Attika is in fact one of those Eastern Europe cherries, it is Czech. It is called “Kordia” in Europe I believe.
Scott, Attika (Kordia), and Vanda.
The two varieties are extremely interesting for you.
Its resistance to cracking is the highest in both varieties.
I am seeing at information on Czech websites and both varieties are excellent.
Unfortunately you cannot demand resistance to Canker to a variety of cherry, as there is no cherry tree that has resistance to the causative bacteria “Pseudomonas syringae”.
The most appropriate thing in that sense is to choose a rootstock that is as resistant as possible, and logically rootstock that is coming from plum ( they are the most resistant ) , for example the Mariana rootstock, with an intermediate graft from Adara to make it compatible with the cherry variety, has to give you good results .
Regards
Jose
1 Like
Yes many cherries are rated well for crack resistance. I actively search for cherries that are rated excellent for crack resistance or are know to be highly resistant to brown rot. All of the cherries I have planted have excellent crack resistance but that doesn’t really mean much in my climate. The test methods and ratings for cracking are meant to be used by growers in prime commercial cherry growing regions which have little summer rainfall- not in regions with high summer rainfall. With high rainfall, all cherries will crack even the tart cherries which are much more resistant than sweet cherries.
You’re in Castilla la Mancha , Spain which has a very dry Mediterranean climate. I am in a Continental climate with hot, humid summers. I get 1020 mm of rainfall annually and in the month of July when cherries ripen I get 100 mm.
The cherry crack resistance ratings are meant to be used in areas where cracking risk is low. So a excellent crack rating just means the cherry is crack resistant in a climate like yours. Many of people on the forum live on the East Coast of the United States. A climate similar to mine and they also have problems with cracking and that’s with crack resistant cherries.
It’s discussed in this thread
I really wish there were crack proof cherries for my climate but I don’t believe they exist. And I have nothing against large cherries but it’s far down the list of needed characteristics for a good cherry for me. I don’t need to sell cherries for fresh eating (price is highly dependent on size) so resistance to cracking, brown rot, and canker is very important. And of course flavor is very important.
1 Like
mroot, sorry you’re late hahahahaha
We are already addressing the issue of “very” cracking and disease resistant cherries.
There’s a lot .
That I live in Castilla La Mancha does not imply that I am unaware of the behavior of the different varieties of cherries in their countries of origin, with poor aptitude for this crop.
Scott (he’s a smart guy), has already looked at some of the varieties from Eastern Europe, for example the Attika (Kordia) variety, or Vanda.
But there are varieties much more resistant to cracking and diseases.
Read a little about these varieties.
Especially :
- Fabiola
- Justyna (I have this variety and it is wonderful, it is one of the best tasting cherries in the world)
- Regina
Etc…
Regards
Jose
2 Likes
We already have another variety that is included in the ranking.
It is the Canadian variety
- SUMN314CH SABRINA ( Pico Summerland Station)
Size : big ( 28 - 30 mm)
Firmness : very firm ; 75 Durofel
Taste quality : sweet and sugary fruit : 17° Brix
Cracking tolerance : good
fruitgrower, I have studied Royal Helen and Utah Giant varieties.
Let’s start from the base that I have both varieties in my orchard (from the Royal series, I have almost all of them in my orchard ).
I love both varieties, but both have medium resistance to cracking, so for your conditions and mine they are suitable, but they do not meet the parameters established in the ranking, and they are not useful varieties for all orchards in different regions. and climates.
Feeling it from the bottom of my heart, and being a tremendous fan of both varieties , I have to discard them.
From my point of view, the best varieties of the Royal series are Royal Baliley (Royal Ansel), Royal Helen, and Royal Edie, and undoubtedly the best of the series is Royal Bailey (Ansel ) , but none meets the high cracking resistance parameter , and we cannot include them, since they are only suitable for climates with low humidity.
