Boysenberries

After reading a somewhat incredible history of Boysenberry… i have decided to give a few plants a try. I am however confused.

History from The History of the Boysenberry » The Devil Wears Parsley

Mr. Boysen moved to his in-law’s farm in Anaheim, where the berry’s fate would become uncertain. He planted his new berries there, and they ended up doing quite well! He took specimens to Coolidge Rare Plant Nursery in Altadena in 1927, and they got such rave reviews that the nursery named it the “Sensation Berry of the 20th Century.” The head of the nursery is so stoked on the berry, that he sends a letter to George M. Darrow, the plant expert for the US Department of Agriculture at the time. Mr. Darrow files this note away, and despite the enticing moniker, the berry’s sales do not do well.

Life moves on for Rudolph, and he gains employment with the City of Anaheim as the Parks Superintendent. Somewhere down the line, while visiting a fire station, he falls down a fire pole hole, breaks his back and sustains other injuries. Hospitalized, and never to fully recover, Rudolph’s fate looks as grim as his berry.

BUT! Four years later, Mr. Darrow had been on a trip in Southern California, and remembers the letter he had filed away about this phenom-berry, and decides to investigate. His first stop was Coolidge nursery, where he found that the owner had died. Unfortunately, Boysen’s neglected berry vines had withered and died also. After hitting a few brick walls, George enlists the help of Walter Knott, who was also in the berry business. The two end up finding Boysen, and to their dismay, he doesn’t have any plants. He knows only of the vines that were at his in-law’s farm, which they sadly no longer owned.

Un-daunted, they visit the farm, and find several pathetic looking vines that are being suffocated by weed overgrowth. With the permission of Boysen, Knott takes these vines back to his own farm in Buena Park, and nurses them back to health. Knott was the first to commercially sell these berries at his farm stand, and when people would ask what they were called, he would reply “Boysenberries,” after their creator! Their popularity grew, and with it, so did Mrs. Knott’s pie and restaurant business. This birthed Knott’s Berry Farm, and with its success, prompted Mrs. Knott to make her delicious Boysenberry Preserves. The Boysenberry Preserves were ultimately what made the Knott’s Berry Farm famous.

Ok here is where i am confused.

Our heritage boysenberry vines have been kept in the Boysen family for nearly 100 years. My grandfather, Rudy Boysen, developed the boysenberry in 1923 on a small farm in Napa California. Today we’re growing our Rudy’s Original® Boysenberries in Northern California.

So they are also selling plants and they are a pretty fair deal at 3 for $20.

I like the idea of the grand daughter making a go of her grandfathers berry but the history doesnt match up too well. I watched some of their facebook videos and they only planted their farm in 2019. Wonder why they waited almost 100 years to sell their families berries?

anyways this is their first offering of plants so i thought i would give them a go.

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Ok im no longer confused. I found their youtube channel and she explains it.

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The Boysenberry is quite awesome as it is so different from any other berry.
I find them tart, but the jam is amazing, so is a syrup made from them.
To confuse matters more I got from Edible Landscaping The Anastasia Wyeberry.
It tastes just like Boysenberries. To me it appears to be bigger, and ripened one week earlier than Boysenberry. Also seems to be slightly more hardy. It is not sold anymore.
I got rid of my boysenberries and just grow wyeberries now. I think they must be a seedling, or are just a boysenberry and the differences I saw are only antidotal.

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I’ve got a thornless boysenberry waiting to be transplanted and a thorned boysenberry on the way so I can do a taste test and figure out which one I want to keep. I hope they are different enough in taste than my existing blackberries.

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Several years ago, at a NWREC Caneberry Field Day near Aurora, Oregon, among the various literature handed out, was a paper describing a DNA comparison of random Boysens compared to that of plant material and fruit collected at the original Califonia site. The DNA was not a match.Current-day Boysens may all have similar fruit properties, but the exact varietal may be hard or impossible to obtain now.

My experience with thornless Boysen was 10-20 foot-long spindly canes with 1/3-sized fruit that ripened during the onset of SWD fruit flies. I have switched to the thorny variety.

Boysen is a berry variety that has to be nearly falling on the ground to be best for fresh eating.Fruit should come off with very light handling. If there is no fruit on the ground, it is unlikely there are many fully ripe berries on the canes. Fruit may be fully dark-colored several days before being completely ripe. Hands and containers will be juice-stained. Eating them with a fork is not a bad idea.

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I know that there are plants all over the US and New Zealand has many tens of thousands.

Those plants must have came at some point from Knotts farm… if the history is correct.

Starks sells plugs, so im guessing that some lab somewhere is producing them from some DNA.

I want to believe that the grand daughter selling her family heirloom plants have to be at least close to the source plant.

I would think so. Growing conditions might affect plant and fruit quality more than slight DNA variations. I have sampled Boysens at two U-picks about 15 miles apart in the same year, and one was so-so and the other was exceptionally good.

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Me too, I’ve propagated my thornless boysen ( AFAIK thorned boysen are not available in Europe) by layering and out of the 45 shoots I managed to get a thorned one.

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That’s an infamous paper. Maybe this year they’ll agree to release the marker data.

If i can add some more knowledge that i have come across in the past year.

