Replying to my own post here…
I have an update to my post. After further reading (but no experience) I believe the origin of these persimmons is in:
Yates - Indiana.
Pipher - graft on abandoned farmstead in central Illinois, retrieved in the 1980s by Ralph Knieder (town was USDA zone 5 at the time).
Pieper - Pennsylvania, mentioned as hardy in a book by a Canadian named John Gordon who wrote “Nut Growing Ontario Style”; parent tree of siblings Prok and Korp.
Therefore in my hypothetical (unproven) hierarchy I would relocate Pieper from tier 1 to category 3 “very early, cold hardy.” I am unsure about people pushing Pipher, so I’m leaving it out, but it could be tier 4 “early, cold hardy.” Note that the Canadian store Grimo Nut Nursery sells Campbell NC10, Pieper spelled as Peiper, Szukis, Gordon = Geneva Long, Garretson.
See also these threads regarding:
Just thought of this today, might be useful to you Jesse. John Gordon’s book on nuts and some fruits, there is a section on persimmons and the challenges of growing them further north: http://johnsankey.ca/songnews/nutgrowing.html#M
Here is an excerpt on varieties that have worked:
"Several native persimmons matured their fruit locally, even during recent short cool seasons.
Pieper persimmon produces ripe fruit even though it overbears and should be thinned. It is
worrying to see Pieper goin…
Good questions/points. As far as Pipher and Pieper go, I’m certain they are two different cultivars. Pieper is from Pennsylvania, and Pipher was a rediscovered legacy cultivar found in Illinois. There does appear to have been confusion over the years since they’re names are so similar and people aren’t always the most conscientious about such things. I have a nice blurb on Pieper written by John Gordon somewhere in my library; will try to dig it out when I get home. From what I understand (from …
This year was my first try at controlled breeding of persimmon - taking my cue from James Claypool, Jerry Lehman, and Don Compton. Looks like the pollinations took. Fingers crossed that I get mature seed in the fall. My crosses this year are:
H-118 x C-88
I-94 x C-88
L-89 x C-88
Had a bit of subterfuge by a crafty bumblebee when I unbagged one of my branches. No sooner did I get the bag off, and he flew in and crawled all over the flowers I had been isolating. Couldn’t have been any more eff…
Here’s the best description of Miller I could find.
[Screenshot_20250812-164424]
As for Pipher, Ralph Kreider found it in an abandoned orchard. The tree was planted something around 1913 but the original cultivar name was lost.
John Gordon told me years ago in an email that Korp is a sister of Prok, hence the name reversal. Prok is a pseudo-acronym for Persimmon Ralph Krieder (with a vowel for pronunciation). He indicated that both were seedlings of Pipher which is a large persimmon discovered by Ralph Krieder in Curro Gordo, IL in the eighties. Ralph told me that it was a very large, old graft left over from a forgotten farmstead that had since been subsumed into “progress”. The tree is dead and was removed years ago. …
Just thought of this today, might be useful to you Jesse. John Gordon’s book on nuts and some fruits, there is a section on persimmons and the challenges of growing them further north: http://johnsankey.ca/songnews/nutgrowing.html#M
Here is an excerpt on varieties that have worked:
"Several native persimmons matured their fruit locally, even during recent short cool seasons.
Pieper persimmon produces ripe fruit even though it overbears and should be thinned. It is
worrying to see Pieper goin…
[Early Jewel 18102024]
Here’s a pic from upstate NY zone 5 a/b today. This is my first time to have a named cultivar bear fruit (haven’t dared to taste yet). I have a seedling persimmon that bears tiny, seedy fruits, but is behind this one in terms of ripening. My location had a longer season this go-around. Growing season usually is done by the first full week of September, but we’ve gotten some extra weeks this year. The pictured H-118 was grafted on to an established seedling without a…
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