Did you try the mexican plums?
At least you will have good seeds for the persimmons!
1 Like
One of them, but it tasted very sour and maybe wasnāt quite ripe so Iām leaving the others on the counter a little longer. Do they usually sweeten up ok?
I ate a third one (the only other one thatās soft), and decided to try to cut it carefully to show the fruit profile. Hereās a before and after that attempt:
And hereās a close-up of the flesh around the seeds:
There were a few spots that looked like they had seeds but actually had nicer chunks of flesh, but it did have 5 seeds in this small fruit. Hereās what I didnāt eat (the skin is very tough):
Iām tempted to taste some of the more firm ones since this has not even a hint of astringency. Itās a pleasant, slightly bland but creamy, mildly sweet taste. Very messy, though.
Since Iāve now got an overabundance of fresh seed, Iāll try germinating some immediately, and cold stratify the rest. I had already ordered a seed packet from an Etsy seller in McAllen, TX, and they look like they are in good shape, but dried out.
If my germination rate is anything better than abysmal Iāll probably have some extra seedlings next spring if anyone else wants them.
3 Likes
I just found this paper titled Germination of Texas Persimmon Seed
In case this is useful, some of the relevant results are:
Germination was >93% at constant temperatures of 20-30ā C, but decreased abruptly or ceased outside this range.
The percentage of seeds that germinated in light did not differ from those germinated in darkness.
Seed germination ranged from 93 to 97% at pH values from 4 to 11.
Apparently, germination is dependent on high adequate water availability, indicating that seedling establishment is probably confined to periods of high soil moisture.
Germination after storage for 1,6, 12,15,18,21, and 24 months showed no changes in viability. Germination was >91% throughout the 2-year period. Apparently no dormancy or after-ripening requirements exist for this species.
4 Likes
Thank you! Thatās very helpful, and good to know thereās no benefit in cold stratification, and that they last so long in storage. Iāll set aside a bunch of dried seeds for next year in case the first batch doesnāt do well in the greenhouse this winter.
And welcome to the forum @fmoor!
1 Like
I donāt know that the temperature recommendation means to skip the stratification. To me thatās not clear.
They explicitly state in the paper that the seeds were collected fresh (other than the ones collected from coyote scat) and were stored in a dry state at āroom conditionsā of 20-27Ā° and 50-70% relative humidity. Seed stored under those conditions had a pretty consistent 90+% germination rate at as little as 1 month and as long as 2 years. They also explicitly state this in the paper as one of their conclusions:
Apparently no dormancy or after-ripening requirements exist for this species.
Cold stratification is an āafter-ripening requirementā for many species, but apparently not this one.
1 Like
That clears things up. Thanks
Itās interesting that they suggested such a high moisture level in the soil. when the wild ones are ripening and dropping fruit the native soil is much drier than that.
2 Likes
Presumably they sit in the dry soil for months or years until the next big rainfall, and thatās their germination trigger. In terms of the storage humidity, I donāt think they tried different levels and that was just the humidity range in their offices or wherever they stored them. Iām guessing they will store equally well at lower humidity levels, though since they didnāt test that Iām just going to keep them in a drawer in my house, which is usually in that range.
So far zero germination from the seeds removed from fresh fruit and planted immediately. But the other seeds I had purchased from someone in McAllen, TX (which had been dried and stored for a few weeks, but not cold-stratified) are almost all beginning to germinate:
So there may be a benefit in at least drying the seeds before planting them, which wasnāt something tested in that study (all had been dried).
I dont think that persimmon seeds need any special treatment to germinateā¦ just treat them like nature does and they will do just fine.
I took seeds from american persimmons that i ate last fallā¦ and planted 3 seeds in a planter filled with a mix of garden soil and compostā¦ and set that planter in the edge of my woods.
I did mulch it good with some fine pine bark mulchā¦ and just let them be all fall winter springā¦ and all 3 sprouted up this spring.
Yep 42+ inches of growth in one season.
I hope to graft Kasandra to that largest one come spring.
3 Likes
What youāre describing is cold stratification. Will American persimmon seeds also germinate immediately if you try, or do they need the winter outside (or artificial cold stratification in a fridge) first?
This was my first attempt at starting persimmon seedsā¦ and I really did not even think about doing anything special.
Just planted them in the fall and they all came up in the spring. Just like it normally happens in nature.
I did not water themā¦ they got rain and snow.
I did plant them about 1.5 inch deep in a compost layer and then covered with a couple inches of mulch. That is probably a lot better than most successfully sprouted wild tree seeds were planted.
1 Like
Thatās what I did with the Texas persimmon seeds I got last fall, but I had 0% germinate. The previous fall (first attempt) were the seeds that produced the seedling in my earlier posts that is definitely not texana, so my success after cold stratification isnāt indicative.
In that study linked above, Texas persimmon had very low germination in even slightly cooler soil. Thatās probably why its native range doesnāt extend much further than Texas.
I agree. My 1 y/o seedlings barely make 3".
1 Like
Dont think our TN persimmons are that picky.
Coons and possums eat them and deposit seeds all over my fields and many of those evidently germinate and thriveā¦ my fields are full persimmon seedlings.
Plan to graft to some of those next spring.
1 Like
The āTexas persimmonā (D. texana) is a very different species with a limited natural range compared to the American persimmon (D. virginiana). My guess is the different germination requirements of the two species are a big part of why their ranges donāt meaningfully overlap. D. texana needs dry soil to store the seed and then consistently warm soil after rainfall to germinate, while virginiana prefers cold stratification (a winter in the soil) and regular rain during the growing season. Here are their respective range maps:
We are in the zone between the native ranges for both varieties and both have grown well (although slowly) for us. We also have some Asian persimmons. D
1 Like
That is about right from my experience. They are slow growers. D