Thank you both for the explanations! Very cool.
I talked to breeders and all kinds of variations exist including red black raspberries. I have seeds from a red and one day may grow them out. They are frozen for now. Pete Tallman who bred Niwot gave them to me.
4 Likes
PcChip… let us know how those storage totes work for you as time progresses. I think its a great idea.
Did you ever get (the real) Cheyenne going? I know you mentioned chasing something that you tasted long ago… regardless Cheyenne is a very underappreciated blackberry for those that are ok with thorns. Ripens in June here. Probably late May for Z7b and above.
Shumway has sent me excellent plants each time ive ordered so just throwing this out there.
2 Likes
I honestly don’t know if I ever got the real cheyenne or not - I got about 4-5 varieties from ebay guy and I have a feeling that’s where a virus came from, and also suspect they were not correctly labeled varieties. So what I did was let them all make berries then trashed all but two of them, and kept the ones that I liked. At this point my obsession is wearing out and I’m just keeping alive whatever has survived up until now
So far the HDX Storage bins have been working out well! I just use scissors to slice holes in the bottom of the sides for drainage. The only downside is disposing of one if you decide you don’t want it anymore, it’s extremely heavy and full of plants
2 Likes
Totally understandable. Between the RCB… and a few of my crazy hot summers with drought… then a few very testy winters i have had to give up on some things myself.
I am fairly sure that that guy was probably trying to do the right thing but doing it the wrong way. I spoke to him and i dont believe that he thought he was defrauding folks. I didnt get the full story but from what i could tell he just bought the TyTy lies which were named…and was flipping them on Ebay. Two wrongs dont make it right though.
Two of those offerings i still have… and not exactly because i want them its just that they are nearly unstoppable. So TyTy probably just grew out seedlings of some of those old cultivars and by chance these are ‘new’ varieties. One of them i think i posted pics of probably makes 10000 berries per crown… the other not so much. They are insanely invasive… more so than my local wild ones. I have mowed them and pulled roots to find them another 50 feet from where they started. Excellent wildlife or novelty plants though. The fruits hang like clusters of grapes and are tiny and conical. Ive never seen another one like it. They are oddballs for sure.
1 Like
i got ahold of the invasive one - it was the one he labeled Rosborough (actually he called it Rosenborough before I told him it was misspelled)
it was popping up everywhere and never made any berries at all for me
I actually managed to get it all ripped up though if you can believe that
2 Likes
I’m adding a number of raspberries next spring, so decided to order Fall Red from Shumway and August Red from Fedco. I’ll try to compare growth habit, performance, taste, etc.
I’m also getting Royalty Purple, Vintage, Prelude, Killarney, and Pequot Lakes black raspberry.
2 Likes
Dud for me here… i gave it a fair shot though. I read just about everything that i could find on it a few winters ago… Jim Fruth grew out seeds from fruit at a local farmers market and the one he chose survived the winter at Z3 Minnesota. I like Ohio’s Treasure and Mac Black… and i liked Black Delicious but i have lost it due to having too many black rasps going… and my dogs chased some voles…to a bad end.
Good! I think Fall Red deserves some more discussion. Does amazing here. Looking forward to the comparison.
1 Like
I’m hoping it will be happier hear in Zone 4/5 (feels like 7 so far this winter). That sounds like a story!
Jim himself said that they probably arent worth growing if you can grow others… I am probably the only soul that has read most all of the old NAFEX talks. YMMV though.
‘If you live in a growing zone where you can successfully grow catalog variety of black raspberry, you may not want to buy the Pequot Black Raspberry.’
https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/nafex/2009-03/msg00057.html
1 Like
The three black razzs i settled on were jewel, bristol, and ohio treasure. Hopefully they fruit next year
2 Likes
Interesting that he says others reported them as more flavorful. I’ve already ordered them, but I might put them in more of a woodland spot and save prime real estate for the reds.
1 Like
With respect… he was for sure a very good salesman… or as i like to call a ‘PT Barnum’. I do mean that respectfully and he was very good at promoting his small business… but i think he embellished things a little.
He did create a black raspberry that grew on his 1/2 acre…where he said that others would not… so thats a win regardless.
I guess we all love our “babies” 
1 Like
On Pequot black raspberry. I have property north of Pequot lakes. A summer cabin now zone 3b. However I live in zone 5b. I have grown Jewel there however it does not thrive there. Wild reds grow everywhere there. Here wild blacks grow everywhere. You never find wild or feral reds here. So I think it is a climate thing. Anyone wanting to breed a better race of blacks for zone 3b should consider crossing in wild reds. This would help them thrive in zone 3b. It would take time to get blacks in the F2 generation. I am growing some purple seed this year hoping to get some blacks to trial at the cabin. I used seed from 2 cultivars. Would have preferred to have local reds in the mix.
2 Likes
How about trying Mac Black there? At a minimum it would be good information.
I think its the only one bred in Canada that i know of… and most of the internet information is wrong.
I once had Wyoming purple which wasnt worth growing or discussing.
Amethyst is worth trying there as well… i think its much more suited to that climate than mine.
1 Like
Ohio treasure i think has some red mixed in. Might be of interest
2 Likes
we used to be z3b . now 4b. we have wild reds everywhere. never seen a wild black. i grow the purples. royalty , brandywine and amethyst. all grow well and are super productive. ive tried ohio treasure and a yellow sport Drew51 gave me. neither really flourished. i guess the blacks, like blackberries, prefer a warmer climate.
1 Like
Have you tried niwot? It’s a primocane and it survived in a pot outside during Colorado cold weather for me. It took 3 years to stay developing it’s primocane crop for me though
1 Like