Lavacaberry- are just boysenberries that were planted in Lavaca Arkanasas… they still have Lavacaberry Festival there and eventually it will die out…but the hoax is still going. Charlie Little and Roger Ort tried to bring it back but eventually failed due to it being a boysenberry.

Wyeberry- Created by Harry Jan Swartz (univ of MD). He was a plant breeder and also created some strawberries and blackberries… as far as i can tell he had a brief stint in trying to sell his creations to the public…but as far as i can tell everything has failed and his creations are gone. Drew is one of the few folks that reviewed this berry… and whomever else owns these plants never talks about them or shares them… they are gone from the market. Lost.

Newberry- Possibly the closest anyone has came to improving the Boysenberry. Chad Finn (deceased). He let a few farms trial the berry and they ran with them… and propagated them. A farm in California calls them Ruby Boysens… other than that Newberry is almost extinct from the market. There is no patent so no money to be made…and nobody really cares. The USDA has a few plants going but the process of getting them is daunting. I have these going now but will not know much about them until next year.

Youngberry- I believe that most all Youngberries sold overseas are Boysenberries… and that the few Youngberries sold here are thornless boysens. Just my theory but from the pictures that i have seen…its a very clever marketing strategy.

Nectarberry- Said to be a better seedling of Boysen. One farm in california sells these berries but not the plants. It is described as sweeter and tastier than Boysens. One vendor has sold these (Willis Nursery). I called them out and told them that they could not be selling Nectarberries… that the plants i received were thornless. They sent me a picture of the tag from the propagator… they were indeed thornless boysens. They still market them as Nectar Boysens…

Rudy’s Original-
" a USDA genetic study that their vines were indisputably direct descendants of Rudy’s original hybrid. The DNA test also revealed that Rudy’s boysenberries were a cross between marionberry and loganberry"

The marionberry was released in 1956 and is a cross of a raspberry and Ollalie. Rudolph Boysen died in 1950… however he could have possibly had his hands on the marionberry. The cross was made in 1945 by George F. Waldo but the plants were tested in Marion County and the Willamette Valley in 1948… and Rudy was in California working for the Anaheim City Parks. The timeline just doesnt work for me.

Also to note that the Boysen was created in in 1923 and Rudolph took the plants to Coolidge Rare Plant Nursery in Altadena… so that timeline debunks the article totally.

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As expected, thornless Boysen root cuttings gave me some nice thorny shoots :slightly_smiling_face:

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I have a huge fence of boysenberries, they gave fruit last year and are fruiting this year but… All of a sudden THORNS. Seems like 1/10 of the plant is thorny now.

Reading around people seem to think that it reverts if under “stress”. I don’t know how it can be stressed because it gets constant water, sun and fertilizer.

Any solutions to this?

Hi, All you can do is to cut out the thorny canes. They will stay thorny. “Thornless” sports will produce thorny canes if the roots are damaged.

Establishment and Management of Boysenberries’ in Western Oregon.
https://ir.library.oregonstate.edu/downloads/wm117p274

The Thornfew clone produced an average yield of 3.1 T/A as compared to 4.5 T/A from the standard clone (Table 5). In 1976, the difference between standard clone yield of 3.5 T/A and Thornfew yield of 1.8 T/A was highly significant. In each harvest year, berries from standard plants were significantly larger than those from Thornfew plants, averaging 8.0 g and 4.6 g,
respectively.

That is interesting. The thornless mutation must have affected the vigour and yield potential. Better to breed a fully genetically thornless plant. I am attempting to reproduce the parentage of Boysen, using modern, fully genetically thornless cultivars and seedling selections.

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Good luck with that! I’ve honestly never been happy with thornless varieties. Never found one that for me had the vigor, production and flavor. Prove me wrong by all means!!! Please.

I have not either. Although I have found the ARS/Oregon group use a different gene and to me the fruit is much better. But their thorny New Berry is one of the best ever, so even here their thorny types are all amazing. Not just new Berry but older ones are really good too. Such as Olallie Blackberry.

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I just got a couple of the Newberry from @krismoriah - thank you - so im excited to try those out.

My Mom and Grandma (she’s almost 99) both rave about the Olallie berry and I’ve had some AMAZING wine with Olallie bery from Royal Oaks winery in Santa Barbara area.

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I have a boysenberry plant I’ve been debating on planting at my house vs my mom’s house in a 1 gal pot that I got earlier this year. Is it too late to plant or should be fine?

Also, should I get a study trellis or would one of the netting ones be fine? Thorns on this sucker pretty wicked and hooked

Wait until the leaves fall off while in the pot then plant…unless you plan on being ultra diligent in watering or if it rains alot where you live.

A trellis of some sort is probably needed… one cane cane be weighed down many lbs with fruit. I like the lasso method myself of just wrapping the vines along the wire… some folks like the waterfall method of just draping them over until they touch the ground then snipping the tips. The lasso method works best with two top wires about a foot apart at top for me…

I do know that baling twine works for 2 years as that secondary wire… i forgot to run a wire and the baling twine works fine. Pretty easy to swap out the twine also. I am 3 years into using baling twine as a top wire on my black rasps… also pretty easy to swap out during dormant season if something happens. YMMV.

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