Indeed. Can’t sell something that sounds like crap.
Even worse it’s obvious the bulk of online sites use the exact same description of the tree and fruit.
Not surprising as they aren’t really growers per se. They are middle folks that perhaps only host the trees for a season or so from somewhere to somewhere else.
Here in the forum we get honest feedback of individuals opinion of a fruit and it’s great to know we have different palates and taste buds as well.
No, for the most part the roots develop resources from nutrients in the soil.
This is a good plan. Even if you were to start 10/1 and the 1st sub 45° temperature was 10/25 the outcome would be the same.
I recommend you only count a contiguous hour at or below 45° and any part thereafter. So a contiguous low of only 40 minutes wouldn’t be included in your total. But a contiguous low period of 4.3 hours would add 4.3 hours to your total.
For my Prunus I consider 10/1 to 4/1.
I was referring to the gamut of M. domestica cultivars.
It’s fun to play with numbers.
My station records conditions every 5 minutes. I just do a lookup based on the temp criteria and return a value that I sum, so I’m not rounding up to an hour from a fraction. There may be nights that barely touch 45, but I think they are pretty infrequent.
Regardless there is no magic with the 45° temperature. It’s not as though the tree can differentiate slightly above or below. It should be close enough knowing it’s all a bit of a crap shoot anyway.
That on the whole tree resources being generated and stored in the roots. I guess it would be better to say the tree stops sending those resources up into the above ground tree at some point in the fall or early winter?
I have no schooling in botany so… Should get a book though.
One was recommended to me by the horticulturalist at Raintree.
Coppice Agroforestry, by Mark Krawczyk.
“Plant Propagation” edited by Alan Toogood. Either the AHS or DK edition, no difference under the cover. Available inexpensively as a used textbook.
“The Biology of Horticulture”, Preece & Read.
As I’ve mentioned to many people …
The life center of a perennial fruit tree is underground. Everything above ground is solar panels and sex.
I find it interesting that for certain tree crops (say Prunus) chill hours for you gents seem equally as valuable as GDUs are for me in a northern location. I am happy to have passed 1,800 today for the year (based on 50 F.) I am curious to see if and which fruits ripen strictly by GDUs, and which ripen by amount of frost free days, or a mixture of both. For instance, will most of my hybrid plums ripen at 1750 GDUs or 100 days after the last hard freeze? I am keeping track to find out. Back to the Harrow series, I currently only have Harrow Sweet, and it is fantastic for quality and flavor. It ripens in late September early October for me, something probably to the tune of 2,100 GDU’s or 130 freeze free days. I hope to know better in several years.
I guess they all work in an area with a 12 month growing season, like southern CA. But Kevin admits his apple bloom season is six months. So, one had better have a 12 month growing season. My growing season is 7-8 months. Frost free 6 months. So, a six month blooming season doesn’t work unless you’ve got a use for green unripe apples in November.
A six month bloom here would be late March until late September. Great, good luck with that. We need some chilling or it doesn’t work.
Two years ago my late apples were ruined by a 36 hour 20F freeze in late October. It also half killed my 40ft tall pecan tree.
I’d never heard of GDUs…which gives away that I don’t live in the north or the high mountains.
Nice site here to calculate for you.
I’m already over 5000… Not that it’s important here.
Interesting.
I do not have a 12 month growing season. If I did, then avocados, bananas, and citrus would be ripe within 9 months instead of within 18.
I use that website a lot for comparisons with other growers climates. It is a very good resource. I am finding routinely that at my farm I run about 100-150 units more than Pioneer’s Calculator. For some places within a 10 mile radius Pioneers Calculator may be even closer because of all the microclimates created by Lake Superior and the hilly topography.
No you don’t, for Tropicals/subtropicals. But you do for apples. You can harvest apples in January or February, I can’t. And they’ll ripen some right thru winter.
There was an apple grower near Santa Cruz. Right by the ocean. He harvested apples right thru winter. I forget what forum he posted on. I don’t think it was here. I believe he since moved to Socal and Hawaii, needing more warmth. It’s cold up there. I think his apples got enough chilling but he still harvested some very late. And that gave a special flavor that he loved to certain varieties.
Kevin says Lady Williams ripens in February in Riverside. And also that Fuji takes 200 days from bloom to fully ripen. I think I’ll try those on MM-111 in my greenhouse where I can harvest in mid winter. I’ve never tried an apple in there.
@fruitnut
I’d agree that chill hour models have the same issue as USDA cold hardiness zones: they only address a portion of the local climate.
I’ve enjoyed growing White Winter Pearmain apple here, 2-3 flowerings and crops per year in all. But you know, most years the apples don’t ripen all the way through to the core. Instead the inner half (radius wise) is grainy and/or mealy – even after they fall off the tree. The outer half is delicious. I’ve come to believe that they don’t experience enough heat units within the cultivar’s fruit production cycle. Consequently I’m going to try Black Limbertwig in that location next.
I haven’t experienced any of this with the pears I’ve grown in Rancho Peñasquitos nor the Hood pear here in western Vista (eastern members: out here climate zones can vary by the mile). I’m hopeful the Warren and Seckle pears follow suit.
Harrow delight took heavy fireblight damage last year. Harrow sweet is noticably more resistant.