25 Harrow pear varieties

Genetics is interesting on these crosses. These are not my photos or descriptions please see the links and documents.

HW 600 unamed above
Bartlett x US 386

HW 601 unamed above
Bartlett x Maxine

HW 602 harvest queen

HW 603 harrow delight
Screenshot_20230426_144151_Gallery

Description
This is a high-quality hybrid pear tree (Old Home x ‘Early Sweet’) x ‘Bartlett’ with an early bearing character. It is very resistant to Blight and Pear Scab.

Although The Harrow Delight Pear tree is a heavy fruit bearing tree, it will take 2 to 3 years before your young tree will begin to produce fruits. Its highest fruit production will occur every 2 years.

HW 604 unamed above

Harrow 604 : Somewhat spreading growth habit, well spurred, low vigor, very precocious, early ripening, fire blight susceptible, hardy in Zone 4, injured at -33F. Fruit has long neck, yellow, size small to medium, outstanding flavor, ripe early August in SW MN.

HW 605 unamed above
Seckel x Bartlett
Seckelxnj6
HW 606 bliss
HW 607
HW 608 delicious
HW 609 harrow sweet
‘Harrow Sweet’ pear (Pyrus communis L.)
is a high-quality, late-season pear for the fresh
market. It is precocious, productive, hardy,
and has excellent resistance to fire blight
[ Ewinia amylovora (Burr.) Winslow et al.].
This new cultivar, developed by the Agri-
culture Canada Research Station at Harrow,
Ont., is recommended by the Ontario Tender
Fruit Producers Marketing Board for trial
planting in Ontario. It is also recommended
for commercial culture in France (Masseron
and Trillot, 1991).
Origin
‘Harrow Sweet’ originated from a cross of
‘Bartlett’ × ‘Purdue 80-51’ (Fig. 1) made in
1965 by R.E.C.L. Also originating from this
cross was ‘Harrow Delight’, released in 1981
(Quamme and Spearman, 1983). ‘Harrow
Sweet’ was selected by H.A.Q. and propa-
gated for a second test at Harrow in 1980.
Trees were propagated in cooperation with
the Western Ontario Fruit Testing Assn.
(WOFTA) and, under the designation HW-
609, placed in regional trials with cooper-
ating growers beginning in 1983. ‘Harrow
Sweet’ was also propagated, under an agree-
ment with WOFTA, by the New York State
Fruit Testing Cooperative Assn. (NYSFTCA),
Geneva, and distributed for advanced test
beginning in 1988. ‘Harrow Sweet’ is being
tested in Canada, the United States, Europe,
and New Zealand.
Description
The fruit matures 18 Sept. at Harrow, 23

HW 610 harrow crisp

In controlled pollination tests, fruit set
was used to determine pollen compatibility
when pollen from a known source was ap-
plied to stigmatic surfaces immediately after
emasculation of the flower. Because emascu-
lated pear flowers are even less attractive to
bees and other pollinating insects than
nonemasculated flowers, bagging was not
considered necessary. ‘AC Harrow Crisp’
will not consistently pollinate ‘Bartlett’,
‘Bosc’, or ‘Anjou’, especially when spring
weather is warm and humid; however, under
the cooler conditions experienced in Spring
2000, ‘AC Harrow Crisp’ pollinated ‘Bartlett’,
‘Bosc’, ‘Anjou’, ‘Flemish Beauty’, and ‘AC
Harrow Gold’, but these cultivars did not
adequately pollinate ‘AC Harrow Crisp’. Also
in 2000, pollination of emasculated flowers
of ‘AC Harrow Crisp’ with pollen of ‘AC
Harrow Crisp’ resulted in adequate fruit set
for commercial production. Seed set in ‘AC
Harrow Crisp’ tends to be low, and large-
sized fruits can develop with few or no viable
seeds.

