Pecan


#241

@Fusion_power

I can’t find that link to your pollination chart. I’ve been up and down this thread several times. I need to update my copy I saved a while ago. Please post again.

Dax


#242

I just uploaded an update last night. There are several changes that you might like. It is in the pecan pollination thread.

or a direct link

http://www.selectedplants.com/miscan/PecanPollination.xlsm


#243

bambooman asked about sources of seedling trees for grafting in Georgia. I have no idea the prices they charge so call and ask. Verify the variety they are growing for seedlings. Southern plantings are most often on Elliott. From North Alabama to Kentucky either Stuart or Major. I don’t know for sure what is used in extreme northern locations.

Shiloh Pecan Farms
P.O. Box 306
Ray City, GA 31645
229-455-4758
229-247-2890

Delta-View Nursery
Leland, Mississippi
1-800-748-9018
hardwoods@teinfo.com


#244

Thanks Darrel, looks like I’ll be making some phone calls on Tuesday.


#245

Hi Steve, I didn’t see your question ever get answered (though I see you asked it long ago). How long is your frost-free growing season? I think a short season and lack of heat units might doom even the ultra-northern pecans to failure there, but maybe they would produce at ~5000’. Its possible some of the earliest ripening Carpathian Walnuts would produce (Lake? Somers? Kalispell?). Hybrid Hazelnuts would likely produce as they’re very early ripening. Korean Pines should also produce nuts but I believe are very slow to bear.

Cheers,
Kirk


#246

I’ve heard from multiple sources that Elliot is known for it’s high oil content and rich flavor. The owners at Ellis Bros. Pecan told me they are trying to “wean” their customers off of Elliot because of its tendency to alternate bear too much for commercial production. Are there any cultivars that have a similar oil content and flavor that does well in the Deep South? Do any of these cultivars have a future in commercial production? Of course, scab resistant would be critical.

Thanks!


#247

You don’t make it easy. To my knowledge, no pecan combines pest resistance, scab resistance, good flavor, plus consistent production in a package that is better than Elliott. Here is the blurb Patrick Conner wrote about Elliott.

The only two varieties I know of described as having a unique “hickory” flavor are Elliott and Farley. I’ve seen some Kanza that were very good pecans, but they don’t taste like a hickory the way Elliott does.

My opinion - based on a LOT of study but very little direct experience with Elliott - is that a home grower in a region capable of growing Elliott should consider growing it. Elliott won’t grow much further north than Birmingham Alabama and even then needs to be on a cold tolerant rootstock.


#248

Stuart and Mahan predominated in the old grove back home at Auburn, AL(probably planted around 1900)… there may have been other varieties, but at the time I wasn’t paying much attention.
My uncle had a tree in his yard, up the road at Lafayette, that may have been Elliott - he always said it had more of a ‘hickory’ flavor than others.

Most of my good-cracking hickories here are pretty bland… not all that much in the way of a strong hickory/walnut flavor… I prefer them for cooking, but if I were just gonna sit down and eat handsfuls of nuts as a snack… I prefer pecans.


#249

That’s disappointing to hear. I didn’t realize the better cracking hickories sacrificed anything in terms of flavor. If I wanted great hickory flavor and the best cracking traits possible would you have any recommendations?


#250

cuz,
Maybe I’m over-critical, but I really don’t notice a strong hickory/black walnut flavor in the nuts I’ve been eating for the past 20 years… but, I’ve largely been restricted only to local natives… two of which are exceptional crackers… this year’s crop of ‘Morris #1’ shagbark nuts has cracked out, consistently, with probably better than 75% intact halves; I probably should have held back a quart of nuts to send in to the KY State Fair competition next summer. My other local selection, ‘Sinking Fork’, won 1st place at the state fair, back in 2001, when I submitted a sample batch… but Nebraska NGA labeled it as ‘bland’, in their assessment of flavor - but crackout and kernel% was was good.

While I’ve got somewhere upward of 30+ named hickory varieties grafted and growing here, of my grafts, only Simpson #1 has yet produced any nuts, and I’ve either planted or given away the few nuts the 2 or 3 Simpson trees have produced to date.

I’d defer to Fred Blankenship for assessment of multiple varieties for crackout and flavor. I think Dax has listed Fred’s top picks at some point in time… maybe he’ll do so again.

Mockernut hickory has, IMO, excellent flavor, rivaling or surpassing black walnut, but shell thickness and internal convolutions make it virtually a non-starter… unless someone could find a thin-shelled mockernut that shells out something more than tiny little nutmeat fragments scooped out of the valleys between internal ridges.


#251

@cousinfloyd

As Lucky points out, crackability always comes first.

I’m going to copy paste notes and you can sort of pick and choose as it would be said. These came from conversations with Fred Blankenship:

Fred Blankenship said if he could redo his orchard today (2015 phone conversation) he would grow Gary Fernald’s unknown hican; ‘Grimo-5’ shagbark; and shagbark ‘Grainger’. Fred stated that ‘Grainger’ had hardly any (parts of the inside shell that hold the nut in place) so it is a very easy to get the nut meat out, selection. It’s also the size of a shellbark nut.

