Grape training to the small arbor

I need an advice from grape experts. I had a badly shaped grape vine, actually two of them on each side of the garden arbor. I cut them to the ground this spring in order to start over. One vine came up, and another didn’t, which I have no problem with, as the arbor is small anyway. So right now I have two shoots, about 2-3 feet tall coming from the ground level as well as some small grows going from the ground as well on one side. I spent hours online trying to adapt one of the training systems to my case and simply can’t. I would like the grape to cover the arbor(at least one side and the top of it), and I want it to produce. It is concord grape. Arbor is 7’ tall, 50’’ wide and 26’’ deep. Here how the arbor looks like:

If it makes a difference, pathway under arbor goes from south-east to north-west(street). The grape that came up is in north-east side of the arbor.
Thanks in advance!

Concord produce heavy growth as your likely aware. The seeded version and seedless are different plants but the growth is similar. I try and keep the main trunks to two vines only. This is an example of a seedless concord I planted on a 5 foot fence. This vine was just pruned this year and as you can see the new growth from those two primary vines is very vigorous (green vines). The old vines I left as your aware are the brown vines underneath you can barely see. Leave some of the small new growth from last year on the vine because your fruit set will occur on the new growth from last years vine. You will want to keep the vine pruned every year so it does not get out of control.

Yes, I wish I have a fence there :slightly_smiling:, but all I have is that stupid arbor. it is to narrow to use it as fence… I start to think I need to kill this grape and just plant something more manageable on the arbor.

That grape vine will be beautiful on that arbor with big juicy bunches of grapes hanging down from the top of that. You will just need to prune it once a year.

Perhaps you could extend some space out from the arbor arch, just a wire or two and a fence post. On one or both sides. That would give you some more room for the grapes but still allow the arbor to get covered.

I suspect that arch would be a bit small for even one concord vine.

Been there, done that. Pruned it every spring to almost bare trunk, just to get a tons of new grows going all over and no grapes. Only grapes I had was in the first fruiting year. If you think it is possible to train it on that arbor, can you give me some advice? I mean how technically should I go with it. How it should look like when I prune it in early spring and how should I keep up with it during summer. Only way I can think of is as on this picture:

One trunk goes up about 1.5’ in the middle of the arbor side, than one arm goes from the trunk to the top. On that arm will be short canes I will have to keep pruned to 2 outward buds and one inward bud closer to the cane. Outward buds will be producing fruiting wood of this year going left or right depending on which side the cane is. And inward bud will grow replacement cane for opposite side. Sounds good on paper. In reality, what if I do not have those buds I need. When exactly I need to prune that replacement shoot? Should I let it grow whole summer long, or head it as soon as it long enough. Would I see at that time where my future buds will be? What do I do with fruiting wood? If I let it grow, they can grow 6-10’ long in a month. And they will start shoot new grows out of each knot. Lets say, my shoot has 2 fruit clusters.Where and when do I need to prune it? Do I need to prune all side grows? My head start to spin :grinning:

This is because whole my yard is small). I was thinking to place a horizontal pipe between the vertical posts I already have there for stability. The problem is, the arbor is right on the border of my property, I can’t go at all to the road side, it will be smashed by snow plow in winter. And on other side about 6 ’ apart is a cherry tree… so the arbor is pretty much all I can use.

That picture is the right way to prune it. I was thinking two canes one going up each main outside rail of the arbor which would produce more grapes but look a little bushier. If you leave new growths like that in the picture coming away from the two main canes you should get tons of grapes.

Steve you could be right so the answer would be add two more 3 foot pieces of metal on each side between the bottom portion of the arbor and top of the arbor which would provide another 6 feet of growing space. I keep my grapes 8-10’ total but some people believe 10-12’ is better. .

Is this what you mean?

If so, I probably can add 1.5’ foot on each side, not 3. I wouldn’t be able cut the grass and work on my cherry tree if it will be closer. And on the road side, that brick border is pretty much the end…

I was thinking up instead of out but you could do both. Another section would give you a lot more room and not take up more space. You could even go higher if you wanted and add an arbor on top if you felt like it with two poles on each side which Steve alluded to.

see this link of the hybrid flat top design with arch which would give you much more room

yeah, I don’t think it is possible. Foot print of the arch is too small to make it any higher - we have terrible winds usually around time when the grape vine is in a full grow and works as a sail. This is why we have to put additional support in - whole arbor just collapsed with the vine on it. But for higher structure the support should go deeper, and this is not possible - there is a solid rock(I mean a huge one, it is Rockochussetts :laughing:) bellow soil level on one side. Also I can’t imaging how I am going to maintain it if it is that high - I am 5’2’’, and using a step ladder can reach the top now to work on it (7’), but not if it will be another 3’ high. I understand, that it is not the best arbor for the grape. I wish I new it when I was looking for it 8 years ago and first had idea to have grape here and only after that build flower bed on one side and plant evergreen on another. Right now I am stack with the space I have and the arbor I bought. :disappointed: By the way, it was named as “Large grapevine arbor” :laughing:

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If you did want to go up with the arbor, there are other possibilities for reinforcing it other than going deeper. Some additional structures to the sides, e.g. like flying buttresses on old churches. The side structures need not be solid, nor given to the grapes. They could just be there to help hold the arbor (but they would potentially get in your way some).

Just a thought…