steve fwiw the green onions tend to be much, much better (milder, denser) in spring…not saying you shouldn’t try them, just saying if you’re disappointed, try some next april before you decide they’re losers.
never have tried using the bulbils but if you took the time they’d be neat little pickles
when we were on vacation in thailand several yrs back we bought a lot of food at market, including fruits and produce…one day I bought like 1/4 lb garlic in teeny, tiny cloves. I didn’t realize it then, but they were bulbils. It takes a lot of them to equal an intact clove, but they do peel easy.
My I’itoi Onions and Multiplier Leeks arrived today! Here they are planted in similar setups as the Society Garlic and Rakkyo (in dish-drying tubs with drilled holes; peat moss, garden soil & quartz sand):
And here’s the first flower bud on one Society Garlic plant (before it even regenerated its leaves:
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I kept searching for information on Garlic (I gotta say, I love the idea of perennializing a patch and using the bulbils, thanks!), and got some great stuff on warm-climate growing! And also some varietal recommendations that can handle heat, and some that seemingly even require it.
Grey Duck Garlic - Among their recommendations, I’m interested in trialing Lorz Italian (a Softneck, Artichoke type that nonetheless occasionally develops scapes with “huge bulbils”… good perennial potential?), and some heat-loving Hardnecks (Bogatyr and Siberian.
mmm, garlic - They recommend the hardneck Creole types, which are even grown in the Gulf Coast! Continued online reading revealed the Creoles to be the usual garlic of choice for warm climates. I’m interested in trialing Creole Red, Ajo Rojo, Burgundy, Cuban Purple, and Guatemalan & Moroccan.
Garlicana also mentions an unclassified variety called Lampang, from Thailand (given the climate, it seems promising).
I’d also like to try Elephant Garlic again, though I’m not sure I could perennialize it as anything other than a leek (it makes flowers, not bulbils). It might also make for good breeding: I’ve read that crossing conventional leeks with their wild multiplier brethren leads to less-than-satisfactory results. Perhaps crossing the multiplier leek with elephant garlic instead might yield something more useful? I know of one variety of perpetual leek derived from conventional leek stock (Delft Perpetual), but I’m not sure what the results would be like if crossed with true multiplier leeks.
I just placed an order for Elephant Garlic seed corms. Last night I soaked some seeds (now planted) of Onion Chives, Garlic Chives and Nodding Onion, as well as Garlic Mustard (an honorary member).
Meanwhile, between yesterday and today, I received some Ramsons / Bear Garlic (A. ursinum) and Canada Onion / Meadow Garlic (A. canadense). I gave ‘em the soak and planted them temporarily in some small pots (the permanent spot will be a similar container to the others, once acquired). A pic, Ramsons on the left, Canada Onion on the right:
I’ve been losing my garlic and multiplier onions to gophers this spring. Gradually catching up to them with traps. Sad to see a large bunch pulled halfway down into the hole. Lots of other garden goodies to be had, but since they’re all starting to bulb up, I suppose they offer the most succulent item on the menu. Arrrrgggggg. Severely cut into next years seed or this years eating, one of the two.
How do you manage with Gophers and other such pests? Is there any chance of eradication? I have trouble with June Bugs eating my root crops (ruined my Yacon harvest), I can’t imagine having to deal with Gophers.
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So far, I’ve had exceedingly poor self-control in keeping my Collector’s mindset in check. Yesterday I ordered Allium moly. Today, I placed a fall order at Filaree Farm for Lorz Italian Softneck & Cuban Purple Hardneck Garlic, and French Grey Shallot (Griselle, A. oschaninii). Species-wise, it seems I’m missing very few from my collection, and in particular my next target is Rosy Garlic (A. roseum).
Whatever survives the next few years in my garden may receive a permanent spot in my Sofrito recipe (the original impetus that led me to trial so many Allium species). You can’t have yellow rice without Sofrito (and Chicken Bullion & Sazón). Our recipe here calls for blended up (in eyeballed quantities) Recao / Culantro, Cilantro, Sweet Peppers (especially sweet Ají peppers), Oregano… and Onion & Garlic. All the other ingredients are very simple to grow here, the Alliums were the issue. Biennial Bulb Onions seemed a bit complicated (which is why I leaned towards multiplier types like the I’itoi), and Garlic was a conundrum, so I set out to trial as many species as I could. Time will tell what grows well here, but I’m particularly sad that the Ramps didn’t work out; I’ve heard they’re very tasty.