Regards
Jose
5 Likes
So only the Lapins meets your standards. We would have to look at the Pearl Series, Burgandy, Black, and Ebony. These are commercial cherries and hard to get. We like Lappins but it’s hard to beat a 30 brix Utah giant, Bing, Coral Champagne, or Van cherry here, so they get top honors. My Royal Lynn cherries below are very early, very firm, really tasty, and have a high level of crack resistance. However they are not large enough for your standard, so they don’t make the cut. We have maybe 1 out of 4 years our cherries crack here, and there are always good ones to pick. So I would rather grow higher quality cherries, than crack resistant ones. Commercial farmers want a good crop every year, so they grow the more crack resistant cherries with good size and firmness. The client can only see the fruit before buying, so quality is not the first point. As a home grower I want the very best of the best, so that’s what I grow. @Jose-Albacete, what is your favorite cherry to eat there in your climate?
4 Likes
Hi Jon.
Yes indeed we are going to include the Lapins variety in the ranking (it passes the selection cut, by the hair of a bald man hahahaha due to the caliber).
I will already contribute to the post the Lapins varietal file.
I sincerely hate the Lapins variety, due to its great tendency to vertical growth, which makes it difficult to form the tree in its juvenile state (we will talk about the new formation pruning systems for cherry trees, it will be of tremendous help for for all of you , but I am translating the tutorial, and it takes a lot of work)
Royal Linn does not make the cut, but Royal Tioga perfectly meets all the parameters and must be included in the ranking.
The parameter of good resistance to cracking is absolutely essential to choose good varieties suitable for our orchards (you and I do not have many problems, but it is no fun for cherries to crack due to humidity, and it is a good way to recommend the cultivation of cherry varieties for guaranteed success).
It is necessary to have a very clear concept.
If a professional farmer, chooses carefully the varieties of the fruit plantation from him orchard .
Us as amateurs, and because it is our hobby, we have to be even more demanding in this regard, and plant in our orchards only the best varieties for our edaphoclimatic conditions, otherwise, we will be very mediocre fruit growers.
What are the favorite varieties of cherries in my orchard?
This is a difficult question to answer.
If I had an orchard with 10 varieties of cherries it would be very easy, but I have more than 80 varieties of cherries in my orchard hahahahahahaha
I can tell you, I really like these varieties
The Royal series all varieties, the Sweet series from the alma mater of the University of Bologna the 7 varieties, Brooks is very tasty, but is surpassed by Glenred Sequoia, in the Star series of the University of Bologna, the varieties Grace Star, Lala Star and Big Star are really excellent.
Selah and Utah Giant both magnificent, from Eastern Europe there are many good ones, but I highly recommend the Justyna variety (possibly the best tasting cherry in the world), and Tamara.
The Canadians of Summerland Celeste, Stacatto, and Samba are very good too, etc …
Beware of the varieties in the Pearl series, there are four that will surely all be in the ranking (Burgundy, Ebony, Black, and Radiance).
They are not difficult to find, I am from Spain, and this winter I bought the 4 varieties in American nurseries.
We have a lot of post ahead.
Regards
Jose
6 Likes
I am reading this thread with interest because I love cherries. The information that is relevant to me is this: Are any of the sweet cherries tested and reliable survivors in zone 5b? Regarding where, climate wise, these varieties can be grown hasn’t been mentioned. Also can pie cherries be grafted onto Krymsk 6?
I think you should be fine with most sweet cherries in zone 5b. I am myself on the zone 5/6 border. Your main problem will be brown rot unless your climate has dry, low humidity summers. I would take a look at the Eastern Sweet Cherries thread I linked in my post above. With sweet cherries you will definitely need to spray fungicide.
As for Krymsk 6 being compatible with pie cherries I don’t know for sure. I do know the license holder lists both Krymsk 5 and 6 as being compatible. See the link to the page below and click on Krymsk in the menu to get their release notes for Krymsk 5 and 6.
http://p2g.us.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/
I also know Krymsk 5 was listed as not compatible with Montmorency by Fowler Nurseries at one time. The release note for Krymsk 5 mentions graft over growth for tart cherries and I experienced something similar when I did Krymsk 5/Montmorency grafts. My question for you is where are you getting Krymsk 6 rootstock? Dwarfing cherry rootstock is hard to get and most cases it much easier and cost effective to buy finished trees.
mroot Thanks for the info. Were pretty close to each other , I’m in the Quad Cities. Last year I bought 3, Krymsk 6 rootstock from someone at the North American Scion exchange. They were real little so when they are larger I want to graft multiple varieties on them. But I’m thinking maybe I’m better off with P.Americana with a Puente interstem? It seems the sweet cherry trees get so large and I’m thinking the P. Americana would give me a more manageable tree.