Fred also says about ‘Porter’ shagbark: “Porter is the best flavor + second best cavity.” " ‘Grainger’ has the best cavity."

‘Lizzie Mtn’ - Very thin shell. Shagbark. Originating from South Carolina at a plantation of hickory trees grown for lumber. The original name given to it is ‘Gralnik’

Fred’s shellbark picks are: Fayette, Selbher, Henning; Fred also likes Simpson #1 and Scoll. Scoll likes pecans, said Fred (pollination I assume.) Fred stated additionally that shellbark ‘Bullnut’ is a favorite of one of his friends. Fred’s ‘Fayette’ is different from scionwood that came from Larry Daulton. Larry Daulton’s Fayette is preferred. Tyler Halvin has wood distributed from Larry.

Gary Fernald has “Gary’s Hican” which he got his scionwood from Clifford Dabb’s who got it from Roscoe Pringle. At the time of visit with Clifford Dabb’s, Clifford suggested to Gary that he had several ‘different’ “???name???” hicans.

===

I believe we all now concur that “Gary’s Hican” is not a hican but a true shagbark hickory.

I’ve got a graft of Lizzie Mountain but it’s very small. Message me (anyone) if you want to know more about ‘Grimo 5’.

Dax


#252

I got out the boxes of pecans for stratification. I have roughly 10 pounds of nuts ready to bag up with peat moss and refrigerate. Some will be planted where they can eventually be grafted in place. The rest will be in a couple of nursery rows for graft and transplant.

Interesting info Dax. I haven’t talked to Fred in about 10 years What happened with 'Mitch Russell"?


#253

I think Fred is going to call you, Darrel. As we chatted this morning I went over to your tomato website and gave Fred your number and address.

I don’t know Mitch Russell.

Great website. I was very impressed with how you make your slats with a table saw and the white boxes. I read a lot and learned quite a bit, too.

Dax


#254

Mitch Russell is a putative shagbarkXshellbark hybrid, IIRC.
I think Tyler has it on one of his display boards.
I tried grafting it a time or two, but never got it going here.


#255

@Fusion_power you have been very generous with your time, knowledge, and samples/scions. Is there anything you are interested in acquiring? Most of my pecans are very new and are merely whips at this point. However, I do have various persimmons, pears, and even bamboo. I haven’t seen you posting any scions wants, but I am more than glad to help out if I can.


#256

BambooMan, over the years, I have benefited from knowing Gerald Gardner, Les Wilmoth, Fred Blankenship, Wilbur Donoho, Bill Lane, David Griffith, John Gordon, Jerry Lehman, John Brittain, Bill Goff, Larry Grauke, Darryl Sparks, and many others. Each was generous with scionwood, nuts, fruits, seed, and most of all with their time. I can do no less than they have done.

But on a different note, I was unsuccessful in 2014 getting Lake Icaria and T92 grafted. At some point, I would like to get scionwood to try again.


#257

I don’t have either, but I will keep my eyes open for those two cultivars. Of the people you’ve listed I’ve only met Jerry Lehman. I am very fortunate to have the opportunity to learn from people like you and Jerry. Also, thank you very much for the black walnuts. My father never tasted black walnuts so I think this will be a good introduction.


#258

I’ll get T-92 for sure and possibly Lake Icaria, Darrel.

Dax


#259

I called Fred Blankenship today and talked for about an hour. He shipped scionwood of Neel #1 and a few others to me in 1998. I got Pounds #2 from him in 2005 the best I recall. It was good to catch up with him on different varieties and seedlings he has growing.

I’ve been slowly and steadily updating the pecan pollination sheet. I have 70 varieties left to finish up.

Edit to add that I spent an hour on the phone with Wes Rice this evening picking his brain about northern and far northern pecan varieties. I incorporated the variety information into the spreadsheet. I’m also gaining a lot more appreciation that there are a ton of named varieties out there that should never have been considered for naming. Folks, if you have a really good variety of whatever nut or fruit, PLEASE do some work to have it evaluated by several other people before considering naming and releasing it! I have a seedling pecan in my yard that is 20 years old. The first time it produced nuts, I thought I had something good on my hands. Today I would tell you that there is no way it needs to be propagated. It rarely fills the nuts and is very susceptible to scab and powdery mildew. We have thousands of named varieties of pecan that really should be pared down to less than 100 that are worth propagating!

I ordered 10 Avalon pecan trees from Buck Paulk at Shiloh Pecan in Georgia. I will pick them up in January. If anyone wants to get some, he has about 100 total to sell. They are 2 to 3 feet tall so will be small trees and need extra care the first year!


#260

Meanwhile, I’m interested in cultivars of the Central American subspecies. Western Schley is the only one I’m aware of.