What is doing this to my raspberries?

I have a patch of black and purple raspberries: five Bristol, two (remaining) Jewel, three Glencoe, 2 Cumberland, 1 Royalty, and 1 Brandywine.

Something seems to be killing off my Jewel plants in particular within about 2 yrs of planting. I get one good crop year, then they peter out. Bristol seems unaffected so far as do Glencoe and Brandywine purples. Cumberland and Royalty seem moderately affected but none have per se died yet.

I’ll post a pic below, but basically, the fruiting floricanes do OK, but the primocanes start off fine and vigorous, then suddenly the new growth gets “weak” and the cane eventually dies entirely by early August. That’s how it happened last year on a Jewel plant, and in 2021 on an original Jewel plant I bought in 2019. The plant I thought died last summer did attempt to push some weak primocanes this spring, but they petered out.

This year, a different Jewel plant, which grew fine last summer and fine this year until a couple weeks ago, is showing this same phenomenon on 2 of the 5 primocanes it is pushing. I don’t know for sure that it’s dying like the other one did, but it has that same look the other plant did before slowly dying off last year.

My Royalty purple seems to be very stunted this year as well, and my Cumberland blacks (2 plants total) are kinda in-between - not quite as bad as the affected Jewel plants, but not really as vigorous as last season. My other Jewel plant (which is a year younger and came from a different nursery source) looks fine and is still growing like gangbusters. So far my Brandywine plant is also unaffected. I will note the Jewel plant exhibiting this phenomenon is a tip-root off the original plant that died, as is the one that died last season. The unaffected one is one I purchased separately.

What is odd is that Jewel is constantly touted as more disease resistant than Bristol, but for me Bristol is the winner, and so far, does not seem affected by this phenomenon.

What is this? Is it viral? Anthracnose? Verticillium wilt? Cane borer? Is there anything I can do?


This is the “weird” one. See how the new growth is weak and the leaves a bit distorted? I pinched back the primocanes and this new growth hasn’t looked right.

This is “normal” growth.

hows your soil drainage? sounds like root rot to me. some cultivars are more resistant than others. planting in mounds with well draining soil will help alot. seems to be worse in warm weather.

Sandy-loam soil, and we are in moderate drought this year here…plus the area is sloped and drains down to my neighbor’s yard, so I don’t think that’s it.

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I’m actually leaning toward this being viral, but I’m not sure. Like, perhaps I should preemptively start a new raspberry bed as far away from these as possible so I can establish it before these plants all die off.

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phytophthora root rot I had was in clay soil after a huge rain event. The die off came fast and dramatic. From your pictures, it doesn’t look the same as what I had.

Regarding Viral, Stark Bros claims black/purple varieties are more susceptible to virus.

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@BG1977 … i planted first raspberries spring 2020 here.

One of my plants that was supposed to be a fall gold… ended up being some kind of (one crop) black.

The first year floricanes from it made sime pretty good fruit… and decent qty of good fruit. I added more blacks via OTB…and they did the same… primocanes grew well… the next season those fcanes produced a decent crop many nice sized berries delicious.

But second year fcanes on my mystery black and OTB… both were quite disappointing fruit production wise. The pcanes looked good… they grew well, but the next spring they did set fruit but most of the berries were tiny… just very few quality berries on my blacks… on year 2 fcanes.

My red raspberries retain their vigor at producing both canes and quality berries.

I bet i get 10x quality berries frim my reds… than i do the blacks.

My spring crop is almost done… and i plan to take out all the MB and OTB fcanes and pcanes.

They are just not producing well enough to justify the space in my beds.

Herritage reds grow like weeds and produce lots of quality berries here.

I am removing my blacks to make more room for them.

I have a new bed this spring with a bristol black… joan j and purple royalty. I will see how they do.

Like the dude from miracle farms says. If it does not grow like a weed at your place… you probably need to replace it.

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@TNHunter thanks for your feedback.

I planted some reds and blacks mixed together next to bunch of wineberries. I’ll probably be suffering same fate as @BG1977 if it is viral.