I think Krymsk 6 would be fine as far as size if you train and prune well. With cherry rootstocks dwarfing varies depending if you’re on the West coast with dry conditions or the East coast with wet conditions. Krymsk and the Gisela series are much more dwarfing on the East coast. Krymsk 6 is rated at about 50% standard under East coast conditions.
I wouldn’t use it as a basis of a multi-graft frankentree though. Krymsk 6 is sensitive to certain latent viruses and each time you add a new graft you risk killing the entire tree. Krymsk is best used for single cultivar trees.
3 Likes
Hi Masbustelo, from my point of view what you want is totally viable.
Let’s start with the Krymsk 6 rootstock.
Krymsk 6, is totally suitable for cold climates, and with humidity in the soil, it tolerates both, without any problem.
As for the varieties of cherry to be grafted, the range of possibilities is very wide.
I would go for the cracking resistant Canadian varieties from the Pico Summerland station.
These varieties work well in British Columbia, so in your region they should bear perfectly well.
The Eastern European varieties, there are also ultra-resistant to cracking, but they may be more difficult for you to find.
Among the cracking resistant Canadian varieties, these are interesting.
Early flowering varieties:
- Samba Sumste: Compatibility Group II, Genotype S1S3
- Lapins: self-fertile and universal pollinator of early flowering varieties ( pollinator of Samba )
Intermediate flowering varieties:
- Sandra Rose: self-fertile and universal pollinator of intermediate flowering varieties
- Skeena: self-fertile and universal pollinator of intermediate flowering varieties
- Compac Stella: self-fertile and universal pollinator of intermediate flowering varieties
Late flowering varieties:
- Blackgold: this variety is North American, self-fertile and universal pollinator of intermediate flowering varieties
There are many more varieties that are as resistant or more resistant to your weather, but they are more difficult varieties to obtain for you.
If you are interested, we can comment on them.
The apricots are not a good option, as they have many problems with spring frosts, and you would have to choose ultra-late flowering varieties such as Sugar Pearls, etc …
Regards
Jose
3 Likes
The chance seedling yellow pie cherry
Growing near the Puyallup River;
Was healthy
Free of Brown Rot
No splitting
Productive and had good sugars.
For this climate
It’s superior to most Commercial Sweet Cherries
Also
The birds are less of a problem
For yellow cherries.
I need to go look for that tree again.
This is very true.
I’m going to put some European varieties of the most resistant to cracking.
- Justyna:
It is a cherry with an exceptional flavor, be careful that this cherry that have very very very high taste level.
https://artevos.de/sortenuebersicht/#Obstart_40
- Early Korvick:
Very good cherry, with excellent flavor and tremendously resistant to cracking
http://www.czeresnie.com.pl/en/early-korvik-ii.html
- Fabiola:
This variety is highly recommended, since apart from being very resistant to cracking, it is very resistant to cold, and diseases
http://www.czeresnie.com.pl/en/fabiola-ii.html
- Irena:
Excellent cherry resistant to everything, cracking, cold, and diseases
http://www.czeresnie.com.pl/en/irena-ii.html
- Sandra:
Attention to this variety as it is very large in size, very good flavor, and absolutely resistant to cracking.
http://www.czeresnie.com.pl/en/sandra-ii.html
- Regina:
German variety, it is one of the first varieties that I started to grow, it is fantastic, tremendously resistant to cracking, and it is available in the United States
https://www.davewilson.com/product-information-commercial/product/regina-cherry
This is just a small example, there are many more European varieties resistant to cracking, and they are totally suitable for cultivation in cold and humid climates.
The varieties that you have seen , they have been obtained in the Holovousy Pomological Institute in the Czech Republic ( except Regina who is German ) , I have quite a few of these varieties in my orchard, and they are fantastic.
