I assume this is the above grafted one is across the street from the 4 on the other side…
Aka this one
And the 4? across the street are which varieties? I think 2 were full of fruit and 2 weren’t (1st two were males maybe. Or #1 and #4 i forget).
I wasnt sure if any of these are Woodbine Sucker, or Tiny Teardrop, tried to use inaturalist to find a couple more but was too hard to navigate and find.
Well, there is a graft line indeed! Whelp.
Woodbine Sucker is paved over with a development now, even though a federally protected wetland was destroyed to do so. It exists onky in cultivation now. Buzz can correct me if im wrong.
Tiny Teardrop is Kitch. It’s at a dofferent location.
The Caln apts persimmon could be Early Golden or it could be something else, that is the question.
Whats the name of the 4 across the street from Caln apts? Not directly across, about half a block over in the Simpson retirement home area.
Im curious Caln Apt or those other 4 are known as any of these (even if pretend the Caln Apt one might be a grafted EG, does it also have another name its known by?):
PS @carya , these above descriptions are from your own Future Forrest site just realized :). Was going to grab a few scionwood from you once it opened.
All analysis to date of genomic relations of eukaryote organisms by genetic markers is grossly inaccurate, both in laboratory assay and determinations of genetic distance and clusters. Further, genetic markers are inapplicable to polyploids, e.g. persimmons.
England’s has this entry for Orchard #8 at home:
30. Hershey McKenzie Middle tree Persimmon 2020
Any idea what this might be?
Thank you for the advice!
As for MacKenzie Middle, maybe @Buzzferver could confirm wheter the mother tree was grafted.
Thanks for the info! I’m guessing much of our family tree will be based on stories people have shared.
Mackenzie Middle is the best of a group of 9 trees planted 3x3. No visible graft scars
Someone asked about Woodbine Sucker
It is a root sprout from a tree off Woodbine avenue. There was a grove there that was cut when the apartments were built and many exceptional trees were killed. This is si far the best of those root sprouts, its late ripening compared to most of the grafted selections in downingtown
NTN is a prefix that just means Nut Tree Nurseries… it identifies where the area where the tree was found, and the names like McKenzie Middle etc describe the particular trees. There isn’t just an “NTN” tree, it has to be “NTN ______”.
I understand, it was listed as NTN BUZZ (grafted 2018)…
@carya @jrd51 @Lech
I’d like to create a visualization of the known American persimmon breeding lines. I’ve gathered data from this thread and a few other sources to create a source data file. It’s not a database for end users. I’ll create one of those in the future.
It lists cultivars, but there are often multiple lines per cultivar due to multiple information sources.
For each cultivar, there is a sparse amount of information concerning synonyms, parents, the breeder, and current sellers.
The seller information is limited to those providing cultivars of interest. I made no attempt to list all U.S. sellers.
I welcome additions and corrections!
[EDIT: After building up quite a bit of data, I have thinned it down. What remains are only cultivars in circulation, with the exception of a few included in their ancestries.]
This link is to the xls spreadsheet. It will automatically update from the version on my desktop computer.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1pfcIEXLjb8TSR-wkJ0s2sNT7bYCFWZjJ/edit
According to a fairly recent post on Persimmon World by Darren BB of Brambleberry Farm that sells several Compton selections.
Dec Autumn 2 is really Claypool A-2.
DEC Pumpkin and DEC LG MB were erroneously labeled and are also Claypool A-2.
I can attest that the fruit on Pumpkin and LG MB seem identical. Also match the pictures he posted of A-2.
Like this (my persimmon previously known as DEC Pumpkin).
What does “LG MB” stand for?
Large Morris Burton?
Yes, Large Morris Burton, not that it matters now.
Is “Ami” at Brambleberry Farm short for “Kawakami” ?
Here’s some information I extracted from the source file, above. These will automatically update when I make changes to the source file.
[EDIT: After building up quite a bit of data, I have thinned it down. What remains are only cultivars in circulation, with the exception of a few included in their ancestries.]
Feral or Wild origin cultivars (spreadsheet):
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1qKBasknwBZ01InesZUX1wYzRMEfNWcCf/edit?
Unknown ancestry (spreadsheet):
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1q7mIJqJTUNfJcZONCPG3MHbrqlRXX0W_/edit?usp=sharing
Duplicate names (spreadsheet):
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1q8oMhSGwauoN3640Q1f3xAjswxlx5Jah/edit?usp=sharing
I don’t had much time recently.
‘‘Ami is from a tree growing behind a sushi restaurant called Ami in Bloomington IN.’’
Prok and Korp are not Pfiffer seedlings. They are Pipher offspring. I don’t know from where Gordon get the seeds. They could be from Slate so Garretson and Early Golden can be suspected as pollen donors.
J-127 is Runkwizt x EG. Like most of Claypool’s crosses the parentage is available in the pdf file Claypool orchard 2005 or some similar name.
Szukis, I came across some old Campbell’s note which made me think about origin of this cultivar. The seed source was Talbot’s nursery which use wild males and EG seedlings as pollinators. Likly part of EG male offspring inherit the dominant gene responsible for oposit-sex flowers. Going further, Szukis is quite dwarf as far as I know. Campbell noted that ‘Beavers’ seedling were remarcable small. After suming in all, I belive Szukis = Beavers x (EG x wild male).
I will try to write some more abut other trees next time.
Hershey Fruit Dump is Josephine
Hershey Blue is Buhrman
SFES is from Lucky Pittman. It is a wild 60n found near the Sinking Fork Elementary School (SFES) in Hopkinvsille, KY. Very heavy producing female with great flavor. Ive been to the ortet.
Shoto, if referring to the tree at Hershey’s, is misnamed and is actually Lambert. Somewhere out there may be the real Shoto though.
Improved Geneva Red comes from Donald Compton.
DEC Goliath is a hybrid i believe, i think a cross with Nikita’s Gift?
Bald Eagle comes from Bald Eagle State Forest in Pennsylvania. Beyond that i cannot say.
Kitch comes from Lancaster county PA, presumably a wild 60n ortet.