I became lazy when I let my garlic stay in the ground 
but I stumbled on what I found was an easier way to have fresh garlic earlier in the season. I leave my garlic in my flower beds and use the greens early in the spring and all summer. I also just steal a clove or two leaving the main clump. Perennial garlic stands are way easier than the usual method of growing them for the bulbs.
I never thought of using the top sets but maybe it is because we harvest the scapes when they double curl and freeze them for winter use. I will have to save some and try this.
ETA I am in zone 2a so garlic certainly does survive a deep freeze and still lives.
i grow mine in raised beds unmulched and exposed to the northwest wind and have never lost a bulb . garlic is definitly very cold hardy. we got little snow this year and the egyptian onions i put under the mulch last fall are growing gangbusters!
not all garlics are equally hardy.
I think the hardnecks and specificaly porcelain and rocambole but also likely the purple groups are most hardy (purple striped, glazed purple striped and marbled purple striped.)
Since most garlic we get no longer produces seeds naturally. (the bulbils in the flower head pushes out the flowers before they seed) A lot are clones and mutants. I remember reading a genetic paper that tested them and found multiple named varieties to be genetically identical. (could still be epigenetic differences etc) Ill post if ill find it back.
Anyway most garlics from different groups are genetically different. So if you buy varieties try and get some from most groups. Instead of get 10 purple striped varieties (wich are quite similair if not identical)
Anyway, when i find the time i plan to try and get true garlic seeds and hybridise a bit.
For that you have to pull out the bulbils in the flower whith a tweezer, so it can flower.
However due to the years and years (hundred if not thousdands) of garlic being propegated vegatativly. Mutations that effect flower fertility have not been selected for. So i expect 5-10% viable seeds if im lucky. Should get back to “normal” in a few generations or a decade of work XD
never tried softnecks here but every hardneck ive grown so far are z3b hardy at least. ive grown romanian and geogian red , montana white and georgia fire.
I only grow hardneck garlic but I grew so many varieties and mixed them all up I am not sure what I have left. Last year I planted some multiplier onions and intentionally left a whole row in for the winter. Every onion has come back and now I can pick green onions. It might not seem like much to those in warmer areas, but in zone 2 we are just putting onions in now and these from last year have been up for the last 2 weeks. Not to mention these were not mulched and we had -40C for a 2 week stretch.
Sometimes experimenting comes up with interesting results.
i shudder to think about your temperatures. -40C for 2 weeks. 0_0 That your still alive. I gues you adapt to it, and plan your life around it. But i can’t imagine leaving my house with -40. Or even surviving inside my house if it went to -40C outside.
Kinda amazing that plants can even survive -40C especially since water freezes at 0C
Do you loose many branches/buds on your apples due to frost? or do they reliably survive -40c?
Some apples are reliable to -40C and colder. I had no dieback on my Sweet 16 or Chestnut, and we have crabapples that do well. I have a few plums Waneta and Mount Royal that do not suffer, nanking and the romance sour cherries do great.
I guess you could call it adaption, I call it home. I cannot imagine having to live with summer temperatures consistently above 80F, now that would finish me. As strictly a northern person I would not like tp be in a country that did not get winter, each to his own or we would all be clammering to live in the same place.
we occasionally hit - 40c/ -40f here but havent for about 8 yrs. now. 3 winters ago we got -37f and all my plants came thru it unscathed. its the weeks of -30 that seem to do more damage esp. if theres alot of wind. wind in winter in the north really sucks! im with you Urulsa. i look for a A/C once the temps get over 70f!
Here it gets hot even before the summer heat kicks in. Daytime winter temperatures are usually above 80. I do have A/C in my house and it’d be suffocating without it at times, but having visited a couple of southernmost states in the winter (no snow), I couldn’t bear the thought of living in a temperate climate. I’m a tropical boy through and through. If you can handle those low temps to the point that you prefer ‘em, you’re a true champion!
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Today my Elephant Garlic and Allium moly bulbs arrived. I can take a pic when I get back home. Meanwhile, my Society Garlic rewarded me with the full bloom:
I lost the Elephant Garlic bulbs. I waited too long to plant them, they were dry and dead (they were small cormels kept in a plastic baggie at room temp). I’ll be getting big cloves soon, since I’m actively gardening again.
The A. moly bulbs somehow survived my neglectful period, and have been growing slowly for a few weeks.
I was surprised with a single Ramson plant long after the others had died, and I’ve since repotted it with better soil. I feel like this bodes decently well for its capacity to survive in the tropics.