HW 611 unreleased
HW 612
HW 613
HW 614 sundown

Origin

‘Harovin Sundown’ pear originated from a cross of ‘Bartlett’ × US56112-146 (Fig. 1) made in 1972 by H.A. Quamme. ‘Harovin Sundown’ was selected in 1980 by H.A. Quamme and propagated for a second test at Harrow in 1984 by F. Kappel. Trees were propagated in cooperation with the Western Ontario Fruit Testing Association (now the Ontario Fruit Testing Association) and, under the designation HW614, placed in grower trials beginning in 1986. It was also planted in regional evaluation orchards established in 1992, and in 1999, ‘Harovin Sundown’ was included in a large-scale pear trial planted for commercial processing evaluation of fire blight-resistant cultivars and selections. ‘Harovin Sundown’ is currently being tested in Canada (Ontario, Nova Scotia, and British Columbia), the United States (New York), and Europe (France, The Netherlands).

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Fig. 1.

Pedigree of ‘Harovin Sundown’ pear.

Citation: HortScience horts 44, 5; 10.21273/HORTSCI.44.5.1461

Description and Performance: Tree Characteristics

Tree habit and productivity.

The tree of ‘Harovin Sundown’ is medium in size, conical and upright to spreading, annually productive, and winter-hardy, producing a good crop after exposure to winter minimum temperatures as low as –29 °C. There has been no evidence of biennial bearing. Precocity of ‘Harovin Sundown’ on standard (Bartlett seedling) rootstock appears to be similar to that of ‘Bartlett’ with trees coming into production ≈4 years after planting. Annual yields of harvested fruits have been equal to or greater than those of ‘Bartlett’, especially in areas where fire blight has adversely affected the productivity of ‘Bartlett’.

Shoot habit.

The bark on the sun-exposed side of dormant shoots is orange–brown [RHS code 175A or 175B; Royal Horticultural Society (RHS), 1966]. After the 2006 growing season, the internode length (mean ± se, n = 200) of ‘Harovin Sundown’ was 38.2 ± 0.4 mm as compared with that of ‘Bartlett’ (32.7 ± 0.3 mm), ‘Harrow Sweet’ (29.1 ± 0.4 mm), ‘AC Harrow Crisp’ (32.6 ± 0.4 mm), and ‘Beurré Bosc’ (46.0 ± 0.6 mm).

Leaves.

Leaves of ‘Harovin Sundown’ are elliptic, the shape of the base of the leaf blade is right-angled, and the shape of the upper part of the leaf blade is right-angled with pointed or broad acuminate tips. There is little curvature of the midrib. Leaf serrations are small and shallow but distinct. The angle between the petiole and the shoot is less than 30°, the petiole is medium in length (mean ≈24 mm, range, 15 to 32 mm), and stipules are sometimes absent. The attitude of the leaf in relation to the shoot is outward (i.e., leaves are predominantly horizontal on vertical shoots rather than pointing upward or downward). Actively growing shoot tips are reddish green with light pubescence.

Fire blight tolerance.

Like with other introductions from the AAFC pear breeding program formerly located at Harrow (Hunter et al., 1992, 2002a, 2002b; Quamme and Spearman, 1983), ‘Harovin Sundown’ has excellent resistance to fire blight (caused by E. amylovora), similar to or greater than that of ‘Kieffer’, which is used as the standard for selection (Hunter, 1993). Using natural fire blight infection scores (from van der Zwet et al., 1970), ‘Harovin Sundown’ had a resistance rating much greater than that of ‘Bartlett’ (Table 1). When actively growing shoot tips were inoculated with a mixture of six virulent strains of E. amylovora, the length of the lesion that developed extended to ≈12% of the current season’s growth, similar to ‘AC Harrow Crisp’ and ‘Harrow Sweet’, but less than ‘Kieffer’ and much less than lesion development in ‘Bartlett’ (Table 1). Similar results have been obtained in greenhouse studies using young grafted trees (data not presented), suggesting that rootstock has little impact on relative susceptibility to this pathogen.

