Hi everyone,
I am thinking about which shade tree to plant that grows relatively quickly and can serve as a shade tree for a house.
Red Maple is an option, but it doesn’t give me anything other than shade and leaves (leaves are great, though!).
I am playing with the idea of a good grafted american persimmon. The tree would be planted about 25ft away from the house. Could it be a decent shade tree that yields a crop? What would the cons be?
Pedro
Too slow growing! Mulberry trees would be better and much faster growing.
That’s fair! Which mulberry would you do?
Silk hope, Lawson dawson, Oscar, and Lakeland tropical are all full sized everbearing mulberries that are well liked
We are blessed with thickets of American Persimmons along the property. They sure break a lot. Size wise I’d call them an understory tree.
We have always been White Oak fans; especially Live Oaks and Swamp Oaks. But our favorites since moving here are the Southern Sugar and Red Maples. And our few Sycamores{Barred Owl Tree!..lol}
How tall of a shade tree are you looking for? American persimmons are “self-pruning” - i.e., they drop a lot of smaller branches. Also, the fruit falling to the ground can be messy - especially if you let the tree get full size. The soft fruit will often split when it hits the ground from high up. I have large wild persimmon trees on my land, but I prune my grafted varieties to keep the fruit within reach from the ground or harvestable with a step-ladder. American persimmons also put up root suckers quite far from the tree, which are easy to mow but might be annoying if you have garden beds or beds near your house that you don’t want to weed.
Mulberries are much faster growing, but they can also be messy trees when the fruit falls on the ground. My mulberries attract a lot of birds and the ground under them has a lot of bird droppings when the fruit is ripe. Mulberries with purple fruit will stain driveways and walkways. Mine also tend to have broken branches whenever there’s a storm. But if you want an attractive fast growing tree with edible fruit and are willing to put up with these drawbacks, they are hard to beat.
Some of the astringent kaki persimmon varieties are large enough to be smaller shade trees (20’ to 30’ feet? - I’m not sure how tall they get if you didn’t prune them for height). Some also have attractive red fall foliage like Tecumseh and Great Wall. I grow Tecumseh, and it’s a gorgeous and productive tree. But mine is grafted to an American persimmon rootstock and produces suckers. I think you would probably want to prune a young kaki tree to get a good structure as a shade tree - many kaki persimmons I see in my area have heavy branches drooping down because they are loaded with fruit and propped up with stakes to keep them from breaking or laying on the ground. This can be avoided with some late winter pruning.
I’m also very fond of my Japanese Raisin Tree (Hovenia dulcis) as an attractive shade tree. The “fruit” is more of a novelty, but the small flowers attract a lot of pollinators. It also “self prunes” and drops small branches, but it hasn’t suckered at all for me.
I’ve also heard that mulberries can be troublesome around water pipes, etc. I had planted some dwarf varieties, but when I asked the company, they still suggested that I move them because of their then-proximity to the septic, sidewalk and driveway. There are some mid-sized nut trees that could also work perhaps. I just googled, “How tall does a pistachio tree get?” and the answer was thirty feet. I can’t grow one here, but if I could… I am growing heartnuts and hazelnuts. I refuse to grow anything that gets too big because of increased severity of storms, so 30’-40’ is pretty much my cutoff point! Weather events are certainly something to consider.
Self-pruning! A very apt description!
I just planted 3 the common north American mulberry to feed wildlife to protect my cherries and blue berries
It’s not original to me - I think Lee Reich describes them that way.
I do the same - mulberries are so pruductive that there’s plenty for me and the birds and it diverts the birds’ attention from the blueberries.
I thought Helene took out our Persimmon thicket for sure dropping 3 pines on them. But they are bouncing back and just went dormant.
That’s what I see here in NC too - if left to their own devices, they form thickets of trees that are probably all clones connected by the roots.
‘Tamopan’ and ‘Zengi maru’ would both be good kaki choices in your area. You can pick and eat ‘Zengi’ for months; always sweet-from crisp to softer and richer flavor as season progresses.
LOL most people completely avoid mulberries anywhere near the house or driveway. The ripe fruit stains. Do you want to be tracking purple ink into the house? Washing it off the cars?
I have to think persimmons would be messy too. A large American persimmon would probably produce 1000 fruits, which will drop when ripe. If you think I’m exaggerating, note that I get ~1000 from my 20’ Kasandra. Imagine your driveway and lawn covered in rotting persimmons. Sounds slippery and messy, especially when the fruit is mixed with feces from the deer and raccoons that come to eat every night.
@jrd51 is right. Here in the south, it would also be writhing with fly maggots and drawing in yellow jackets and other wasps, unless the birds, raccoons, and squirrels get all the fruit first.
I can see the attraction of a dual-purpose shade and fruit tree, but practically speaking a tree that is big enough to shade your house will make it difficult to harvest fruit, and a tree pruned for optimal fruit production won’t throw much shade. Maybe nut trees are the ideal compromise as @Barb suggested. I would think chinese chestnuts or pecans might work well if you have enough room since you’d need at least two to pollinate.
Nut trees are extremely messy too. And you might get injured by falling nuts.
A kaki persimmon such as Saijo might work as it is vigorous and will easily reach 20 feet in about 6-7 years. It does not drop fruit. However you are left with the problem of harvesting fruit.
Another option is a vigorous hybrid such as Rosseyanka. Will also get large enough to be a shade tree. Same issue as Saijo.
I can see the headlines now: “Man hurt by falling pistachio nut!”
Arggghh. I love Pecans; but…yuck Pecan dust/mold on everything…awful.
Oaks tower above all other native tree species in caterpillar production so vital to our dwindling bird populations. One chickadee nest needs several thousand caterpillars to fledge one brood. Oaks are a shining star in this role.