North Carolina is a much different climate than northern Wisconsin. I still am waiting to hear if anyone has ever gotten nuts here. The trees will probably survive, but will they ever get nuts, that is the question.
@northwoodswis4 I know of one pecan that will mature for you given your 139 frost free days. It’s called ‘Iowa’ and the mother tree is located close to me. It cracks in 1/4’s mainly, but it’s a much-much larger nut than you’ll ever get growing native WI pecans. I’ll provide pollinator information later. Here are photos in the meantime. Dax
‘Iowa’ is a Type I
‘Warren 346’ is a Type II
‘Green Island Beaver’ aka ‘Cornfield’ is also a Type II
I would plant both pollinators if you can get your hands on them. The ‘Iowa’ you can get from me, next-spring.
Warren 346 pecan
Dax, I’m no longer certain about whether or not Warren 346 is either a type 1 or a type 2 pecan.
Wes Rice has it listed as a type 2. But, the USDA in Texas has it listed as a type 1.
Barkslip, Do you know of anyone who has grown “Iowa” and gotten a nut crop in zone 4a? Sounds interesting, but no one seems to give pecans much of a chance here near Minneapolis.
@northwoodswis4 according to the many folks in zone 4 WI where native pecans are, they crop and fill their shells. I see absolutely no reason why you cannot grow pecans.
Wes Rice says for an ultra-northern pecan cultivar, he likes ‘Deerstand’. I think you should have one of those included somewhere where pollination types work together. You can buy ‘Deerstand’ from Grimo Nursery in Canada. They send beautiful stock.
@northwoodswis4, I’ve been doing some researching and ‘Lucas’ is an ultra-northern pecan with a type 2 flowering. It’s not the greatest nut by any means, but it will do the necessary work. I cannot say for sure if it will fill entirely for you.
One last comment for now and that is this… Grimo Nursery lists all their pecans as zone 5b. The problem for the US consumer is that these zone designations are for Canada where it’s much cooler than in the upper mid-west of the USA. Although Grimo lists them as 5b, these trees will flourish in zone 4a in the United States.
Looking at all the data, if I were you @northwoodswis4 I would purchase ‘Lucas’ and get a graft of ‘Iowa’ from me. I will have grafts of Iowa for sale about June the 1st. Private message me and we can get together then.
Deerstand will not fill in zone 4a although plenty hardy. It’s also a type 1 so pollen exchange is incompatible with ‘Iowa’.
If you can find another type 2 ultra-northern pecan other than ‘Lucas’ then it too would be compatible with ‘Iowa’. ‘Martzahn’ is a type 2 that will mature up in your area, but, I cannot find it for sale. It matures 2 days later than Warren-346 making it a very early producer.
Last post. I’ve been looking for a Lucas and it seems that Grimo is the only seller. Maybe their stock #'s will change yet this year and it will become available. You should contact Grimo to find out.
Dax, Ernie Grimo states his Deer Stand ripens the end of October. Which would be the same time frame as NC-4, and Mullahy.
Ernie’s growing location is very similar to my location here in Connecticut. Which would make Ernie’s Deer Stand a pecan that ripens in around 155 days.
Wes’s Deer Stand, which he also says is Green Island Beaver, he says ripens 14 days after Colby. That would make it a 144 day ripening pecan.
Also if you take a close look at the picture of Ernie’s Deer Stand, you will notice that in that picture it is larger then NC-4. That does not appear to be correct.
Nut trees are like fruit trees and everything else being sold, there are a lot of miss labeled trees, out there.
It looks like maybe Deer Stand and Green Island Beaver have become mixed up.
If I was living in MN., and wanted to grow pecans, I would see what people are growing there. Or I would investigate Warren 346 (140) days, Iowa (140) days, James Early ( 140) days, and Wes’s Green Island Beaver(144) days.
Also, Carl Weschke grew a pecan he called Survivor, in St. Paul, MN.
The USDA is showing it as part of their inventory.
Good. Glad you could help, Bob.
This is all quite interesting. Thank you for all this good information. We are colder here than Connecticut, and my orchard is about on the borderline of zones 3 and 4. I hesitate to shell out money on an expensive grafted pecan tree until I know of someone who has actually had one fruit in this area. Did Survivor actually fruit in St. Paul? My orchard is not in the city, so would be colder even than St. Paul. I would appreciate hearing of others’ experiences with pecan trees in Wisconsin and Minnesota, whether positive or negative. Thanks, all.
northwoods . . .
It’s not that the selections Bob and I are discussing are not cold-hardy… it’s that you need to calculate your frost free days and degree heating units to satisfy your own self. Zone 3 is pushing it, o.k. Zone 4, no . . .
When you get there type in the zip code that you need information on, and set your base at 65 and select Fahrenheit
The columns show CDD (cooling degree days) total at the bottom and HDD (heating degree days) - total also at the bottom of each column.
Here is data for Aledo, IL. for example. I compared 2012 to year 2015 but year values can be changed to suit whichever years you’d like to see. This would come in very-very handy when seeing how large or small a crop of pecans/hickory for (a) given year was produced.