Table 1.

Summary of fire blight evaluations of ‘Harovin Sundown’ at AAFC, Harrow, Ontario, Canada.

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Bloom and pollination.

First bloom and full bloom of ‘Harovin Sundown’ are both ≈2 d later than ‘Bartlett’, and this attribute may lead to less blossom damage caused by spring frosts. Flower clusters typically contain seven flowers, occasionally six or eight, rarely five or nine. Petals are white, broad ovate, and are slightly apart to just touching with no overlap. When the flower is just opening, anthers are pink to dark pink (RHS code 51A, 58A, 58B), but anther color changes rapidly once the flower opens. Anthers are large in size and are level with or slightly above the stigma when the flower is fully open.

Pollen compatibility has been assessed using pollination records from the breeding program and from a limited number of crosses made specifically for this purpose using methods described earlier (Hunter et al., 2002a, 2002b). Generally, a fruit set of greater than 20% is required for commercial fruit production, whereas fruit set less than 10% suggests incompatibility. Results have been inconsistent over the years, and, in some cases, fruit set has varied widely from year to year. ‘Harovin Sundown’ has successfully pollinated ‘Beurré d’Anjou’, ‘Bartlett’, ‘Beurré Bosc’, ‘Clapps Favorite’, ‘Flemish Beauty’, ‘AC Harrow Crisp’, ‘AC Harrow Gold’, and ‘Swiss Bartlett’. Cultivars that have successfully pollinated ‘Harovin Sundown’ include ‘Beurré Bosc’, ‘AC Harrow Crisp’, ‘AC Harrow Gold’, and ‘Swiss Bartlett’, whereas ‘Bartlett’ pollen does not consistently produce adequate fruit set for commercial production. There is also some evidence from controlled pollination trials for self-compatibility in ‘Harovin Sundown’. Fruit production in commercial trial orchards planted to ‘Bartlett’, ‘AC Harrow Crisp’, ‘AC Harrow Gold’, ‘Swiss Bartlett’, ‘Harovin Sundown’, and HW620 (a selection currently undergoing advanced testing) has equaled or exceeded provincial averages for all cultivars, indicating that this combination of cultivars allows for adequate crosspollination under Ontario, Canada, conditions.

‘Harovin Sundown’ tends to produce secondary flower clusters, which can lead to the development of a late-ripening second crop. Secondary flowering has not resulted in increased fire blight infections.

Fruit Characteristics

Shape and color.

Fruit are symmetrical and ovate–pyriform to turbinate in shape (Fig. 2). In profile, the fruit shape is convex to almost straight and has been rated mostly as 3.3 and 5.3 using International Board for Plant Genetic Resources (IBPGR) descriptors (Thibault et al., 1983); individual fruits have received IBPGR ratings (listed in decreasing order of frequency) of 3.3, 5.3, 1.3, 3.1, 5.1, and 7.1. The calyx is persistent at harvest with short to medium length sepals that are convergent to upright. Based on visual estimates, the calyx basin is medium depth, medium to broad in width, and the margin is slightly ribbed. When harvested, fruits are green with a red blush on the sun-exposed fruit surface. After ripening at ≈20 °C, the skin develops a very attractive golden yellow ground color (RHS code 11A or 11B), whereas the blush on sun-exposed fruit surfaces becomes more orange than red. The skin is very smooth and there is no russeting of the fruit. The flesh is white to cream white in color (RHS code 158A or 158B), very fine in texture, grit-free, and becomes buttery and very juicy when fully ripe. The fruit has a strong intense pear flavor. Core breakdown has not been a problem with this cultivar.

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Fig. 2.

Fruit of ‘Harovin Sundown’ pear.

Citation: HortScience horts 44, 5; 10.21273/HORTSCI.44.5.1461

Yields and fruit size.