The thing is, I don’t really like red raspberries all that much, I like the black so much better.

Yes.

If you stand back and notice at how much energy is being used to produce those new canes and also to provide a fruit load while also defending itself… you will see that the plant needs more nutrition and water.

Alot of folks are posting similar results on social medias… and alot of folks give up on them due to their demands.

Their root sytems are more shallow than blackberries which go deep. Blackberries also have thicker roots and wander deep and far to protect itself against lack of nutrients.

Hand fluff the area around the plant to ensure that whatever you are using as mulch isnt compacted… then add a dressing of fresh wood chips or compost… add a handful of a good fertilizer like 13-13-13 with sulfur or two handfuls of a lesser fertilizer like Holly Tone with sulfur and water diligently while in the early stages of fruiting. then pull back on the watering a week before peak ripeness.

Also going forward if you want a healthier plant do not remove spent canes until after winter if you live in a colder climate… they are not fully spent until after winter.

Your note about performance within 2 yrs of planting and decline after a good crop suggests that you need more nutrition and more water and better root development that will occur during the late fall. If you insist on removing ‘spent canes’ after harvest then you will need to top dress heavier with wood chips or good mulch to supplement the loss of its secondary food source.

I cannot rule out other diseases nor insects… but with better nutrition and water and a porous top dressing that holds moisture as well as drains well into the roots i think you will see an improvement on health.

Rasps will sacrifice their own tips to ensure crown survival… and will force laterals when conditions improve… such is their nature.

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Thanks, all.

It does seem that blackberries are “tougher” in this sense (cultural/diseases) than raspberries. However, the main reason I grow black raspberry instead of blackberry is that unlike blackberries, black raspberries ripen before SWD gets going.

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@krismoriah

Great info thanks!

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try the Colombia series blackberries from Oregon. one the earliest blackberries to fruit and thornless. i just over wintered Colombia giant under the snow in z4 for the 1st time. tied up the canes and they are starting to push laterals and buds.

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Cool idea. I do have to wonder how they’ll do in my humid climate, my understanding is the trailing blackberries don’t like the heat and humidity of the East, South, and Midwest.

You pinching told the crown that something is wrong. The crown sends up nutrition to heal the wound…then it stops growing for a bit and goes into survival mode. Survival mode also includes defense against predators and disease that also wants to enter that wound. That takes nutrients and hydration.

As a defense it then produces laterals in case that happens again… many new soldiers to fight for survival…which will increase demand on nutrition and hydration.

In nature you will find nice black rasps deep among weeds which the black rasps will feed on their root systems and use their root systems as mulch and they usually thrive due to those weeds dying and in another thread there is talk of ‘weed tea’ those dying weeds provide nutrients all thru the fall and winter and into early spring as they decompose…then form a mat for increased nutrients and hydration.

Removing canes before fully spent also means removing the leaves that fall naturally… those are also nutrition that is lost when removing too soon…those also provide a mat and compost nicely for health of the crown in later years.

So ‘what is doing this’ mostly is our own cultivation… They are heavy feeders and drinkers… so treat them like an in-law that is living with you for a season… i think you will see better results.

I pinched the other ones too (including the Bristols and the other Jewel) and the growth looks much healthier. The second pic I posted above was also pinched (it’s a Bristol).

not all… some are late but yes generally.

Obsidian is one of the newer releases of blackberries that we are interested in due to very early production.

Columbia Star is technically thornless Marionberry. And will be removed soon from the market i think due to diseases. There is a ‘blackberry collapse’ happening.

Zodiac is coming… perhaps we need to discuss this in a new blackberry thread.

https://www.ars.usda.gov/research/publications/publication/?seqNo115=395508

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some do. onegreenworld.com has alot of info on growing them. id get the starts from esty/ ebay though they are 1/4 the price there.

just got a Colombia star. what diseases are a issue with them?

glad i put a Colombia giant with my loganberry then. both are on the east side of my house where hopefully they will be protected from the n.w winds here.