The Walking Onions dwindled in the dryness pf my fig tree’s pot, but I dug up the last two, gave ‘em a chlorine dip and planted them with my last Yacón (a more humid environment).
My stratified Nodding Onion seeds did not sprout, so I gotta get more (it was during the neglectful period). I recently planted Chive and Garlic Chive seeds (and Garlic Mustard!), and am waiting for them to sprout. The Welsche Onions I had sprouted (both green and red) had dwindled during my neglect, but I rescued the last few of each and they’re starting to grow better, though slowly. (I prefer the older “Welsche” spelling – meaning foreign – because they’re not actually from Wales).
The Society Garlic has been the gift that keeps on giving, surviving any neglect I put it through. I’ve been tasting all my actively growing alliums by nibbling flowers or leaves, and I can now confirm Society Garlic has an unmistakable flavor of real garlic. I highly recommend it! (Incidentally, A. moly also tastes of actual garlic though slightly milder, at least as a young sprout; Ramsons taste quite strongly of Garlic).
The Canada Onions resprouted well after they had died back (I was worried I’d lost them). They surprised me with a flavor that’s hard to place, seemingly somewhere on the scale between garlic and onion.
The Rakkyo, Perpetual Leeks and I’itoi Onions have survived with little issue. The leeks are more vigorous than expected, the Onions seemingly slower and more delicate than expected, and the Rakkyo are all round tough. Apparently the Rakkyo had bloomed at one point, I found them with a spent flowerhead; they taste like onion.
Rakkyo:
Leeks:
Onions:
And finally, the Filaree bulbs…
The Cuban Purple Garlic and French Grey Shallots have just barely started sprouting, but the Lorz Italian is going gangbusters, all in all a promising start. I’d like to perennialize some of the Lorz Italian and grow it for the bulbils and greens, as well as growing them the standard way.
Seems some memes, prayers and other such pics snuck into my last post (didn’t even see all of ‘em, soon as I saw what happened, I deleted in a mortified panic). That’s what I get for posting while sleep deprived (I got home from the night shift some hours ago, and I’m outside again).
Here’s what I meant to post:
So much for my first post in months. Now if you’ll excuse me, I’m going home to cringe myself to sleep. Good day everyone. 
Nice pictures.
My allium growing is down to a routine. I don’t think about it much any more, it works for me.
For me, deer and other fauna chomp down garlic and onions, and they fail to thrive. So they are grown in my fenced garden, in raised beds.
My favorite garlic now is Music, a hard neck. I plant in Oct. This year I also planted a soft neck, Lorz. By now, the Music is about four inches tall. Only a few of the Lorz came up.
Through the winter, most of my coffee grounds and crush eggshells go onto the garlic bed. I cultivate very lightly and shallow with stirrup hoe.
In Spring, I give them a boost of organic fertilizer. I keep them watered until early July, when I let them dry out and dig them.
Then I plant bush beans. They give a nice crop by mid sept. So those beds get two food crops a year. Then I cultivate and add a layer of leaves for next year, when I’ll grow a non allium in that bed.
I grow chives in an open bottom container. Also garlic chives, which are for the main vegetable for our Chinese dumplings.
I have grown Egyptian Walking Onions for more than 20 years from a start I got back then from Southern Exposure Seed Exchange, I think. I usually neglect them. I try to plant them where I wont need to plant an annual crop, often at the end rows of raised beds or large containers. They are welcome in Spring as scallions. If I pay attention, dont let them top set or have divisions, they make a decent onion bulb, but the top sets for next year’s scallions are the main point. Also, replanting the bulbs gives a larger and earlier crop of scallions.
I grow my main crop onions from seeds. I plant them indoors in Jan or Feb. For me, that is more successful - larger bulbs - than using sets or purchased plants. In 2021 I also did that with shallots, growing from seeds. They were quite good and large.
I have tried potato onions. They haven’t done that well for me. This year I found a bag of what looked like them at the discount store. They were labeled partly in French but looked like potato onions. Origin was Quebec! I grew them, and might have enough to try again next year. Also, one made a seed head and I saved seeds from that.
Bees love all allium flowers - onions, shallots, chives, garlic chives. They are great bee plants.
What’s the hottest hardiness zone Allium tricoccum will tolerate out in the wild? Native range maps show that it doesn’t extend down into Texas…yet its hardiness zone has been listed down to 9b (which includes much of Texas)?
They readily cross pollinate and thus maintaining a true seed source can be difficult. On the other hand, a chance cross between the wild onion of the CA coastal redwood groves and a standard “elephant garlic” produced some outstanding offspring.