In a commercial orchard planted in 1999 in Niagara Region, Ontario, the first harvest of commercial yield of ‘Harovin Sundown’ occurred in 2003, the same year as ‘Bartlett’ in the same orchard (Table 2). Annual production of ‘Harovin Sundown’ increased during the first 5 production years, and the cumulative yield of ‘Harovin Sundown’ was ≈14% greater than that of ‘Bartlett’. In this commercial orchard, mean fruit weights for ‘Harovin Sundown’ and ‘Bartlett’ were ≈231 g and ≈135 g, respectively (Slingerland, unpublished data). Fruits of ‘Harovin Sundown’ are similar in size or slightly larger than those of ‘Bartlett’ on unthinned trees, but when thinned to two fruits per cluster according to Ontario recommendations for fresh market pear production (Ontario Ministry of Agriculture, Food and Rural Affairs, 2006), very large fruits, some greater than 76 mm in diameter, were produced. The fruit size distribution for thinned trees showed that for ‘Harovin Sundown’, ≈56% of the fruit weight and ≈43% of fruit numbers were in the greater than 70 mm classes, whereas the corresponding values for ‘Bartlett’ were ≈19% and ≈14% (Table 3).

Table 2.

Harvested fruit yields (t·ha−1) of ‘Harovin Sundown’ at St. Davids, Ontario, Canada, 2003–2007.z

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Table 3.

Fruit size distribution of ‘Harovin Sundown’ at AAFC, Jordan Station, Ontario, Canada in 2008.

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Maturity.

At Harrow, the fruit of ‘Harovin Sundown’ mature in mid-September, ≈3 weeks after ‘Bartlett’ and just before ‘Harrow Sweet’ (Table 4). At Vineland, ‘Bartlett’ was picked ≈1 Sept. and both ‘Harovin Sundown’ and ‘Harrow Sweet’ were harvested ≈22 Sept., a few days later than at Harrow.

Table 4.

Harvest date and fresh fruit evaluations for ‘Harovin Sundown’ at AAFC, Harrow, Ontario, Canada.

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Quality and storage.

Fruits were harvested each year at the normal level of maturity for commercial harvest of fruits for the fresh market (5 to 7 kg pressure). Samples of five to 10 fruits selected at random were ripened at ≈20 °C immediately after harvest and after 4 weeks in common cold storage at ≈2 °C. Evaluations were made on appearance, flavor, texture, number, and size of grit (stone cells) in the flesh, juiciness, and core size relative to fruit size. At Harrow, trained panelists rated the appearance of ripened fruit of ‘Harovin Sundown’ as very good, similar to ‘Bartlett, but with a lower score than ‘AC Harrow Crisp’ (Table 4). The fresh fruit quality, as indicated by the weighted score, of ‘Harovin Sundown’ was lower than ‘Bartlett’ and ‘AC Harrow Crisp’ (Table 4). Panelists sometimes reported an astringency associated with the skin of pears ripened shortly after picking, but this astringency was absent or not reported when fruits were ripened after ≈3 to 4 weeks in common cold storage at ≈2 °C. Fruits of ‘Harovin Sundown’ held in common cold storage at ≈2 °C until early to mid-January and then ripened for 2 to 3 d at room temperature have received acceptable ratings for appearance, flavor, and texture, whereas the quality of ‘Bartlett’ fruits start to decline by November (data not presented).

Processing evaluations.

When ripened fruit were processed as pear halves, ‘Harovin Sundown’ was inferior to ‘Bartlett’ in appearance, flavor, and texture (data not presented). Because of the large fruit size, fewer pear halves fit into a can, so it was difficult to obtain the legally required weight for that can size. Recovery was adequate when processed as a diced product. When processed as pear puree, ‘Bartlett’ was rated significantly better than both ‘Harovin Sundown’ and ‘AC Harrow Crisp’. Although the processed product from small-scale trials was rated good, the quality was not sufficiently high for ‘Harovin Sundown’ to have commercial acceptability for processing as halves or puree.