COOLING & HEATING DEGREE DAYS Aledo, IL
In 2012 Aledo had 1237 Cooling Degree Days (CDD) and 3434 Heating Degree Days (HDD)
In comparison year 2015 Aledo has had 1017 CDD thus far and has had 4397 HDD thus far.
What most people miss-calculate in figuring frost free days, is that pecan foliage and buds are killed at around 26 degrees, not 32 degrees. So to an accurate idea of how many growing days one has is to find out when the temperature stops falling below 28 degrees in the spring, and when it starts to fall below 28 degrees in the fall.
Bob Harper ^^^
Now for Frost Free Days
If you’d like to check other locations:
Then here’s a picture tutorial on how to achieve results:
Step 1: Click on a State
Step 2: Click on a County
Step 3: from the dropdown menu choose Section II where you currently see Section I
Step 4: Now select Climatic Data by clicking on it.
Step 5: Now select/click AgACIS (Agricultural Applied Climate Information)
Step 6: Choose the values. (Frost/freeze dates) (Location) Set Variable to 28 F (Year or Years) Then Click GO.
Lastly @northwoodswis4, A plain northern pecan rootstock is the norm which the selections Bob and I have talked about are grafted onto. Even though ‘northern pecan’ are typically pecans grown from places such as Missouri being one example, they are hardy thru zone 4.
Hope this all helps now!
All readers, I mad a mistake in the information I gave on pecans.
Ernie’s Deer Stand and Wes’s Green Island Beaver are not the same. Wes states that his Green island Beaver is also aka: Cornfield.
Sorry if I caused any confusion. There is enough confusion on correct names as it is.
I’ll have to study this all out, it appears. Right now I am enjoying watching the snow falling outside.
@robert_2007 et al:
Got an interesting email from Wes Rice about Carya illinoinensis ‘Warren 346’
"Warren 346 is one of those cultivars with significant overlap in pollen shed and pistillate receptivity. It has some other unusual properties also besides unusually early nut maturity for a nut of that size–it has late precocity and a “unruly” tree structure. Back in Tommy Thompson’s tenure at the USDA pecan breeding station, he said Warren 346 was Type II, and informed me that the only sure way to tell on any cultivar is when the stigma is receptive to pollen grain adherence (pollen sticks to the receptive stigma). It’s pretty easy to tell when pollen dehiscence occurs from the anthers on the catkin. If you “flick” the catkin and pollen comes out, this establishes when pollen shed occurs. Some times in rainy or extreme humidity, pollen shed will be retarded-- reducing the period of pollen shed or delaying the start- or terminating the shed early. Using this criteria, Warren 346 is Type II – at least on my trees. Pistil size and shape are also indicators of dichogamy-- but not foolproof.
Bill Reid, last I heard, is going by the visual appearance of the catkin-- which is not always accurate. At one time, Reid and Ken Hunt(I believe) had it classed as Type II also. I think Dale Warren also called it Type II, but don’t know if it was from his observation, or by someone else.
I’m sure this may be as clear as thick mud!
I’ve got two seedling selections, made by nutgrower friends in MI - ‘Nofs Early’ from Gordon Nofs in Flint, and one from Roger Miller in Eaton Rapids(I just call it Roger Miller… 'cause I’ve already got his ‘King of the Road’ shagbark…). Grafted them years ago, and they’re still stuck in the nursery row, now too big for me to hand-dig and move. I don’t have any first-hand experience with the nuts, scab-resistance, or anything along those lines, but these two long-time nutgrowers, now in their 80s, thought they were good enough to keep.
I don’t know if they’d produce in zone 4, but scionwood’s available if anyone wants to try them.
Dax, thanks for posting the email you got from Wes, pertaining to Warren 346.
That makes Warren 346 a much desirable partner for folks in very cold areas, looking for the correct pollinating pair of pecans.
I’m thinking that I would add Iowa, Green Island Beaver, and James Early.
I’m still in the process of trying obtain other cold hardy pecans, that might possible do well in in a zone 4
What are you ordering, 2018
I’ve also got P-3, which is a Carl Weschke far-northern pecan selection. It’s never produced nuts here - so I can’t swear that it is ‘as advertised’… scionwood came from David Johnson, who was the NNGA Hickory chairman, a number of years back - along with some ‘W-17’ shagbark.
Thought I had NC-6, too - but I’m not sure I could locate it now… it was a selection, IIRC from Doug Campbell in Ontario… photos I’ve seen of the nut strongly resemble ‘Peruque’, a selection from St. Charles MO - which is usually dropping mature nuts here on 15 September (but weevils and jays/crows hit it hard… and scab is a problem some years)
Try Green Barn. They say they have zone 3 pecans. That’s about all I know about their pecans. I will try to attach their link.
Can’t seem to be able to attach their link for you.
But, there are the Green barn in Canada.
Lucky, thank you for the offer of scion wood for Nof’s Early. I would like to take you up on that offer. If you could spare 6 pieces, I would appreciate it.
Do you have any additional information on Nof’s early?
Such as when it shuck splits compared to Colby.?
Is it protogynous, or protandrous?
Do you have any information on the pecan, you are calling Millers.
Also, would you happen to have the real Hadu # 2 ?
Let me know how much I need to send to you to cover cost and shipping.
My email address is: firstname.lastname@example.org