You can’t go wrong with Bristol or Jewel
Bristol was more productive vs Jewel head-to-head and it is a week or so earlier (and may taste a little better)
But I love Jewel and it is my favorite among all our raspberries; both avoid SWD as floricanes; Jewel is a bigger berry and so easier to pick
I bought some ‘Black Cap’ rasps from Burnt Ridge last year.
It says its native ‘throughout WY’ so i kinda wondered if the zone listing was correct as Wyoming has some pretty cold locations.
It really stands out amongst the others as its canes are rife with spines.
As noted Burnt Ridge sells/sold ‘seedlings’ which means that they grow true to seed…and they are listed as native… so i bought some for myself and the birds to make them native here.
Some folks call them ‘black caps’ some call them blue raspberries and some call them purple.
Not on topic at all but for all i know it might be ‘the best black raspberry’ i should have fruit this year…and might plant some seeds if they are worthy of growing for biodiversity.
Plant Bristol for taste
That depends where you are. We have two or three very different black raspberries. The biggest black raspberry I have seen is from a wild found in Ontario. I used the wild in breeding and the results are some really large black raspberries. The wild and it’s seedlings also are very prolific.
Lynn’s Black (Niwot x Ontario wild)
Is Lynn’s Black a primocane through Niwot?
Yes, the trait appears to be dominate. Those are floricane berries. The primocane are even bigger. More info on Lynn’s here. It’s a beast of a plant. I tip rooted one to give away and let it grow a year first. It turned into this massive crown which put out numerous canes. When I dug it out each cane separated and had roots. Like three or four plants in one. Each with good size canes. Hopefully they are doing well in their new homes. And if not let me know we can try again.
id be willing to test their cold hardiness if you care to share some cuttings. 
I grew 3 varieties of black raspberry and was always disappointed by their taste. It was such a mild taste. Mine all tip rooted. They were fun looking likes a row of hoops.
Hey Mrsg!
Yes they can be bland but not all are created equal.
With the right conditions and the right cultivar they can be good. The small wild ones are very good without being acidic. Hard to forage though as you need so many. I still do most years. I still like reds better. I use blacks for fresh eating and any extras are used to sweeten tart fruit. Like they tone down honey berries quite well in a jam or syrup and I can avoid using a lot of sugar.
Our spring moves quickly into summer. I love the reds!
wow they look huge and delicious!
I’ve been growing Jewel for more than 15 years. They’ve never been diseased, and are vigorous as all get out. I’m in zone 7A (St. Louis). They always say not to grow black raspberries near blackberries, but I’ve been growing them alongside Prime Jan and Prime Jim for the whole time I’ve had them. That brings to mind something else. It seems like all of the new Arkansas primocane varieties have Prime Jim in their ancestry, but none mention Prime Jan. I wonder why that is. Prime Jan goes off patent in a few weeks, and Prime Jim does in June. U Ark calls both of them “obsolete,” but they still use Prime Jim as a parent, or grand-parent or both.
I grow ohio treasurse, but just because it is primocane fruiting and I’m too lazy to prune a floricane one.
Nothing is absolute. Keep that in mind. I found what works for me. You’ll find what works for you.
How was the flavor? I have a few plants that produced last year. The fruit was huge, but the flavor was insipid.
I’ve seen all of the stuff you posted. My curiosity was why Prime Jim is used for breeding, but not Prime Jan. Having grown both since they were first sold, I like the Jans better. Neither taste great, but the birds get the floricane crop, and don’t really touch the primocane berries. Jan suckers like crazy. Every year I dig up those things from out in the yard. You can tell the difference because the Jims are very erect, and the Jans notably less so. As far as obsolete goes, some older models are still going strong. A guy in our community garden just planted Natchez in his plot. In 2024, if I were going thornless, it would be something like Black Gem or Ponca, but he probably just went to Home Depot or something. He probably should have asked me, as I’m known in the garden as a blackberry/raspberry nerd.
Probably the reason for so many cultivars coming from Jim is tens of thousands of plants are grown. More than one good one is often found. They probably don’t want to flood the market with ten new cultivars at once. As time goes on new plots will be planted and another ten cultivars will be chosen. Depending on what they want I’m sure new stock is grown as much as they have room for. it’s not unusual to take 13 years or more from first planted to released to public. I would say it’s about the norm.
Niwot took about 17 years before it was released. Some get release in less then ten years, but I bet it’s a rare thing.
If you are wondering if newer cultivars are being used to develop new cultivars, I’m sure they are. We will find out either way in 10-15 years from now after full evaluations are done.
The longest studied plant I can think of is the Raz blueberry which was developed in 1934 by Dr. Frederick V. Coville it was released in 2011. By that time Dr. Frederick V. Coville was dead for 62 years. The 2011 released was just to propagate, official release to the public was much later. M.K. Ehlenfeldt help release it. I really like most of the blueberry releases by M.K. Ehlenfeldt. He retired about 5 years ago, but his last pick was just released fairly recently Nocturne. They may have others? I don’t know? The M.K. Ehlenfeldt releases I grow are Nocturne, Legacy, Cara’s Choice ( M.K. Ehlenfeldt favorite), Razz, and Pink Lemonade.
its ok. I’m not a big fan of raspberries in general. black raspberries are resistant to juglone and I have a bunch of black walnuts on my property (that secrete juglone) so I’m really just growing them for their juglone resistance and because my kids eat tons of fruit, black raspberries included. raspberries in the store are EXPENSIVE lol.
Here is his page…he was a busy guy. I think the latest of his releases is Talisman.
https://www.ars.usda.gov/people-locations/publications/?person-id=1556
Many times I’ve found that new threads touch on existing topics which have thoroughly been addressed. I also like to re-share those applicable topics for reference.
I found some “thornless” (fuzzy soft hair-like thorns) black raspberries at a job site last month which were only around waist height. I’m optimistic that they will like their new home and have good quality fruit. If so I already have a name picked out.
