Stropping often includes stropping compound which is abrasive. Also, stropping without compound is intended to remove the burr, not form it. Remaining burr prevents a razor sharp edge.
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Barkslip, thatâs what I use for my kitchen knives. I donât think Iâve used it on my grafting knife.
When doing the single bevel on your grafting knife, what angle do you use? 30 degrees?
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Ive got a couple diamond DMT steels that are like a steel on steroids, they dont just realign but will actually sharpen quickly once you get the hang of it.
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I just finished flattening the backs of a new set of bench chisels then sharpening them. Then I did two low angle block planes and a #4 smoothing plane. Iâm pretty happy with the system I have set up for this, and today I used it to sharpen 4 grafting knives. I have a Trend diamond plate (english) with 300 on one side and 1000 on the other. I use HoneRite on the plate as a lubricant, itâs a concentrate you mix with water and it makes the water anti-corrosive so it doesnât rust the diamond plate. I also use HoneRite on the whet stones. The 300 grit side of the diamond plate is great for flattening my whet stones. I generally start with 1000 diamond plate, them move to a 3000 grit whet stone, then 8000 grit whet stone, then finish with a Shapton 16,000 grit stone that leaves a mirror polish. With the chisels and plane blades a secondary bevel and tertiary bevel help to prevent having to grind back the entire initial 25 degree grind. Hope to work on my kitchen knives as well.
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THank you for that interesting bit of trivia! Really. I wondered how that worked. Sounds like knife sharpening is a science. Meanwhile I need to learn what a burr and some of these other terms (stropping) mean! ha. Just like fruit trees- the more I learn the less I realize I know! ha
I myself have a 5K and 10k (might be 8k) stone.
And a courser one to.
going straight from a 1K to 5K is no problem. Donât waste $$ on smal grit âstepsâ
i do however want to note, if your just starting out. The difference between a dull knife and it sharpend on a 1K stone. gets you 98% âthereâ
Technicaly and practicaly it will get noticibly sharper if you then go to a 5K stone. But your cost/preformance takes a hit. Since the differece in finish between 1K and 5K is not that great. And 5K+ stones can cost a bit.
A knife sharpend on a 5K stone is not 5 times sharper than on a 1K stone!!!
higher grits have high diminishing returns!
And if your not practised in sharpening. Going to 5k after âincorrectly or incompletlyâ sharpening on 1K give you practicaly no extra sharpnes.
i (think i) can feel the difference between 5k and 10k. But it might be mostly placebo effect. I know it technically matters and there is a difference. But practicaly with the steel we use for grafting knifes and how we use it. There is probably not a significant difference.
i am attached to my 10k stone. But it is the least usefull and most expensive of all my stones. Im not sure i âregretâ buying it. But i gues that $$ could have definitly been better spent.
Same for kitchen knifes, apart from edge cases like sushi. Mostly 1K wetstone wil get you 98% âthereâ
Going courser than 1k (like an atoma 120 diamond plate)
Has more use imo. Mainly if your repairing damage knifes. And are setting a new bevel.
For this you need some experiance though. So for a new sharpener i would advise to just get a quality 1000 grit stone. And practise till you can shave with the knife. At that point you know enough to make a good decision about courser or finer stones.
However this topic is more for new sharpeners.
And for them. a 1000 grit japansese water stone. Will likely be the best âfitâ
It wonât be ideal to repair extreemly damage knifes. (but can, with a lot of work=practise)
It wonât give the sharpest âeverâ edge.
But it will make your knifes sharper than when they where new. And is the ideal grit to touch up slightly dull knives and maintain them sharp. Is also a nice grit range to learn on. Not so course that a mistake costs your dearly. Not so fine as to barely make a scratch.
1 size fits "most"
Donât get all the different âgrit sizesâ you donât need them. And you will likely skimp on quality to âcollect em allâ. Which will make a difference!
fixing "not a problem"
The different sharpening systems can work. But most of them try to fix the âholding knife at exactly x angle problemâ
However in most cases you donât need to hold the knife at exactly the same angle. So the problem the sharpening systems âfixâ is barely a problem (if it is at all, there are some proâs and conâs to concave edges. Witch you get from varying the angle during sharpening)
That does not mean the sharpening systems do not âworkâ. They certainly do.
But just like freehand sharpening. Require practise and training. Understanding how a bur works. And the difference between edge leading or edge trailing stroke. Those things give the biggest results. And both have to be trained/learned. Doesenât matter if it is freehand or system X
some thing has to give
Those sharpening systems either spend less on the âabraisiveâ part. Or just cost a lot more.
The money for the âsystemâ part has to come from somewhere.
Compare it to painting your outside house.
