Allow me to rephrase that last statement. It doesn’t surprise me that something could have a parent like Braeburn and be great. Instead, it surprises me that a somewhat obscure and somewhat mediocre variety like braeburn would be obviously selected as one of the pilots in a prime breeding program. I’ve watched every single apple breeding video oline that I’m aware of and I just don’t understand how they arrive at this. Does anyone here know? I have a basic understanding of genetics and a vague understanding of apple breeding, but I just don’t get it. They are obviously making the right decisions and choices…but how?
Wife bought a bag of jazz apples and they were a disappointment. They are just an “OK” apple. Every one has their own tastes but the more I try different apple varieties the more I think the unnamed varieties I have found and plan on propagating are more than worth it !
That apple must have some very desirable characteristics as determined through DNA screening. Its my understanding that most modern plant breeding programs screen for the desirable traits they are looking for rather leaving it up to trial and error selection. It speeds up the process dramatically.
I agree , right now it is all about the DNA with the breeding programs . The problem I see with that is it also limits the breeding programs to those varieties they choose to analyze the DNA traits of (that are picked for things like name recognition ,like honey crisp !)
As I said Chartman…I too had bought Jazz and thought the same thing. It must not have been until I came across fresh or better stored ones that I realized their greatness. As for Honeycrisp, it is correctly chosen (to my thinking) as a breeding parent because it possesses qualities and attributes (namely explosive crunch and juciness) that are not commonly found in other apples. In fact, it’s crunchiness is not found in any other apple to my knowledge. What Alan calls “big cell crunch” which is aptly put I think. These characteristics have proven to be received favorably in the marketplace just about everywhere I believe. Honeycrisp is most definitely not chosen solely for name recognition, that I can assure you. It is definitely true though that they don’t skip the opportunity to tout that parentage.
But why Braeburn though? Sure, it’s a fine apple and all…but ?
Of course DNA is where it’s at for sure, but as far as I know they are trying to blend favorable and attractive alleles. I figure Royal Gala is mostly about appearance…I get that (it’s a truly beautiful apple)…but Braeburn? Again, I’m not trying to imply they are doing it wrong, they clearly are not…but HOW do they know?
I think they are smart braeburn has lady williams x granny smith as parents and gala has kids orange red x gold delicious i think as parents. So with galas parents they are really hoping for the pizzazz of kids orange red and from the braeburn side the zing of granny smith from the previous generations. In apples i see second generation showing signs of the original cross . Im not sure why that happens but i first learned about it with pea plants in high school science. The jazz apparently can be a good apple though ive not tried it the rating is 4.3 http://www.orangepippin.com/apples/jazz
yeah…the pea plant thing was the Punnett square, in that exercise the alleles are distributed first generation unless both markers are recessive in which case it is manifested. Maybe that’s it, they have found that both these varieties hold the markers for a recessive allele that they want expressed. In other words a recessive, but desirable trait.
Man I wish I could work in apple breeding for a living. So interesting. My job used to be interesting to me, but I’m bored with it. I envy those folks.
Yes ,some bad wording on my part in regards to honey crisp. I can remember when it was all about McIntosh apples. They developed several mac varieties that growers jumped on and it wasn’t until they had been planted extensively that they found out they all had bad canker issues as a product of the breeding that focused on one variety !
I think that all of these “club” apples that I was able to taste test ( Envy, Opal, Jazz) are all nice juicy sweet tart but none of them have a personality of their own. They can only be described by the attributes of another, a “juicier Gala” or a crispier, sweeter, denser, more or less tart than " this or that".
Don’t get me wrong, they are good tasty and nice to eat , but they don’t get or have that …“where have you been all my life” eye opener. They are just variations/tweaks on the standards.
There is no mistaking biting into a Cox Orange, Ashmeads Kernel, Hudsons Golden Gem, Ananas Reinette etc.
I am not inclined to pay a premium for them over a Crispin, Candycrisp, Gala, Fuji, or a good Granny Smith.
Call me jaded but I am not thrilled
Respectfully I remain, unimpressed
Taste varies from one person to another. I have tried several of the club apples and most are good to me but I would not rate any of these above the Pink Lady. I will be adding some Goldrush this spring and from all the reviews I think it is going to be another great tasting apple. Bill
Yes they are good but I wouldn’t go cross-town to get them.
Hope to get my first substantial pick from my Goldrush this year
I know this is an old topic.
I just bought and tried my first Jazz apple. Quite good, especially for megamart fruit.
I think I get it. You may cross a sour, ugly apple with a super sweet red apple…and get something pink outside and both sweet and sour in high levels, and folks flock to it.
Looks like Jazz is a Braeburn x Royal Gala.
Jazz was developed in New Zealand in the 1980s. It is a cross between two other major apple varieties - Braeburn and Gala. However the distinctive floral peardrop note which is so characteristic of Jazz is not that obvious in either of its immediate parents, and perhaps harks back to the original Delicious, one of its great grand parents (via Gala and Kidd’s Orange Red). Jazz apples often have an upright elongated shape which is also somewhat reminscent of Delicious. Two other very significant ancestors are Cox and Golden Delicious. Whatever the genetic mix, the result is a great and unique apple.<<
I’ve eaten two of them now, are they all pretty much seedless? I’ve found zero seeds that appear viable, and one kind of “half thick” seed.
I’ve noticed that some of the club apples are prone to having fewer viable-looking seeds that an average apple.
Jazz (and other club apples) aren’t bereft of seeds, however. I’ve collected some for planting in the spring that look fine. IIRC, I have a couple of Jazz seedlings from some seeds I obtained from store-bought apples this spring.
I found a few decent looking seeds in the last Jazz I ate. I wrapped them in a paper towel, put it in a ziploc and threw them in the fridge. Maybe I’ll get them planted in the spring. Since Jazz is apparently a Braeburn/Gala cross…it likely doesn’t have the required cold hardiness for this location. Maybe the pollen parent provided some hardiness
Well, you all bragging on it got me to buy one and try it.
Pretty good apple…but at the premium price I won’t be buying it regularly. Actually, very good.
(I don’t buy Honeycrisp regularly for the same reason.)
Mine has 9 seeds, 6 of which I assume will be viable. Think I’ll refrigerate them for now.
I’ve had a few good Jazz apples. I confess having limited interest in most recent varieties since they are all in the kiddie-fruity flavor spectrum to me (think Fruit Loops cereal). But Jazz is one of the better ones I have tried. Zestar! is probably my favorite recent variety, too bad it rots or I would keep it.
scott, what do your mean by Zestar rots? Does it not keep long? I bought one this summer that is still in a pot with some grafts on it of older varieties.