard with only a small Bu Lu Shu graft has a decent amount of fruit (and the BLS only has 5 fruit, 1 of which looks ready to drop).
3- Another has a good set, with only a new (non-productive) graft on it
4- The last is about 30% of a tree, but is holding almost no fruit (had quite a few at first), with Sugar Cane (decent set) making up about 50% of the tree, Russia #4 (good set) and Ant Admire (dropped all but 1-2 fruit) having a branch each.
Edit: I remembered a 5th tree. This one has a decent set and only a new, non-productive graft (similar to tree #3, except slightly lower set). Still fits the pattern.
So #1 and #4 have almost no fruit, but productive grafts of other varieties and #2 and #3 have fruit, but few, if any fruit from other varieties.
Alcalde tree #2 above:
An interesting implication of this is that when I grafted productive varieties on for pollination to help nudge slow varieties, I may have been accomplishing the opposite.
For example, say in year 5 a slow cultivar would have produced 2 pounds of fruit. But if I grafted Bok Jo on in year 2 and it is now half the tree, I could end up with no fruit from the original variety, and 5 pounds from Bok Jo. More total fruit from the tree, but not of the variety you are trying to sample/encourage.
I wonder if this is part of why GA866 (aside from it just being slow) and Vegas Booty have never produced for me. The Dae Sol Jo (about 40% of the tree) is taking up all the resources to make a bunch of fruit. But, I think that eventually the roots will catch up, especially in a year with lots of sun. There are a few GA866, which could hang on (no Vegas Booty though, as far as I can tell).
It could be a while before I get to sample Porterville or more Bu Luo Shu on the big Honey Jar at the rental. There is a heavy Honey Jar fruit set and even more Bok Jo, though I suspect that if I had stayed more on top of watering it could have done it (it ripened a single BLS last fall).
Bok Jo:
I suppose to test this hypothesis, I could cut the productive grafts off a slow cultivar and see if the slow one became (somewhat) productive the next year. But, I generally like the productive cultivars, so I think I may just enjoy the precocious ones while the roots get big/old enough to support the higher-maintenance cultivars.
But if I do manage to get some Abbeville scionwood this winter, Iāll be careful about what tree I put it on, as it is reputed to be very precocious/productive with only moderate fruit quality.
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There was a lot of discussion of Girdling jujubes about 8 years ago in this thread. It took a while, but Iāve finally given girdling a try.
Iām being a bit cautious, picking 1-2 branches on a tree that I wonāt care if I lose, then girdling most/all of the bark off, down to the cambium.
I do this by putting the pruners on the branch, lightly pressing them closed until they cut through, then rotate them to make a circle. I then move them 1/2" away and repeat. After doing this, the bark slips right off from your thumbnail, just like it slips when you make a bark graft.
Iām not girdling any entire trees, as I think that is a good way to kill them, since the roots wouldnāt have anything sending them energy. But 1-2 branches per tree wouldnāt seem like it would weaken them too much.
I did a number of full girdles (branch only), but I also did some partial girdles, but to see how much an impact that would have.
I started with about 10 branches at home around 6/22, when jujubes had first started flowering. I added another 25+ from rentals over the next 1.5 weeks.
Seeing good initial results has me adding a few ālate seasonā ones to see if I can stimulate some lagging trees.
One paper I saw said that girdling had a variable impact, depending on cultivar, from almost no change to doubling production. From what Iāve seen so far, I think that study must have been in an area where jujube production is strong. Here, some cultivars are quite shy about bearing.
So if a tree in CA can make 100 fruit, getting 50 more out from girdling is a 50% improvement. That same tree here could make 5 fruit, with girdling bringing it to 50, a 900% improvement- even if the total improvement was less, it is from a much lower base.
It is a bit early for me to forecast 900% improvements, but the results are pretty strong on some trees.
Hereās a Li where there is a decent fruit set on the other branches, but the girdled branch has even more.
Girdled:
Non-girdled:
Itās been less than a month, but some of the girdles are healing up:
The above girdle is at a rental, where most of the branches have no fruit yet, but the girdled one is below:
Hereās an Elkwood/Bowmont, which was girdled much later than the others (7/11 vs 6/22-6/26 for the first round)
Girdled branch, with lots of small fruit forming:
Non-girdled branch (no fruit yet on any of the non-girdled branches):
Iām not sure why it has some brown flowers. Several of the non-girdled Elkeood branches were like that, but none of the other cultivars at that site (or even on that tree) had any. I think @mamuang had some that she blamed on GA3.
I have some other shy bearers where the girdled branch seems to have a lot more fruit, on the order of 5-10X as much, compared to similar non-girdled branches. Both Chico and Ant Admire seem to be helped quite a bit, at least so far.
I think girdling promotes fruit for the same reason pruning the tops of new growth off, by keeping the nutrients/energy in the branch. Girdling keeps it from going down to the roots, while cutting growing tips off stops it from being āwastedā on growing more wood. Doing both at the same time means that the tree shrugs its shoulders and says āI guess I might as well make some fruitā¦ā
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Some people earlier in this thread were concerned about fruitset when it rains a lot. Aside from lack of sun, I donāt think it is an issue at all. Weāre recently had a lot of rain showers (thunderstorms), as well as plenty of sun and the jujube seem to be setting as well or better than ever.
In fact, I have a somewhat shady rental where the jujubes get maybe half sun and are setting a surprising amount. In the past, Iāve only gotten some Honey Jar and a few fruit from Sugar Cane. This time, I see both Li and Yazoo Li setting a decent amount, as well as heavier than usual Honey Jar and Sugar Cane sets.
Aside from more rain, the other difference is that Iāve been more frequent with my fertilization. Iāve almost completely gone through a 40 lb bag of fertilizers (13-13-13 with sulfer) in about a month. Granted that is for about 100 jujubes (plus a few other fruit trees, as well as some potted treesā¦), but Iām applying it at a greater clip than before.
Hereās another pic of girdling- something I didnāt do any of at the shaded site, though I may next year.
I should add that while Iāve been very hesitant to even consider girdling in the past, Iāve taken to it in a very short time. Itās like having a switch I can throw to tell the tree to start making fruit. And it doesnāt take more than 20-30 seconds to do, so it is pretty easy.
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