Journey Persimmon

[disc4tw]

According to www.nuttrees.net Cliff says that Journey is THE earliest persimmon he has.

Has anyone tried this hybrid? I think it would be worthwhile to graft at least one branch to extend the season more towards summer.

[Robert]

Was looking at that yesterday myself. He has several that he describes the taste as vanilla. I want to add one to my franken tree.

You can get 4 months of solid cropping with american persimmon franken trees.

[disc4tw]

I have the beginning of two Franken tree persimmons in my backyard. I almost have to get this one to try, who doesn’t love the taste of vanilla + adding an earlier fruit?

I also assume it’s cold hardy but will confirm before ordering.

[Lucky_P]

Be aware that American persimmons are noted for ‘self-pruning’ lower limbs as they become shaded. Depending upon how you manage them… you may find that multi-variety persimmons ‘lose’ cultivars grafted on lower branches as they get older/larger.

Don’t know about y’all, but I’m finding a few ripe fruit here and there on persimmons in my orchard. NC-10 is generally the earliest here - not unusual to have significant ripe fruits by 10 Sept. I’ve not looked at that tree, but was passing by a graft of SFES(60C) the other day and plucked a couple of its small, seedless fruits. YUM!

[jrd51]

Thanks. Growers should take this warning to heart. Last year I did a bunch of grafts of JT-02 both on Prok and on IKKJ. It was mostly just an experiment, so I targeted lower branches. The grafts did OK but the next spring (May 22) I lost 2-3 of the low branches to self-pruning.

[Robert]

Persimmon do shed lower limbs, but. While the tree is small you cut it to have multiple leaders. Then graft each and those will be almost individual trees. They also do not get as tall in that form.

[EliindaUP]

I have Journey scion wood to graft this spring. Got it because of the early ripening. We will see how it does in the north.

[parkwaydrive]

Mine also get “pruned” from portly opossums and raccoons.

[randyks]

My nemesis’ include woodchucks.

[TreeGuy]

I have some Journey wood coming this year as well. Keep us posted when someone gets their first fruits

[NativBill1]

I grafted Journey in 2021. I might get fruit in 2023.

[disc4tw]

Please let us know how it goes Bill! I am excited to start a few trees this year.

[hobilus]

I also grafted ‘Journey’ last year, along with several other hybrids. The earliness really caught my eye, as I think it’s by far the limiting factor for me. I’ve grown persimmons for 15 yrs here in the VT piedmont and don’t think I’ve ever seen a winterkill. I’ve expanded my variety list considerably, so maybe I’ll change my tune. But hardiness is irrelevant if you’ll never ripen a fruit anyway! Around here, we get about 160 frost free days in an average year. I honestly don’t know what we get for heat units or growing degree days, but I do know that if the fruit isn’t nearing ripe around Halloween, it’s not worth a hell of beans! I’m generally pretty dismissive of the idea of growing zones and a given variety being hardy to a given number of degrees. At best, it seems a gross oversimplification. Ripening time, on the other hand, while somewhat variable from year to year is incontrovertible and crucial if you’re growing things on the margins. I’ve often been struck by how widely different accounts of ripening time of given varieties ranges. The gold standard for early ripening IME is undoubtedly ‘Mohler’, which is typically making at least some ripe fruit by Sept. 1. While often touted as an early cultivar (I think Cliff England lists it as one of his 2 or 3 earliest) Prok’, by comparison, ripens about 4 weeks later for me. Perhaps the difference is indicative of how little potential there is to ripen fruit at the tail end of the season. Between cool temps, short days, and overcast weather, ripening is probably quite prolapsed at that stage. In any case, I’m very excited to trial ‘Journey’ here. I’d be surprised if it’s noticeably less hardy than other varieties and am hopeful that it’s early ripening will make it a potential winner.

[TNHunter]

@hobilus @TreeGuy @NativBill1

Or others on this post…

Have any of you tasted Journey yet ?

I have a wild dv… walmart roadside tree… with taste of vanilla this year… very good. Love it. Which makes me think i would love the taste of this Journey hybrid… and I also need to add early ripening varieties to my colletion.

Adding H118 for early American.

I need Journey hybrid scion wood… a couple sticks would do.

Do any of you have scionwood to share this winter ?

I will be glad to pay shipping or trade… my trade list includes apples 4, mulberry 2, persimmons (7 varieties) Fig, CHE, Plum, Pears. If interested in a trade i will send you the full list.

Thanks
TNHunter

[TreeGuy]

My grafts didn’t take unfortunately. I don’t think my wood was very good. I’m going to give my rootstock another year or so and try again.

[NativBill1]

My “Journey” stick appears to have been mislabeled. The grafted tree fruited and was like any common american persimmon seedling. The persimmons were small, seedy, and not early.

[TNHunter]

Hey all… I found Journey Hybrid scions available thru Englands Orchard.

Rosseyanka X F-100 Female (Journey)
persimmon 2011

I will be getting a couple scions from Cliff.

Thanks

[jrd51]

Just trying to clarify: Rossey F2 x Great Wall is Kassandra, right? How do we get to a F4 cross, as mentioned in the OP? Does that mean Kassandra x Rossey 2? Once or twice?

So Journey is a cross of Kassandra (maybe re-crossed with Rossy 2) with an OP cross of H-118? And the OP pollen donor must have transferred a tendency to produce male flowers, which is why the offspring could function as a pollen donor in the cross producing Journey. At eklast that’s what I presume. . . .

Journay shares Kassandra’s tendency to overbear, which is not surprising. But what’s the advantage of Journey over its ancestor, Kassandra? Producing male flowers is not necessarily desirable, unless we want either more seeds or more hybrids. I take it that it may be earlier? Kassandra, when well ripened, seems to taste like Saiyo. Does Journey taste better?

I’m trying to get past hybrids for the sake of hybrids, rather than hybrids with a purpose.

[TNHunter]

@jrd51 … on Cliffs site the details he gives for Journey is… it is the first to ripen fruit at his site… and it has the taste if vanilla…

He says Kassandra ripens fruit mid season.

[jrd51]

OK, I can believe that Journey picked up some early ripening from H-118. I’m gonna take comments re taste with a grain of salt. And I’d rather not have an American or hybrid with a tendency to produce male flowers. I don’t like seeds that much.