You can spend the majority of your budget on a good painting book (system). And get cheap paint and brushes.
Or you could watch a youtube tutorial, and get the quality paint and brushes.
Which would give better results in the long run?
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stropping
it actually goes further than that.
It is for a large part realligning the edge. (bending the sharp part of the edge back, when it starts to fold over or bend sideways)
It actually also moves metal arround. (moves, not removes)
see this link for verry cool microscopic pictures.
burr
When you sharpen a knife. You remove meterial to get close to a perfect V shape on the tip of your knife.
However, since steel is bendable. You get a burr, thats a bit of steel thats âstuckâ to the tip of the V shape. And keeps bending left and right.(think Y shape, with the bottom of the Y bending left and right) We use the burr as an indicator that we are close to the V shape on the edge of our knife.
You can feel the burr on the oposite side of the knife from the stone when sharpening. (left side knife is moving on sharpening stone, burr will bend to the right side of the knife.)
Edge leading / edge trailing. (bit oversimplified, but practicaly correct statements here)
Edge leading, means your moving your knife with the sharpe side forward. (into the stone)
If you where to sharpen you knife on the palm of your hand âedge leadingâ you would cut yourself.
Edge leading usualy sharpens a little faster. But leaves deeper scratches and deeper chips in the edge. It can also remove the burr faster/better. But not always.
Edge trailing, means your moving your knife with the sharp side facing forward, but moving the knife backwards. If you where to sharpen the knife on the palm of your hand âedge trailingâ you would not cut yourself. your than basicaly petting your hand with the knife.
Edge trailing is also the motion you make when stropping your knife.
It sharpens a little slower usualy. Leaves less deep scratches. And thus artificaly âincreasesâ the grit of your stone.
Sharpening edge trailing. (also called stropping on your stone) wil give you more of a polish.
Edge leading + edge trailing.
You usualy start sharpening moving forward than backwards than forwards etc. With the knife on the stone.
Edge leading + edge trailing.
Usualy you put more pressure on the knife edge trailing, than edge leading.
After you have finished a burr on both sides of the knife. You than swap scharpening the left and right side a few times.
And than start sharpening edge trailing. (or âstroppingâ motion)
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I mostly use my steel to align my edges. Not technically sharpening but they cut much better.
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I didnt know about this. I think Ill try it first!
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I use this one: itâs called TSPROF and is made in Russia â like a tank. It takes diamond stones.
I went through all my knives a week ago to sharpen them. Also stropped them with leather and a stropping compound. Now they are grafting ready!
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The quality of steel in a knife makes a big difference.
No sense in buying $100 worth of sharpening equipment to sharpen a cheap $20 knife.
But you can sharpen many knives with the equipment.
And try to keep a cheap one sharp to.
I custom make my grafting knives from M2 high-speed steel.
This is not a project for a beginner.
A reasonable priced knife , and sand paper to sharpen is a good place to start.
When you have a lot more time to kill, you can study up on different types of steel different sharpening systems. A good winter project
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That looks nice
Seems to be priced like a tank toooâŚ
I donât know what you guys mean by sharp, but I donât have any trouble getting knives and any other tools sharpened because it really isnât all that complicated. The less steep the angle the sharper the blade. The less coarse the sharpening material the sharper the blade, but the harder it is to sharpen because it takes longer.
I keep my knives sharp enough for me with a coarse diamond chef type sharpening rod (preferably oval), but then I donât need to be able to throw a piece of paper up in the air and cleanly slice it in half.
I usually buy when stuff goes on sale. Never had sharper knives. It is worth every bit I paid for it.
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Two things I guess Murky, I didnât know after two years there was a speed control dial. So that changed everything. I run it on full speed. I donât use the âattachmentsâ you might call them, but instead I just push the blade against the belt(s) underneath all that attachment stuff / scissor sharpeners / all that stuff.
Iâm going to take all that crap off soon.
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I use a wicked edge and you can indeed get a razor sharp mirror polish with it. I donât see how I could ever replicate it freehand. Others may have the muscle memory to stroke the knife at an identical angle, pass after pass, but not me. Thatâs the advantage of theses types of systems. Precise angle stroke after stroke - sometimes for over a thousand passes.
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Murky - I sharpened my grafting knife to 14 degrees (would be 28 degrees if it was double beveled)
Iâve seen some of your other posts on your M2 steel knives. How do you grind the blanks to profile them?
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Guess burr was a poor choice of words. Here is a better wording.
stropping re-aligns parts of the blade edge that have been bent out of alignment
Precise angle is unnecessary in fact I sharpen all of my knives with a convex bevel.
You can shave your face with my opinel knives.