If a Chicago Hardy fig dies to the ground each year

On bifera fig trees 4+ years old grown outdoors year-round in my location, brebas grow on the full length of branches and on the main trunk above the first branch.

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From what Iā€™ve read and observed, brebas grow almost exclusively on the prior seasonā€™s growth and then mostly near the tips. I say ā€œalmostā€ because I have rarely seen brebas on older growth, consistent with what Richard observes.

Note that figs generally form two fruit buds at each leaf node (though rarely I think there can be more). One is to the right of the stem, the other is to the left. Normally, one of these fruit buds forms a main crop fig. The appearance right or left seems random, though I have an unconfirmed hypothesis that fruit formation is more likely on the side of the leaf more exposed to the sun.

I believe that any of these fruit bids that does not form a main crop fruit can be available to form a breba. There is not, in my opinion, a special type of ā€œbreba bud.ā€ That said, most brebas we see come from leaf nodes that were formed late in the prior season where no main crop fig formed.

I suspect, however, that latent fruit buds from older growth may also produce brebas under some conditions. Those brebas would appear at old leaf notes where latent fruit buds survive.

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i was just thinking of ways to prune a breba producer like DK to a style thats super compact but maximizes production. almost like a single leader and a ton of short scaffolds or something:

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@kinghat
For breba production, timing is more important than shape. Once the plant is beyond sapling stage: remove non-lignified wood in the Fall; then after the following yearā€™s harvest thin out crossing branches and head back branches sprouting on the bottom side of existing scaffolds. Do not completely remove these downside sprouts, but instead retain a few inches for fruiting.

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In your Z5, you have a short growing season. By the time your brebas ripen (Iā€™m guessing early August) ā€“ growth is almost finished. So I think you are forced to manage the fig tree almost like youā€™d manage a raspberry ā€“ there are (1) shoots that grew last year and bear fruit now; and there are (2) shoots that are growing now that will bear fruit next year. Pruning is cutting out #1, leaving #2,

If you want to grow a single leader, then imagine that half your shoots grew last year and bear brebas now, half are growing now to bear brebas next year. Autumn pruning would involve cutting back the shoots that just bore brebas to 1-2 buds, leaving alone the shoots that just grew. It would actually probably help you to execute this pruning immediately after the brebas ripen in August. That way the tree would not waste energy growing those shoots once they are done bearing. Iā€™d probably be sure to fertilize and water well in July to stimulate growth on the current yearā€™s shoots.

One last note: Assuming you have a decent sized pot (i.e. 10 g or bigger), thereā€™s no reason not to add scaffolds to your leader. That is actually the route to maximize production.

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i wonder if having a bunch of super short scaffolds that support only a couple alternate fruiting/pruning branches and maybe a couple ā€œbackup nodesā€ that would be trained vertical to keep everything nice and close to the trunk :thinking:

we could move to fig-talk thread instead of continuing to hijack.

Have you tried ronde de bordeaux in-ground? That one ripens quicker than CH for me.

tried florea which is early fruiter but it didnt come back the next summer. Jesse S grows it with mulch protection a half zone warmer than me and he gets some good crops.

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I planted 2 of the Chicago Hardy plants last year. I did not shelter them as you have and Iā€™m in zone 6A. Literature shows these plants are hardy enough for 5, but Iā€™ve been fooled before. I grew these in Virginia with great success, but had lost a couple before here in Ohio. Ill see if they spring back this year and maybe cover them next fall

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Can you be more specific ā€“ what literature?

In my experience (13 years), top growth on figs will usually be killed at 5-10 F and always below 0 F, unless the tree is buried in a snowbank. The roots may survive much lower temperatures, but nobody in Z5-6 wants to be re-growing a fig tree from the roots every year. That means few if any ripe figs.

Stark Bros. I decided to try a couple from them. Iā€™ve had good luck with Liberty apple trees from them.

OK. Theyā€™re trying to sell you product. Please believe me that any fig will be killed to the ground at Z5-6 temperatures (i.e., below 0 F). Technically, they are not lying ā€“ the roots will survive. But youā€™ll have an impossible time ripening fruit.

To ripen figs from new sprouts that emerge from surviving roots, you need a long growing season, e.g. Z8. Even with a protected tree with undamaged top growth, figs in Z5 will ripen very late in the season, if at all. Plan to protect the trees, then hope for the best.

The variety Florea is tough, vigorous, productive. Most important, it ripens roughly 1-2 weeks before Chicago Hardy. Here (Z7A RI) it begins to ripen fruit in mid-August. With good protection, it succeeds further north. If you can find it, itā€™s a better choice.

ā€œChicago Hardyā€ is marketing. It is no more hardy than others. Itā€™s probably less hardy than Florea.

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Yes, so true. My Chicago Hardy is very productive, is very hardy, grown in the ground, in the greenhouse.

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I thought it was called Chicago hardy because it was known to fruit successfully in Chicagoā€”i.e. after dying to the ground and in an area with a moderate length growing season. All the figs growing in zone 6 or 7 fruit on new wood since brebas donā€™t survive cold temps, right? So does it matter whether that new wood originates from ground level, or from an upper stem?

Iā€™m not advocating for Chicago hardy. Itā€™s just that I would have thought it would be successful in some parts of zones 5-7. In any case, it is the only fig thatā€™s ever died over winter for me and the second one I replaced it with seems to be the slowest variety of all to put on new growth. By contrast, Iā€™ve found Niagara black extremely vigorous and less prone to winter damage.

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Yeah, thatā€™s the hype. The name really helps people sell trees and cuttings.

Many fig trees will perform OK if grown in a certain urban microclimate. For example, it may be up against a warm wall, sheltered from the wind, covered by 8 ft of snow all winter. But Chicago Hardy is no more hardy than the rest.

It is true that the class of so called ā€œMt Etnaā€ figs (also hype) are relatively tough, very vigorous, and somewhat early ripening. So they can often produce a few ripe figs in the north even after severe top-kill.

Mt Etna implies a Sicilian origin. Other Mt Etna type figs include Abruzzo, Dark Portugal, Marseilles Black, Black Greek, Red Lebanese Bekka Valley. . . . You get my point?

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I just got several sticks in the mail today and now I want a Florea. Thanks guys! :smiley:

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A slightly off topic question.

On an in ground Chicago hardy(or any other cold hardy variety) that was pruned back and protected for winter, has anyone tried to place a cold frame over top during early spring as season pushing measure?

Lots of people use hoop houses or similar to jump-start the season with figs. It works well so long as timing is right. You canā€™t get a fig growing then let the greenhouse / hoop house get below freezing.

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My Chicago Fig is 3 yrs old. I cut it back to the ground every Fall. It doesnā€™t start to get leaves until late May early June. It grows very fast once it starts. By July it is about 6 ft tall with its new branches. Figs start at the end of July. Last year, I harvested about 25 figs from mid September til mid October. The figs were very sweet. The figs are about the size of a large walnut. Iā€™m in zone 5. I live about 45 min south of Chicago.