Who is growing this variety successfully? I’ve got two that were grafted to Dolgo rootstock in 2015. Both have survived some pretty brutal winter weather. Neither has had a single blossom yet. Both are between silver and green tip right now. Most of my other apples and crabs are either blooming, or about to bloom. I am beginning to have my doubts that CPP will ever produce fruit here.
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I would be interested in people’s experiences with Court Pendu Plat as well. I have a benchgraft of it in my vegetable garden and it is slow to come out of dormancy. It blooms really late so that may be a problem at your location. Although it is nicknamed the “wise apple” since it often avoids late frosts that can get apples with earlier bloom times.
There could be trouble with pollination if the rest of your apples are finished blooming before the blooms of Court Pendu Plat open. You may need to get another tree with a late bloom time to insure pollination. Or you could plant a different tree in a shady spot so it will come out of dormancy late and have blooms at the right time to pollinate the Court Pendu Plat. If that doesn’t work you could try drying and freezing apple pollen and use that to hand pollinate. Hand pollination would also work until you get a more permanent solution in place.
Link to info on Court Pendu Plat
Another link- if you click on the review tab there comments by growers
https://www.orangepippin.com/varieties/apples/court-pendu-plat
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Also interested in this question. I grafted CPP several years ago. Picking up on suggestions in the orangepippin comments that @mroot mentioned, I grafted it on a rootstock that I’ve found comes out of dormancy relatively early (G202) and placed it in a spot that gets good early spring sun next to another variety that was recommended as a worthwhile, similarly late-blooming partner (Edward VII). The tree is too young to blossom, but CPP is still late, late, laaaaaaaate to come out of dormancy (way later than Edward VII). It also seems to be pretty slow-growing. It’s early yet, but I’m thinking that I may end up incorporating a branch of it into a multi-graft and grafting over what I have now to something with a little more get up and go in more senses than one.
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Another candidate for a very late-blooming partner: Parmar. Mine is really just leafing out about now, much later than anything else here (though I don’t grow straight CPP). You can find it at Big Horse Creek Farm and Vintage Virginia Apples.
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Hmmm the first reference I listed claims Court Pendu Plat is self-fertile.
Also these other sources list it as fully self-fertile. I guess pollination isn’t going to be a problem after all.
Self Fertile Apples UPDATED: 144 species (apples forum at permies)
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Interesting! Other sources I’ve looked at list it as self-sterile:
For reference, (short) lists of apples that are said to be pollination partners for CPP:
https://www.keepers-nursery.co.uk/searchpolpartner.aspx?id=COUPEP
Northern Spy is an interesting one on the second list.
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Yes it is interesting. I also see it’s listed as medium vigor in the HOS list for vigor. But the listing is for Court Pendu Plat (Rouge) which I guess is a sport with a more reddish color. But other places list it as weak vigor. Maybe as old as it is there are a bunch of sports with different levels of vigor and fertility. Or some of the references are wrong.
Ironically, people in Normandy in 1400s probably knew and the Romans knew the answers to these questions. Still with as late of a blooming cultivar as it is you would think there would a consensus on whether it is self-fertile or not.
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Orange Pippin lists Golden Hornet as a pollination partner for CPP…it is not here. My GH is blooming now. Most other varieties mentioned as pollination partners will not be winter hardy here. I’d call CPP a low-medium vigor variety. It is an usual growth habit and odd looking leaves as well.
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I have 9 of these trees on EMLA.106. I recall research indicated low vigor so I chose that rootstock, grafted in 2018. The trees didn’t do squat the first year, but have been better after that. They have proven cold hardy and seem to have a will to survive. These are overdue for transplant from the nursery bed to an orchard row.
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Pomiferous divides blooming periods into groups A thru H with A the earliest and H the latest. CPP is listed as being in group G. You can do an advanced search and narrow the search by the blooming groups you want to see. So you could narrow it to groups F, G, and H or go narrower to just G and H.
Jonalicious is in Group F and is listed as hardy to zone 3.
Médaille d’Or is in Group G and is listed as hardy to zone 4.
Catherine is in Group F and and is listed as hardy to zone 4.
Golden Hornet doesn’t have a bloom group listed they just say it starts blooming with Group C and has a long 2 week bloom time. They suggest it can be used to pollinate late flowering cultivars but it’s not clear how late.
Some others also may work as pollinators for CPP but they’re mainly European cider apples which I imagine aren’t hardy to zone 4.
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Interesting, I have Medaille d’Or and I’m Z4a. It has proven susceptible to winter damage and is about 3-4’ tall 3 years after grafting. The trees don’t look all that great either. I have 5 of them on B.118. I decided not to plant them out and am not sure what I’ll do with them.
I grafted Wayne last year as it is reported to be a late bloomer. It’s going to be a few years until I find out whether it blooms as late as CPP though.
Obviously, Smitty, they never told you it’s a late bloomer.
(DAY 26 in fact…nearly a month after some apples have bloomed.)
I’m up to 122 varieties but don’t got that one.
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Oh, I knew it was a late bloomer. That’s why I grafted two of them, the old nickname “wise apple” seemed like a good insurance policy against late frosts.
The problem is, by the time the trees wake up here…it’s hot and dry (typically). There may be enough residual pollen in the beehives near the trees to pollinate them even if no other trees are still blooming…but the damn things never bloom at all.
They may get the axe in the next year or two if they don’t produce anything
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You may have to resort to “artificial insimination”…er, collecting pollen earlier to pollinate this puppy.
{My Odysso apples…fell or eaten. Redfield, nice.}
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I might help to do some branch bending and look at some of the other techniques that induce fruiting. If the soil is very fertile or the tree is supplied with a lot of nitrogen fruiting may be delayed especially with certain cultivars. How big are the CPP trees and what kind of soil are they on?
I do train all of my trees for more horizontal limb crotches. The CPPs naturally have pretty decent branch angles. Soil is a sandy loam. I do not fertilize any of my fruit trees. I do hit my orchards with pelletized lime and gypsum. They likely get some nitrogen from the clover growing in the area, but I wouldn’t guess it is excessive. Both of the trees are about 8’ tall.
I’m starting to think the variety is winter hardy, but the fruit buds get zapped by -25 or lower temps.
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It may be just slow to come into bearing. My Ashmead’s Kernel had It’s first apple in it’s fourth leaf and it’s on G11 a dwarf precocious rootstock. This year in it’s fifth leaf. I bagged six apples on it. It didn’t bloom much either I think every cluster that bloomed set fruit and I thinned to one apple in each cluster with a minimum spacing between clusters of 8 inches. I am not very familar with Dolgo crab rootstock isn’t it a full size rootstock and slow to come into bearing?
I haven’t seen any infomation on middle winter cold survival rates for apple fruit buds. All the charts I have seen deal with fruit buds after they reach silver tip in the Spring or later.
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Every other variety of apple I grafted to Dolgo in 2015 has been bearing for at least two years. Several for 3 or 4. It is considered a standard rootstock.
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I just checked my two CPPs. One has a few buds and one or two blossoms open. I have one ornamental crab with a few open blossoms, but that tree is 1/2 mile away and pretty much done blooming. I guess only time will tell if I ever get any fruit from this variety.
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