Availability

‘Harovin Sundown’ was tested at the Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) Sidney Laboratory, Sidney, British Columbia (formerly known as the CFIA Center for Plant Health, Saanichton, British Columbia), using woody-host and herbaceous-host biological indicators, and by serological and molecular methods, and was found to be free of all known viruses, virus-like agents, viroids, and phytoplasmas. Trees propagated from virus-tested budwood have been planted in the Canadian Clonal Genebank at Harrow, Ontario. ‘Harovin Sundown’ is protected under Canadian Plant Breeders’ Rights legislation and is subject to commercialization contracts. Inquiries regarding tree availability and licensing of commercial propagation may be addressed to Vineland Research and Innovation Center, P.O. Box 4000, 4890 Victoria Avenue N., Vineland Station, Ontario, Canada, L0R 2E0.

Literature Cited

  • Hunter, D.M. 1993 Pear breeding for the 21st century—Program and progress at Harrow Acta Hort. 338 377 383

  • Hunter, D.M. , Kappel, F. , Quamme, H.A. & Bonn, W.G. 2002a ‘AC Harrow Gold’ pear HortScience 37 224 226

  • Hunter, D.M. , Kappel, F. , Quamme, H.A. & Bonn, W.G. 2002b ‘AC Harrow Crisp’ pear HortScience 37 227 229

HW 615 unreleased
HW 616 harrow gold
Harvest Queen x Harrow Delight.

HW616 cv. USPP 16,124

AC™ Harrow Gold HW616 cv. ripens approximately 10 days before Bartlett and is a cross between Harvest Queen and Harrow Delight. The fruit are yellow with smooth skin and fine texture. AC™ Harrow Gold has a flavor that is balanced between sweetness and acidity. The variety is exceptionally juicy and the fruit are similar in size to that of Bartlett. Longer storage ability is limited with this selection. AC™ Harrow Gold was bred by Agri-Food Canada and has a high tolerance to fire blight.

HW 617 unreleased
HW 618
HW 619 unreleased
HW 620 unamed above
HW 621 unreleased
HW 622 unreleased
HW 623 happi
“Like a lot of other Harrow pears, Happi Pear is fire blight tolerant. It’s not resistant, but infections are less common, and strikes that do occur don’t run and spread. The cultivar also appears to be psylla tolerant, although the mechanism isn’t fully understood yet, Blakey said.”

HW623’ arose from the controlled cross of ‘Harrow Sweet’ and ‘HW605’ made in 1979 at Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada Research Station in Harrow, Ontario. It was selected as a hybrid seedling in 1988 and propagated by budding on pear seedling rootstocks. Trees were planted in an evaluation orchard at the Harrow Research Centre in 1993 and in November, 1999, trees in this orchard were relocated to the Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada Research Farm at Jordan Station. This selection was advanced and tested in regional trials in cooperation with the Western Ontario Fruit Testing Association beginning in 1994.

HW 624 dew drop

The new and distinct pear tree described and claimed herein originated from a controlled cross between ‘Harrow Sweet’ and ‘NY10353’ made in 1988 in Harrow, Ontario.

[23279834 - HortScience] `Harrow Sweet’ Pear.pdf (2.0 MB)

2327-9834-article-p227.pdf (58.9 KB)



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In reading some of these articles and links and doing a few searches, I don’t see much if any chill requirement info for the Harrow series.

A few nurseries say to zone 9 but that doesn’t really work as there is no agreement on what that means.

I didn’t find a single place where an hour estimate was shown.

It doesn’t mean it isn’t out there, but I didn’t find it.

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In my experience chill requirements don’t apply to descendents of European pears. I’m also aware that some don’t ripen properly in the heat+humidity of central FL, eg. Tampa Bay.

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Meaning they flower and set fruit but the ripening / quantity is uncertain right?

