Green Gage: The Holy Grail Of Stone Fruits

TNHunter · May 10, 2022, 9:15pm

Mine are in a 2 in 1 planting. They look good… patience is required. As soon as I sell this place they will start fruiting.

Roland · May 14, 2022, 7:46am

Somewhere i read Green Gage is the English name for the Europe plum Reine Claude Verte.
Reine Claude Verte is the queen of plum. Its very sweet and good tasting.

Here in Netherlands its known Reine Claude Verte is producing more, bigger and sweeter when its grown on its own roots.
So plant the graft below soil line.

alan · May 14, 2022, 9:06am

If your palate and the site you grow it says so- and the weather cooperates on a particular season. There are a lot of great tasting Euro plums and Green Gage is not queen in America for most plum growers of a wide range of plums, as far as I know. I haven’t noticed a big fan base on this forum.

scottfsmith · May 14, 2022, 11:42am

GG has a pretty big fan base in the US, and for a very long time. Here is what Plums of NY said around 100 years ago:

In the pomological literature since Quintinye in 1699, Reine Claude has been the standard in quality for plums. For the qualities that gratify or assist in gratifying the sense of taste, richness of flavor, consistency and texture of flesh, abundance of juice and pleasant aroma, the Reine Claude is unsurpassed.

It is also popular in California today, although Bavay’s Green Gage gives it some competition.

In the east coast the all Gage plums lost their popularity over time, and I’m not sure why that happened. It might be that they are not as productive, I certainly don’t get nearly as many plums of my Gages. Of the Euro plums I have now though I have three Gages (Green, Bavays, Transparent) and two non (Valor, French Prune) so I am personally a huge Gage fan and Green Gage in particular. If you eat a Gage and then you eat a regular plum the latter tastes like water in comparison.

Dane · May 14, 2022, 12:22pm

When I was a kid, living in Denmark, we had a Reine Claude plum tree in the yard. It was never very productive but some 40 years later, I still remember the taste of them - they were fantastic!

mrsg47 · May 14, 2022, 1:40pm

It is the most favorite plum in France and it is sweet and delicious. I had two trees of Reine Claude Bavay in RI before I moved. They have festivals for them here! Also the Reine Doree is even sweeter.

scottfsmith · May 14, 2022, 1:54pm

I should clarify that what I was calling Transparent is Golden Transparent Gage which is Reine Claude Doree which is Reine Doree… too many names for these old plums! I agree it is very sweet… I just made a new tree of it this spring for that reason.

mamuang · May 14, 2022, 2:07pm

When do you Transparent Gage ripen?

I am disillusioned by a couple of Euro plums that do not ripen in time for me including Coe’s Golden Drop.

scottfsmith · May 14, 2022, 2:13pm

Forget GTG unfortunately, it is late, after Coe’s in fact. For me the later the better as plums that are early are more prone to rot.

mamuang · May 14, 2022, 2:24pm

Even Coe’s is iffy. Only a dry year (not often here) it could ripen in time. It is a bug magnet, too. I have grafted it over, for the most part.

Ahmad · May 14, 2022, 2:28pm

Trees of Antiquity sells RC Doree and GTG as two different varieties. I think I also read before that RC Doree is either a synonym of Old Green Gage, or very similar to it.

scottfsmith · May 14, 2022, 2:45pm

Oh right … these old names are confusing. What they are calling Reine Claude Doree is what most US nurseries call Green Gage … the original one. GTG is a British Gage plum.

alan · May 14, 2022, 3:03pm

My palate begs to differ, although I don’t know what a “regular” plum is in your book. After a lot of side by side comparisons at a few different sites, and I’m not sure the range of experience of the Cornell writer who endorsed that view, he would need the palate of a wine tester to sort out the hundreds of varieties he describes and he doesn’t bother to- after the part with the description you quote he goes on to say that there are probably several new American varieties of equal quality (page 328) The plums of New York .. : Hedrick, U. P : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive. Of course, I don’t live upstate and my conditions are much different than there or where you are. Jim Cummin’s evaluations of plums almost always conflicted with my own when we were in communication early in my business.

I’m not sure what you mean about other plums tasting like water because it cannot be about brix. I have one site a bit upstate with dawn to dusk sun and clay loam soil where Green Gage is as good as other plums near it, such as Cornell varieties that weren’t around when Plums of NY was written, but it’s flavor isn’t more intense- simply different and quite pleasing. Not more intense than Imperial Epineuse or even Seneca. A dead ripe but firm Valor doesn’t pale in comparison either. Larger plums are more fun to cook with, less work and more visually impressive, IMO. You can only eat so many off the tree and out of the fridge straight.

I can only speak for my region and the trees that I manage.

I haven’t read members of this forum roundly endorsing Green Gage as "the standard by which all E. plums should be judged). In my own orchard my tree is a bit more challenged for sunlight than the valor right next to it and its fruit ranges from good to crap, a lot of the fruit never getting above 15 brix. when the Valor plums are in the '20’s so I do have a bit of a grudge. The light difference is quite minor.

Fusion_power · May 14, 2022, 3:13pm

This tale should get your anxiety meters spinning. I visited Romania in 2017 (My son was getting married to a Romanian girl) and sampled hundreds of European plums from the abundance of trees that line the streets. They ranged from yellow to deep purple/red in color. There were literally tons of ripe plums under the trees on the ground. Nobody ate them because they tasted as flat as an old chalk board. All except for a very few trees which not one single plum could be found beneath. I thought that was strange, then I pulled a couple of ripe plums from the trees that were obviously having plums picked up from the ground. Mind blown! They were the best flavored sweetest plums I’ve ever had the privilege of eating. The best I sampled were from a small tree in Galati (pronounced Galatsz) that were deep purple/red, sweeter, and more aromatic than any others around. The flavor intensity was a combination of tart with depth and a tendency to linger on the palate. I would estimate brix in the range of 20 to 25 though that is purely subjective. They were very sweet, especially when compared with the other plums ripening nearby.

mrsg47 · May 14, 2022, 4:36pm

Not only is it great for fresh eating, they make the best tarte and jam.

mamuang · May 14, 2022, 4:53pm

Your hot and dry climate definitely gives you a big edge .

