True…but things differ in different states. One reason attorneys aren’t ‘universally’ licensed to practice just any place.
1 Like
Some info on adverse possession in NY
Who Can Claim Property Based on Adverse Possession in New York? | Nolo
3 Likes
Agree with Nate, better to try to identify who your neighbors are and try to have a discussion to flesh out the details you are not aware of and if there can be a fuller agreement between you and neighbors.
2 Likes
Mystery Partially Solved!!
It was an answer no one guessed. It turns out it was not our direct neighbor or anyone related to him.
Remember I said we share that maple tree property line with our direct neighbors (a single acre square cutout of the estate that used to include our property). We know them well, and asked them first off who it was since two of their trees were also tapped. Across the road from their (our direct neighbor’s) driveway is a heavy machine business.
Someone (we still haven’t gotten their name yet) apparently went into that heavy machine business (again it’s across the road from any of the property in question) and asked the business for permission to tap the trees on the other side of the road. The machine business has no trees.
It was our direct neighbor who sleuthed out the situation.
A million more questions come to mind obviously but as of now we’re waiting to get a phone number for this individual. There is a local maple syrup business in this county so it’s possible it’s one of their individuals who just scouts around for free sap and takes a very liberal view of property permissions.
7 Likes
Glad to hear it wasn’t retaliation for the wild apple cider heist of 2021!
3 Likes
Reminds me of our ponds we have here on the farm. Every year we find people fishing on them. When asked who they are or who gave them permission to fish, they tell us they got permission from a friend or long ago relative long ago past.
We politely tell them we have been the owners for 25 plus years and request in the future they not fish here. In some cases we allow them to fish if they ask first.
This goes along with people we find hunting on our property. I’ve never had to call the law or game warden but, I’ve heard some crazy (BS) stories of who gave permission to be on the property.
8 Likes
Bingo, my experience as a landowner and a landowner’s son for the last nearly 60 years.
3 Likes
Don’t overreact, in most cases you don’t need to. Leave things as they were or in this case put back the buckets. Get the trail cam footage and see what you got going on. Talk with the guy let him tap the trees for a cut of the maple syrup. My family has feuded with other families plenty sometimes for generations why start it? It’s OK to let someone think they are getting over on you. Later you have time to correct that. Good fences make good neighbors. If your fence is 15 feet tall with razor wire 99% of people will not be over there. If it comes to that put an elk or 2 in there to explain the fence. Again I’m not suggesting you build a fence like that pointing out if you do this will not be an issue. Set people’s expectations on what you expect from them. All that said I’ve got a way of doing things that works. A neighbor once told me that I couldn’t hunt on my property as him and others decided it wasn’t allowed to hunt. I told him I was glad they felt that way it was more game for me to eat. My mother later shamed me for that , she correctly said I hadn’t hunted in many years. Told her it wasn’t about the hunting it was about them saying what I could do on my own property that got that response. Always keep my options open and wasn’t afraid to say the former land owner was not me and I have no agreement with you. Nothing in this world is perfect. Try to give people a way out where they can save face. Don’t take their buckets as that requires a response from them. Your unintentionally starting a fight with them that warrants a response. A woman once said my darn bees raided her cattles feed buckets for molasses and they proably did. Told her I was terribly sorry about that and brought her a quart of honey. She loved my bees going forward and gave me fresh milk for years. Some neighbors brought over beef or deer and I traded them for fruit or hay. Everyone has a need to live look for mutually beneficial relationships. That neighbor I said that to about hunting later became a friend. He respected me because I didn’t make him respond but let him know who he was dealing with.
6 Likes
I think I’d agree if it was neighbors who were tapping. But, if it is just someone who “scouts around for free sap and takes a very liberal view of property permissions” removing the buckets makes sense. In fact, if you knew that for sure, I would probably remove it all and leave it by the road for pickup with a note. But, given the ambiguity, I think forcing a response (as in, finding out who they are…) is actually the goal. Once contact is made, then it may be possible to reach a deal.
3 Likes
You’ve always got that option but you never have the option to unstart a fight. Realizing ofcourse you are right but my family taught me it’s better to get along with people than be right. They might spend the next 60 years getting you back for wronging them. Some feuds where my family are from have been ongoing hundreds of years. Something to consider before you worry to much about some sap and $20 worth of buckets they paid for. I’ll fight when I need to but it takes a lot of provoking as I look for alternative methods first. When I make an enemy I’m not planning to ever regret it. One of the benefits to coming from my family is I know what I’m getting into. Bob I certainly know your well within your rights to do that. Some areas require you be tougher than others.
