My first 2019 tree order-

In addition to the reasons Rob mentioned, probably the biggest reason is the way they are grown. Nurseries like Cumberland Valley and Vaughn are far enough south, they plant the peach pits, and the pits come up in the early spring. Things warm up fast, the seedlings grow so well that they come in and bud the peaches in early summer (i.e. June). They then force the grafted buds a week later. The long growing season allows enough time for the newly grafted trees to get big enough to sell the next spring.

Contrast that to nurseries farther north, like PA, NY, or WA. They plant pits, but spring comes much later, so the seed germinates later, soil stays cooler, etc. The seedlings can’t put on enough growth to bud them in June, so they grow the seedlings out all summer and bud them in the fall, or the following spring. The budded trees grow that summer and are ready for sale the next spring. It takes two years to produce a tree for them, vs. one year farther south. Not only does it tie up the ground for an extra year, they have an extra year of spraying, watering, fertilizing. That’s also why trees from nurseries farther north are typically larger than the ones from southern nurseries. The ones north start out grafting bigger rootstocks and they get a full season’s growth on the budded trees.

Also I suspect labor is cheaper in places like TN vs. northern states.

Congrats on some nice looking trees.

3 Likes

So am I, but I may have to try them out with a couple of plum trees, If I can find the room.

On Saturday after the grafting class at the local extension office, we went out to a local orchard. After the UK fruit doc was done with his pruning demonstration, I asked him about why Guardian and Citation wasn’t recommended by the UK folks. He didn’t elaborate much, but said they’re more of southern rootstocks and aren’t really needed here, specifically their nematode resistance. But, he also said their hardiness isn’t the best. Which goes against what you know about Guardian in that regard. Maybe it’s Citation that has more of a hardiness issue.

I told him about Vaughn in TN and another nursery in KY are selling their peaches on Guardian and he said they can sell trees how they want, but it may not be the best idea.

So, it sounds like he wasn’t going to go against their studies.

At any rate, I would avoid Citation on peaches as its performance from folks on the forum has been less than stellar. For plums and pluots, though, it sounds fine. But Guardian is probably okay for peaches here. JMO.

2 Likes

You may have seen a similar discussion we’ve been having on the thread “carored Peaches”. I can tell you that I have several peaches on Citation (because its all I could get from Peaceful Valley/Dave Wilson in several varieties, and they’d done fine for me. Like I said over there, I just really can’t see any difference of any kind between Lovell and Citation on my trees, but I must be the exception to that since others really seem to prefer one or the other based on their conditions. I’m just now getting my first guardians (that I know of) so I’ll see if they perform different.

To be fair though, I think I’m a poor test case because I only have a single tree of most varieties of peaches, so even if I see a big difference in root stocks, its hard to know if it is the tree or the RS cauusing the difference. Also, there are lots of micro climates on my property (some more shady, some wetter areas, etc). It seems to me the only fair test would be having the same variety of trees grown on almost identical conditions (dirt, moisture, sunlight, etc) and I don’t have that, so when a tree does really good or really poor, its hard to say why.

Bob, one thing you said earlier sort of caught my attention. You mentioned that you had a few (forget the number) peach trees that have only put on a few inches of growth in the last 2-3 years. I, too, have about 3 peach trees like that. They haven’t died and don’t show any obvious signs of being unhealthy (no canker, no dead limbs, no peeling bark, etc) and yet they just barely grow at all. They aren’t in any obviously bad microclimate (such as being mostly in the shade or in wet areas) so I just can’t figure out why these few trees only put on maybe 2-3 inches a year while other peaches right beside them can put on more than 2 FEET each year. SO if you figure out why yours aren’t growing or anyone else has suggestions, I’d love to hear them.

1 Like

Did he recommend any particular rootstocks?

I have a few ideas why they have struggled. First, they are in poor and acidic soil, second, despite this deficiency, I haven’t given enough amendments that they really need, and third, water can pool around them a bit, but only in excessively rainy periods.

They should probably be moved, but I’m going to try and give them a couple good doses of nitrogen this spring to see how they react. If they still don’t respond, I’ll have to move them.

I hate that I’ve basically lost two years because of this, but you learn things the hard way sometimes.

I have three apples in the same area that have struggled as well, probably more from standing water, so they will be moved this year.

As far as Citation rootstock for peaches, I made my opinion based on folks’ opinion on here, mainly about them runting out. If they work fine for you, that’s good. Everyone is going to have different experiences. Shoot, those two dog peaches I have are Lovell trees. And the other two peach trees I have are Lovell as well, but are doing much better, albeit in better soil .

2 Likes

Just the usual ones like Bailey and Lovell.

1 Like

TY. I had wondered what rootstocks he recommended when you went. It can make a huge difference and lot of saved growth time.

What are your peaches on?

It was cool to pick his brain, he’s been with UK for 30+ years, and knows all kinds of stuff about fruit. I was wondering if he was getting annoyed with all my questions!

I also asked him if he had been to Reed Valley orchard and he said he knew them very well. He suggested I try a new apple there called Evercrisp the next time we visit them. He spoke highly of Goldrush apples, which I agreed with, one of my top 5 varieties.

It was kinda funny watching him (he’s not a young fellow) climb up in that old apple tree and really giving it a good pruning. He had it all with him, hand pruners, loppers and hand saw, going to town. But that tree looked good afterwards.

I really do not remember. I planted them 4 years ago. I will have to look it up. Good question actually. You have me curious as well.

Here is a Governor Wood cherry I got today from Arboreum. Nice roots, the puzzle piece mat is 2 ft square.

2 Likes