All of the pears had at least 2-5 successful grafts per variety. It will be interesting to see how long it takes them to fruit.
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Menie pears are growing like crazy. I’m learning a lot about these type of pears but they do get fireblight.
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Savignac was unavailable when I ordered this year. Savignac pear still eludes me! I ordered PI 312505 Phileson & PI 541347 Moe
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Looks to be the same as the one I’m chasing based on what the parents are, when and where it was developed and by who Savignac Ronde Verte Pear Tree - Flavourful disease resistant pear- Nursery
“The Fruit
Savignac Ronde Verte is a medium sized pear with a rounded form and greenish/yellow exterior. The flesh is white with a pleasantly crisp and juicy consistency and very few grit cells. The pear is sweet and aromatic, good for both fresh eating and preserves. Fruit are ready for harvest in September and keep for about 2 weeks.
The pear tree
Savignac Ronde Verte pear tree is vigorous and highly productive with an upright growth pattern. It is hardy to at least zone 4. The tree shows an excellent resistance to disease. It is self-sterile and needs a pollinator to produce fruit.
Its origin
Armand SavignacThe origins of this variety are not entirely clear but it was almost certainly one of 4 trees given to brother Savignac in Joliette, Quebec by the Ottawa experimental station in 1947. Savignac who is also famed for his work in the development of grapes and tomatoes unfortunately lost the tags for the trees, hence the uncertainty as to their original names. It did not become commercially available until the 1990’s. The parents used in this breeding program were: Flemish Beauty, Kurskaya, Clapp’s Favorite, and Zuckerbirn.”
When I tried to order I got a blank page https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?accid=%20CPYR+2922
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Ronde Verte just means round and green in french if you wondered. I’ve grown clara frijs for years but no fruit yet. It’s been a good disease resistant pear! Josephine de Malines is a legendary pear I will be grafting this year I hope. Wish we could have found https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?id=1725676 before January 25th. Thanks for finding that I will order it when I can. There is always next year or perhaps I can tbud it.
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I strongly suspect my small yellow unknown pear is related to these Canadian pears but that remains to be determined. Take a look at my unknown pear Pears Extraordinaire
. It may have some common ancestor also. Menie is similar in some ways eg, scion color etc.Look hard at my yellow pear and then look at this savignac (the elongated variety) http://www.aujardinmandeville.com/popup/poirier_savignac.html
Which is clearly not the same savignac as this one (round pear and not elongated) .
The foliage appears to all have common ancestors. Pear tree
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I requested Sauvignac from GRIN last year. I have no idea if Sauvignac and Savignac are the same variety, but I have seen the same description used for both spellings.
https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/accessiondetail.aspx?1725676
oops…should have read all the posts before mine. I see this was already covered.
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I got Sauvignac scion from Bob Purvis 2 years ago . I also got Hudar . Both are on the same callery tree . Hudar has grown more . Hudar may bloom this year or next . Sauvignac will take longer . No spurs yet .
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Anyone reading this from Canada may be interested to know pears such as Phileson are now available as trees again Collection Pears - Hardy Fruit Tree Nursery. I would love to get my hands on the the original descriptions that were published in: Spangelo, L. P. S., W. R. Phillips, and D. S. Blair. Pears. Progress Report, 1949-1953. Central Experiment Farm, Ottawa. P. 32. See the Nafex email below between Richard Bell and Claude Jolicoeur from 18 years ago.
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RE: [nafex] Pear leaf spot
To: "'nafex@egroups.com'" <nafex@egroups.com>
Subject: RE: [nafex] Pear leaf spot
From: "Bell, Richard" <rbell@afrs.ars.usda.gov>
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 10:28:26 -0400
Delivered-to: mailing list nafex@egroups.com
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Mailing-list: list nafex@egroups.com; contact nafex-owner@egroups.com
Reply-to: nafex@egroups.com
Enie, Menie, Minie, and Moe were released by Agriculture Canada’s
Central Experiment Farm in Ottawa in 1947-1949. The original
descriptions were published in:
Spangelo, L. P. S., W. R. Phillips, and D. S. Blair. Pears. Progress
Report, 1949-1953. Central Experiment Farm, Ottawa. P. 32
Brief descriptions also appear in:
Howlett, F. S. 1957. Preliminary evaluation of new and uncommon pear
varieties. Research Bulletin 790. Ohio Agricultural Experiment Station,
Wooster, Ohio. (This is also listed as North Central Regional Bulletin
75).
Howlett’s descriptions:
Menie bears moderately small (2 1/4" diameter), round to
obovate-pyriform, greenish-yellow fruit. Howlett rates the flavor as
poor, keeping quality as poor (softens quickly), unattractive, and of
no commercial value.