You’ve mentioned this about apples but never responded. The retail world is filled with chill requirement information. I’d think they could sell more if more trees can be grown in different areas than is indicated.

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They flower and set fruits that rot from heat and humidity before ripening. Notice that many near-tropic and tropical fruits have protective skins: avocado, banana, citrus, pouteria to name a few.

It was established 20 years ago by a member here (applenut) in Riverside CA.

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That’s pretty clear. It certainly is observed the amount of flowering and the duration of the bloom seems to be tied to those chill hours quoted everywhere, but the ability for a certain variety to handle the overall conditions in a warmer climate is and successfully germinate and hold the fruit is the issue.

Thanks

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This is false for apples. However, nurseries are very shy about changing their spiel (even when they know it’s wrong) for a number of reasons.

I suspect it is also true for pears but my experiences have not been as inclusive as applenut. He is now helping locals farm apples in equatorial Africa.

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I’ve been steering away from cider apples because they all seem to be higher chill than my area.

I wonder if I will find one with FB resistance

Since I will be buying some scions this winter anyway, I may grab a few of the better reviewed pears that I thought were just beyond my area’s reach and give the idea a go.

Certainly a cheap way to experiment.

Summarizing the information contained here is far more difficult than it appears. Many of these old fruit breeding programs have varieties never released or missing. Much of the information gets lost to time without websites like growingfruit.org…This was the previous attempt at breeding pears in Canada Canadian Pears Enie, Menie, Miney, Moe, Phileson, Sauvignac,

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Not surprised at all. Considering this is how evolution works giving most open pollinated fruit genetics that differ a bit from their parentage to enable successful ones to be naturally selected.

There are certainly tens of thousands of varieties of apple, plum, cherry, etc. In the world counting both domesticated and wild.

Just for the domesticated ones (which I am referring to as human maintained varieties and bred varieties) there is certain to be way too much information to easily find.

Complicating things is of course the fact that most of the information comes from the commercial field (rightly so) at select spots on the globe which are most certainly NOT my backyard or within many hundreds of mea of it.

This is a great forum

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I may not understand what you’re saying, but I don’t think it’s false for apples everywhere. California is a different winter than many other places with the same number of chill hours. What’s different is the variation in temperatures. California has very consistent winter temperatures compared to here. I’ve studied CA weather a lot. It’s normal for us to have as much variation in temperature in a week as you have in three months in winter.

The Utah chill model gives an inkling of why this matters. That model credits negative chill above 60F and no chilling below 34F. So our average week in winter with a high of 70 and a low of 20 has too many hours above and below the chilling range. A week of 60/30 has much more chilling but both average 45F.

We supposedly get 600-800 hours a year. More than that below 45. Some apples are very unhappy with that. Others couldn’t care less. As a result our bloom period for apples streches over three months. In Amarillo 400 miles north of here with ~1300 hrs below 45 had a bloom period of about one month for 50 apple varieties. In a northern climate with a long cold winter it’s more like two weeks.

Check with applenut. There’s a paper published 20 years ago.

California has 5 different USDA zones and dozens more Sunset zones with viable apple cultivation. Some of them have the steady winter temperature profile you describe but in my experience many others do not.

I have seen so-called low chill apples flower and produce acceptable fruit throughout the Pacific coast states and the entire Colorado/Green River drainage system.

Chill hour models are guestimate systems at best. They have some applicability to Prunus. Ed Laivo has much to say about them.

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Just a note on chill calculations. South Louisiana around Mandeville / Covington Louisiana, Zone 9a.

I have a personal weather station. I’m sure I’m not the only one on this forum that does.

I did some calculations for accumulation of chill hours at my home for this past winter.

I used the Utah and Modified Utah method.

The method that subtracts for warmer temps gives me about - 1300 chill hours. Yes that’s right. Negative.

Not using negative numbers for warmer temps gave me around 600 hours of chill.

I used October thru the last week of February as I got blooms then.

