I’m learning about persimmons and I’m wondering if anyone from VA can give me their best suggestions for SW VA at 2k elevation, zone 7 ish? I would love an Asian persimmon to have something not as big as American. I currently have a Nikita’s gift that died back last winter so I’m trying again and winter protecting this time. I just want persimmons and I’m not sure what’s the safest bet! Any help would be much appreciated. I’m at my mom’s place for Thanksgiving in VA Beach and she has this beauty in her backyard if the house she moved into this year:
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@Paul-VA … nice persimmon tree and fruit at your Mom’s place. That looks like an Asian persimmon to me… and most of those are cold hardy down to 0F… some possibly -5F.
At your location… evidently it gets a bit colder than it does at your Mom’s.
If the hybrid Nakitas gift… is suffering winter dieback… you should consider adding some of the hybrids known to be more cold hardy.
On the website nuttrees.net Cliff at Englands Orchard (located in the foothills of Mountains) in eastern KY… has descriptions of several hybrids including some pretty specific cold hardiness details.
For example the hybrids Kasandra, JT02/Mikkusu, NB02/Zima Khurma and others have experienced -16F in his orchard with no winter dieback.
I have Kasandra and Mikkusu…and a few others. My Kasandra produced first fruits here this year… and they were absolutely delicious.
I can highly recommend that one.
If you might be interested in American persimmons… Barbaras blush, H118, H63A, are a few to consider… those ripen early, are delicious and even more cold hardy than the hybrids.
Good Luck !
TNHunter
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Super helpful, thanks! How tall is your tree?
Other options for larger fruit might be Gora Roman Kosh or Pamyati Cherneyaeva, both of which will probably be available as scion through Marta’s sale later this year at reallygoodplants.com
Others have Gora Roman Kosh, but there seems to be multiple versions floating around and it looks like Marta’s is correct. She does a review of both in one of her fairly recent short videos. Since they have more kaki genetics than Virginiana your location might be tough if Nakita is struggling, but I believe they are a little bit hardier.
I’ve been growing Cardinal hybrid (not the non-astringent by the same name), which is medium size, and Cliff says it is hardy down to -16 at his place.
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@Paul-VA …
My Kasandra in year 3 (left)… and a somewhat runtish Nikitas gift on the right.
I grew the rootstock from seed.
Kasandra wants to grow up… probably 12 ft now… but I will cut a lot of that off when I prune this winter… discouraging height and encouraging spreading out.
Kasandra fruit.
JT02 / Mikkusu in year 3.
TNHunter
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I’m growing Miss Kim. only in their second season so no fruit yet.
I found this document from the Wye Research center in MD to be quite helpful when determining what cultivar I should try. they have done extensive research on cold hardiness.
I can’t do ladders so I was limited to dwarf varieties. I wanted one that was astringent until ripe and with good fall foliage too. Based on what I read, Inchon and Miss Kim were my best options. this is a video of the miss Kim cultivar from Edible Landscaping.
Edible Landscaping in Afton VA might be able to help determine the best variety for you. good luck.
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My parents are in 7a western MD. I planted a saijo at their house and it’s done fine it’s first winter aside from some bunnies chewing on it.
It’s planted about 20 ft from the garage that gives it a little shield from north wind.
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Have you looked into grafting on d. Lotus?
I don’t graft, so I’m limited to what’s available commercially.
I’m going to try a few grafts of apple on full grown crabapple tree as practice this season.
I have two of the Miss Kim trees. That should be plenty of persimmons for me anyway.
I have a Great Wall persimmon growing against a south facing stone wall whose north side is entirely insulated with the hill the wall is holding back.
It survived -7 this past winter and provided me with a delicious crop of maybe 14 persimmons that I ate while still firm. Apparently, under the right conditions, Great Wall can be non-astringent. The fruit was higher quality than Trader Joe fuyus I was eating at the same time- deeper orange color, bigger and slightly sweeter. Probably because they were riper, I left them on the tree just a couple days too long and some of the fruit suffered some freeze damage. Fruit is damaged not much below freezing, apparently. .
I can’t imagine that wall gave more than about 3 degree protection- but cold hardiness has a lot of variabilities. .
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I have matsumoto fuyu from edible landscaping. 9+ years old at 12 ft, heavy prolific producer 500 + on one tree this year. It alternates, next year, might be lesser fruit but still great like about 300… Richmond VA
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Wow, I looked it up. It is amazing how mild your winters are… you should be able to grow just about any Kaki. I mean winters where the temps don’t seem to often drop below 20F according to records I could draw up. Sweet spot.
I’m in 6b/7 in eastern Kentucky, about an hour and a half from Haysi. Hachiya and Saijo have been the most robust as far as cold hardiness
of the non-astringent I grow. Tam kam has also done great if you’re looking for a non-astringent.
All three survived negative temperatures in Dec 2022 without dieback. I think the real trick is offering a little protection in the first few years while they’re small and still a little susceptible to extreme temps and weather.
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I called Cliff and they no longer ship trees, its pick-up only so that’s a bummer
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I don’t think a Nikita’s gift died from cold, likely some other issue. Most persimmons should be fine in any zone 7 in Virginia within reason.
@Paul-VA … I have my own wild dv rootstock trees… (in abundance) and just buy scion wood from Cliff when I need a variety from him.
I got Journey hybrid scion from him a couple years ago… and may get SuperRosseyanka from him this winter/spring.
The last two falls… my wife and I have made the Orchard tour trip to Englands Orchard.
He has trees for sale there.
TNHunter
how easy/dificult is it to graft persimmons? I have lots of experience with apples, whip and tongue is my go-to
@Paul-VA — I just started grafting a few years back and found it quite easy to do. I have lots of knife experience.
I prefer to do Whip/Tounge on persimmons… as long as the scion and rootstock matches on diameter at a decent height that is what I do.
Occasionally do Modified Cleft… or bark graft if root stock is larger than scion.
I have had best success with whip/tounge.
I have 11 persimmon varieties now.
I would say that grafting persimmons is no more difficult than apples. I have done both with great success.
TNHunter
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I would say that persimmons aren’t difficult to graft, but the timing is more important than with apples. Persimmons leaf out later in the spring, and it’s best to wait until the persimmon rootstock has new leaves before you graft dormant scions. Also, you’ll need to remove buds from the rootstock below the graft every few days. If you let them grow they will compete with the scion and cause the graft to fail. In VA, you will probably have persimmon psyllids that will feed on new growth and can be hard on new persimmon grafts. You can spray the psyllids or put row cover fabric over new persimmon grafts to protect them from psyllids.
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