Minie is moderate in size (2 1/2" diameter), globular, obtuse, with no
neck, greenish-yellow, with some red blush, tender, sweet, and juicy
flesh, fair flavor with some hint of astringency, with poor keeping
quality, softening “almost immediately” after harvest. It ripens very
early (1st week of August in Ottawa). Howleet notes that processing
trials in Ottawa found it to be satisfactory.
and, according to:
Brooks, R. M., and H. P. Olmo. 1972. Register of New Fruit and Nut
Varieties, 2nd. Edition. Univ. of California Press, Berkeley.
Menie is a seedling of Kurskaya x Flemish Beauty. Large fruit of
pleasant flavor and good quality; hardy, vigorous tree, slow to bear.
Recommended for home gardens.
Minie is a seedling of Zuckerbirn x Clapp’s Favorite. Fruit and tree
description is similar to that for Menie.
Both have been reported to be at least moderately resistant to fire
blight. (Mowry lists Minie as susceptible.)
From: Gord Hawkes[SMTP:logcabinorchard@cyberus.ca]
Reply To: nafex@egroups.com
Sent: Monday, May 22, 2000 10:00 PM
To: nafex@egroups.com
Subject: [nafex] Pear leaf spotGreetings all. We recently purchased pear nursery stock which appears
to
exhibit pear leaf spot symptoms - raised brownish spots on most
leaves.
Couple questions will sulphur control the problem or is the nursery
stock
likely going to have recovery problems from this condition? Typically
how
devestating is leaf spot?Other question is anyone familiar with the Minie and Menie pear
varieites?
What is the parentage and how do the trees typically perform?Best regards,
Gord Hawkes
Log Cabin Orchard
Osgoode, Ontario
Canada Eh!
–
Follow-Ups:
[nafex] Minie / Miney pears
From: Claude Jolicoeur <cjoli@gmc.ulaval.ca>
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These are likely still a little ways from producing. Looking forward to trying them. Still no luck squiring Savignac Scion wood yet.
@ILParadiseFarm
Sounds great I appreciate the offer. I tried to order sauvignac twice from grin but the page was down. Went ahead and made my order without it. Now I’m looking again and the page is up.
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Grafting Moe and Phileson this spring. Menie has blooms already!
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Moe and Phileson have now been grafted. Im fascinated by these pears. I saw flecks of red in Moes wood when i grafted it. This discussion Help me find a pear I'd like to grow may some day have better answers with more details on these Canadian pears.
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Clark…I have 2 existing / productive pear trees that were here when we moved here…one I am almost certain is Bartlett (familiar with them as 2 of them grew in my backyard when I was a kid ), the other looks exactly like the ones in your white bucket (top picture)…compared to the Bartlett they have more pear flavour and a slight zing to them…not as big or juicy as the Bartlett but I think a better/stronger pear flavour partly due to the zing (slight tartness)…I was guessing they were D’Anjou because of the shape and size(on the medium/small size), but I have decided they may not be…the tree is probably 20 0r 25 years old I am guessing from the trunk size…as things tend to go in and out of ‘style’ I thought the age might be a clue as to what was widely available and popular at that time…of course we live in 2 different areas…but still…seems when you look back in the literature about fruit there are fairly limited choices at least commercially. I am also assuming that whoever planted the two apples and two pears that were here, did so with pollination in mind. Although I believe the pears are self fertile…so maybe that’s not a clue.
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Do you have any pictures that might give a clue? Wonderful old trees like that are fantastic! You and i are very fortunate to have mature fruit trees.
It really is…I now have well over a hundred fruit trees and a few hundred berry bushes (mostly haskap)…but I have planted all of those myself…and only a few of the trees yet producing fruit it was a great welcome to the new home site to be able to pick some fruit here the first year though.
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These pears bloom very late like my small yellow pear i suspect they are related to. They have buds but the flowers are not open yet. My hopes are many are still growing these pears but my fear is a handful of us own them. They produce fruit after grafting in about 3 years.
I wish I had them but the Canadian GRIN is not very forthcoming in allowing small fruit growers access to thier scions.
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The USA is similar they do not give small home growers access but they do give access for research. Then i can take cuttings while pruning and and give extras away. @39thparallel took many cuttings last year at my orchard. My research is documented. Canadian pears like these should be available to the world. Bernie Nikolai from Edmonton Alberta Canada might be able to get scion wood for you. He is an amazing resource in Canada. He has used pictures of my top working pear grafting methods. He has a large following on facebook. He even.has access to the russian pears. He worked with russia to import those pears from their breeding program. Ive not talked to him for a few years but im sure he’s around. @hungryfrozencanuck4b would it be possible to locate scionwood of this older canadian collection in Canada?
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Bernie is active on the following private Facebook group: Hardy Fruits and Nuts of Alberta | Facebook
They might have some people who can share scions. It is the right time of year for it.
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