Even if I start the clock in November instead, I am still at a - 300+ hour count using the system with negative numbers above 60°.

From how my trees bloomed, or barely bloomed, both in number of flowers and span of time for the flowering, it’s obvious that the ~600 number isn’t right. Weeping Santa Rosa and my unsure of pluot trees I got very few blossoms and they were spread out over 3 or 4 weeks.

At the same time my Flavor Grenade was full of blooms in a tight period. So the ~-1300 number is nonsense as well.

Such is the way of things in my area for winters. Big temperature swings between fronts living next to a warm body of water being the Gulf of Mexico.

One issue I have even trying to calculate using any system is when do you start looking at numbers in the fall? First freeze? First frost? First time temperatures drop to 45° or below? When the tree starts dropping leaves?

How else can you tell when a tree has entered dormancy? Some trees may hold a good deal of leaves through the winter.

On the other end does it stop at bud swell? Bud break?

Again the whole system is geared towards commercial growing areas to help determine trees to choose for any particular area to turn the largest profit.

I’m sure any system you chose doesn’t work for every type of fruit. It doesn’t work for every variety of a particular kind of fruit.

Good times.

At the end of the day we have to see how a particular tree behaves in our setting, regardless of what anyone or any site says about that variety pt fruit tree.

Unfortunately we are being fed the chill hour numbers from the commercial side and the sales side to make choices from.

As I have read in university academic articles and industry articles, tests are done in comercial Orchards typically. Let’s say that particular orchard received 700 chill hours and the variety fruited well. So they publish that number, having no way to tell how much lower the number can be because that is just the weather they had.

I do see notes often on varieties at least stating a less than symbol…i.e. <700 hours. How much less? You have to find out yourself.

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That’s due to Ed Laivo’s influence. He’d agree with everything you wrote above.

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I spent some time looking at this because nerds like numbers to evaluate before making decisions. If the numbers are only loosely based on hard science they are not nearly as useful.

To finish off my thoughts, I think I will use the first low of 45° or below to start counting.

Why? The tree has spent all summer growing and has sent almost all of its resources (right @Richard? :blush:) to the roots. I don’t think warm weather works against the accumulation of chill at this time in the trees annually life. The temps have started to cool significantly (here) by that time and that should be enough of a signal that moderate warmth in fall would not add negatively to the total.

Well sure the low chill ones flower anywhere. Things like Honeycrisp or Ashmead’s Kernal, well that’s another story. Goldrush flowers early and easily here in late March and April. Gingergold flowers in April, May, and June, sometimes into July.

The Utah model was developed in Utah for areas with cold winters. It’s not intended for warm climates like south LA or even west Texas. You’re trying to grow fruits way outside the areas they are adapted to. Why is it so hard to understand that they can’t give you a good number for your area?

They aren’t well suited to my area either and I get way more chilling than you do. So I’ve figured out a way to double my outside chill hours in a greenhouse of all places. I heat to 37-40F .at night since our outdoor temps in winter are too cold at night. Then I use shade and evaporative cooling to lower the daytime temperature by 5-15F. That gets me in the perfect range all night and nearly eliminates the above 60F by day.

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Not hard to understand at all, but it’s the only tools out there to compare to advertised characteristics for chill hours (some calculation of temperature ands time).

I’m not complaining at all either. I’m just discussing what I see are the reasons it’s difficult to know what may be worth trying to grow for any particular spot.

Each state has an educational institution that publishes information on fruit tree locales and varieties to grow, but for a place with almost no commercial enterprise beyond a bit of citrus they don’t spent the time discussing and updating information on the miriad of choices out there today for someone to grow.

I’d say this forum had been a better tool for understanding the possible choices for me personally than an advertisement from a nursery which may as well be on another planet trying to sell their product.

:grin:

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I’ve learned an awful lot in 15-20 years on the internet. Maybe I’ve also added a few things to the mix.

Anyone that’s selling something can be biased and often are.

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