I agree that it’s generally a good idea to avoid fights. But I also see what smsmith says about protecting property (and what you said regarding hunting). I think there’s enough ambiguity in this one (compounded by uncertainty about the identity) that it isn’t a clear answer. No matter what the result, I wouldn’t be planning to keep the buckets. If, after contact was established, a deal was reached, they’d go back the trees. If no deal (or after a week or two) or no contact, then everything gets put to the side (with a reasonably friendly note in the event of no-contact) so they can re-claim it.
2 Likes
In the old days my understanding is there was an incident of firewood stealing that had went on a long time. It’s my understanding the entire time it was easy to stop but Noone did. Once the thief was comfortable with stealing the firewood the owner of the firewood drilled out a stock of wood and filled it with gunpowder hammering the wood plug back in. When the stove blew up throwing hot ash and flame all over the home it stopped. It’s your firewood if someone confused your gunpowder storage container with a stick of firewood that’s their problem. That is a story i heard in my childhood i dont know what parties were involved but im sure it happened. Figure it’s your land and those are your Maples and those are their buckets. You always have an option to take the syrup everyday and fill the buckets back with water it’s your sap. Again I’d take the high road for now until I learned the situation. A friend once was steamed up and was heading out to shoot a pack of dogs that killed a flock of chickens. He called me asking for help as there were many of them. Explained I’d like him to calm down first. He said Clark my chickens are dead and the sheriff told me to shoot the dogs that did it. He was in the right ofcourse but I knew those were the sheriff’s deputy dogs. That may be the sheriff’s cousin or the judges nephews sap buckets. That’s just me but I’d here their side of it. That’s not even $10 worth of liquid. Would you really start ww III over some old sap and buckets? You don’t know the situation yet I’d let them explain it to me.
That story is somehow both hilarious and slightly troubling at the same time. I’ve got to imagine there could be legal liability at some point. For example, say they took it a bit further and decide to use the wood to store a chemical supply which just happens to produce poison gas when heated. I suppose they could get lucky if it was used at a family gathering and thus ended the feud. But, you’d probably be on safer legal footing to put some buckshot in the thief when he trespasses to take the wood…
Not a situation I’ve dealt with, but given that the sheriff gave him the go-ahead, I’d agree with your friend. At least he wouldn’t lose any more chickens to those dogs. Same as if raccoons, wolves, or foxes were taking his chickens. Now, that assumes he caught them red-handed (mouthed?) and they are still on his property. I’d be hesitant to chase them back home while waving a gun 
As I said, they’d get their buckets back, but may not get permission to keep tapping the trees.
1 Like
My friend thanked me profusely the deputy paid for the chickens. Imagine he would have shot those dogs he would start being pulled over every day. Asked him if i watched if he thought i could catch him breaking the law? He said likely something and i said yes if you killed his dogs he’d be watching. Those dogs belonged to that deputies little children. Being in the right is a fine line. Figure there is always time to fight later if you have to and they leave you no other options. I’d string up an electric fence around my chickens and shock the dogs to teach them and not kill them then everyone goes home. You the deputy, dogs and chickens all go sleep that night and there are no real bad feelings. There is likely legal liability for that firewood trick nowadays. I’m not sure what year it occurred or who did it. My family were farmers and they know its hard to farm and fight.
2 Likes
I agree. Same can be said about family and friends. Once you get upset and have heated words there is no way to put it back into a bottle. Best to use the tough approach only when you run out of options.
2 Likes
In this case the dogs we’re worried about are our dogs. They’re sweathearts once they know someone but one of the girls in particular (a boxer/shepherd) is very very territorial about her home. Our thinking was that since we now know this person is a random guy from the community and not our neighbor, if we put the buckets back he has no real incentive to call us, and might just keep going about his business figuring he can do whatever he wants with permission from the business across the street. If the dogs catch him on our property that interaction could go poorly and we want to protect him/her and them from a bad situation. So by taking the buckets we’re sorta forcing him to give us a call so that next time he comes on the property we will know it and the dogs won’t be an issue.
4 Likes
That makes more sense now. Wanted to lend you some of my experience. If you know who the gentleman is you can take the things by his house and drop them off. Again I always give them a way out. In that case I would pull the taps and hoses and buckets take them by his place. I’d thank him for tapping in the past for the last owner (if he had permission or not). I’d say my insurance company does not allow other people on my property due to liability. Then I would thank him again and say very nice to meet and I’d leave. The less you say the better.
4 Likes
id nail a beware of dog sign to the 1st tree and take a pic of it to cover yourself should they get bit. i had to do that to my front door as my wifes uncle is hard of hearing and just walks right in. my female is the same as yours. we have to introduce people to her then shes fine.
5 Likes
That’s a very good suggestion Steve. No trespassing is another thing to post just to make sure you cover all the bases.
5 Likes
or, God forbid, they hurt themselves on your property. people sue for anything nowadays.
3 Likes