If we already want a bulletproof resistance, there are Ukrainian varieties, that do not crack if hit them with a hammer hahahahahahaha
Regards
Jose
11 Likes
Regarding the hardness or firmness of the cherries when ripe: Does one want a maximum hardness? Or only to a certain point?
In the northeast cherries tend to be the least rewarding fruit for amateurs to grow. Scott lists cracking and rot as separate problems, but it is cracking that leads to all the rot problems with trees I manage. I have never found a truly crack resistant sweet cherry, although I’ve tried several from Cornell specifically bred to produce well here.
Now if you happen to get a couple weeks of dry weather as cherries ripen and spring wasn’t wet enough to rot the flowers and it is an off year for squirrels AND you net the trees from birds (or baffle for squirrels and net for birds which is a real PIA) you may actually harvest some delicious fruit- but no better than what can be purchased in the store. Cherries from the west ship very well and high demand keeps them moving.
I agree with Scott’s assessment about White Gold, albeit with limited experience. All my blossoms were frozen last season by late frost.
5 Likes
Hi Jose,
Justyna and Early Korvik both have Kordia as one of their parents. Do you think they are different enough to justify planting both in an home orchard?
From your description one is really tempted to order Justyna. The only problem I see with it is its ripening time. In my location I try to plant early ripening cherries only because of different pest pressures (eg. spotted wing drosophila and other). So Early Korvik might be the better choice for my situation. If they are different enough though, I wouldn’t mind planting both to see which works for me.
I also think about Pacific Red and Rocket. Do those rank in the same league as Justyna and Early Korvik?
BR
2 Likes
It really is a question of the texture you want. Basically it’s like asking if Pepsi or Coke is better it’s a personal preference. That’s from the point of view of eating the cherry. If you like very firm cherries it’s important, if you don’t care firmness is unimportant and if you hate firmness then firm cherries are awful.
Here is a good example of this. Myself as a child I ate tons of tart cherries which are soft. No real experience with eating sweet cherries. My Grandparents made a trip to Michigan and brought back a box of Bing cherries. So the family was eating the cherries and saying they were awesome. I then tasted a couple and hated the firm texture. I was thinking why didn’t they buy " real cherries" instead of these awful Bings. lol
From a grower’s perspective in an area of high rainfall usually very firm = high cracking which is bad. Old heirloom cherries like Black Tartarian tend to be soft and resist cracking better. There are modern firm cherries that are crack resistant because the breeding program bred them for this characteristic.
2 Likes
Hi carot.
Justyna has a very, very good flavor, and it pollinates with Early Korvick, both varieties are very good.
Rocket is tremendously good but very very very good , but it is a variety that produces little harvest (its quality is excellent and it is worth it despite being a low productive variety).
I recommend the Sweet Lorenz varieties, and as a pollinator Pacific Red or Royal Tioga.
Sweet Lorenz is "the mother of all the varieties of cherries there are and to be " , and this is not an assumption, it is a fact.
For you it is very easy since you are in Germany, just tell me how many cherry trees you can afford to graft for your orchard and I recommend the appropriate varieties depending on the amount you tell me.
I make a small package and send the graft cuttings to Germany.
Masbustelo, eating a cherry with a soft texture is not pleasant, the good gustative quality is a cherry crunchy when eaten , a 70-80 index Durofel is fantastic.
Alan, of course in humid and cold climates the varieties of cherries for hot climates are not suitable, but as I have said there are excellent varieties suitable for growing in cold and humid climates , with a size, texture and flavor as good as the ones of hot climates.
They must not give up so soon, and you must try the varieties that I recommend.
mroot, a soft flesh cherry is not pleasant in any way, I understand that there are tastes for all colors, but crunchy cherries are much more pleasant in terms of eating quality
A small example with the texture of cherries.
The Canadian 3-13 cherry variety is fantastic as it has a very large caliber, it is very productive and even so it maintains large caliber fruits, and it has a very good taste but its texture is soft, and therefore it is not pleasant to eat.
Regards
Jose
4 Likes