Rather rainy New England it is a hit or miss with getting sugar up on any fruit.

BlossomBreeder · May 14, 2022, 9:52pm

I’ve been collecting Gage plums as I can find them. To that end I have compiled this list of known Gage plums. I currently have eight including a couple hybrids as noted in the list.

One of the problems is, as Scott says, name confusion. I would be grateful for additions, corrections, synonyms and, especially, sources for those I do not have.

Abricotée Jaune
Allgrove’s Superb - a bud sport of Jefferson Gage, 1915.
Bevays Gage (I have this one).
Boddarts Reneclode
Bryanston’s Gage - about 1800, probably a cross between Old Greengage and Coe’s Golden Drop.
Cambridge Gage - synonym Chivers Cambridge Gage.
Canerik (Turkey) - note the Turks eat these unripe and sour, with salt, though they do ripen to syrupy sweetness. This appears to be the same as Persian Green sold by Raintree for ‘goje sabz’.
Coes Golden Drop. Synonyms Bury Seedling, Coes Imperial, Coes Plum, Coes Seedling, Fairs Golden, King of Plums, Silver Prune, Waterloo. Probably a cross between Greengage and the White Magnum. (I have this one).
Beijinho-type-C.1 (elusive).
Bonum.
Count Althann’s Gage alias Reine Claude Conducta. Synonym Althanova. (I have this one).
Early Transparent Gage. Synonym Early Apricot, Rivers Early Transparent.
Fermareine
French Victoria - Victoria x Green Gage
Gojeh Sabz (Iran) - See Canerik
Golden Transparent (I have this one).
Green Vanilla (Mount Pelion, Greece)
Greengage. Synonym Old Greengage, Reine Claude Verte. (I have this one).
Hackman.
Imperial Gage Synonym Denniston’s Superb.
Ive - hybrid.
Jam Session - hybrid. Synonym NY111. (I have this one).
Jeffersons Gage.
Kirkes Blue - hybrid (I have this one).
Late Transparent. 1888 hybrid of Old Transparent.
Laxtons Gage. Synonym Laxtons Supreme. Victoria x Green Gage.
Lindsey Gage
McLaughlin’s Gage - ~1840 James McLaughlin in Maine.
Merton Gage
Monsieur Jaune
Mpardaki Circular (Greek).
Ontario - Ellwanger and Barry, Rochester, New York, USA, first described 1874.
Opal - hybrid (I have this one).
Oullins Gage. Synonym Reine Claude de Oullins, Falso Washington, Helgøyplomme.
Prune D’Ente - hybrid (I have this one).
Prune de Vars.
Prunella.
Purple Gage (I have this one).
Reine Claude Doree (I have this one).
Reine-Claude van Mons. Synonym Kongeblomme.
Reine Claude Violette aka Violet Gage or Purple Gage.
Rosy Gage (I have this one).
Stellas Star by Hector Harrison named after his daughter.
Swan Gage.
Tarka Perdrigon - Hungarian, originating in France. Synonym Bunter Perdrigon, Perdrigon Bariolé.
Transparent Gage - historic, may be extinct. Parent of Golden Transparent.
Yasil Alça. Synonym Göy Alça (Azerbaijan).

mrsg47 · May 14, 2022, 10:05pm

Thats true about the sun. But in NE we had plenty of heat in the summer . I found it was the humidity that was my biggest enemy. Fungus and mold; we could kill insects or prevent their damage with Surround. Come and visit during fruit season ! Now! The first apricots appeared in the market today.

Stan · May 15, 2022, 1:32am

Green Gage (Old Green Gage) is Reine Claude Doree
Transparent Gage is Reine Claude Diaphane
Early Transparent Gage is Reine-Claude Diaphane Hative
Golden Transparent Gage does not have an established French name that I know of.
Early Transparent Gage and Golden Transparent Gage have been raised by Thomas Rivers in England in the 2nd half of the 19th century.

I sampled the Green Gage, the Bavay, and the Golden Transparent side-by-side on multiple occasions, and I feel differences in flavor, but they are subtle and difficult to describe.

MichaelTheBeloved · September 12, 2022, 5:18am

I am a fan of the Gage. I’ve only had them from Andy’s Orchard from Morgan Hill, California.

He offers the Green gage. He bunches together Cambridge Gage, Bavay’s Green gage and Reine Claude Doreen aka Old Greengage as he and the Fruit Detective (his business partner) David Karp claim all 3 are so similar, it’s hard to tell them apart.

I found an English nursery site that offers Old Green gage and Reine Claude Doreen….which I thought the 2 were exactly the same yet per this site, are 2 distinct strains.

Below is my research of various gages and where to find them.

I noticed French nursery sites refer to the main branch as Reine Claude, with specific cultivars having a 3rd name added at the end to differentiate them.

I love Green gages (I’ve eaten them 3 years in a row and am impressed when they are dead ripe & chilled in the fridge for a day. I also like Golden Transparent Cage. Occasionally a very ripe one comes close to the brix level of the Green gage

Enjoy below:

Gage Plums