Niwot is good here in KY. Not quite as flavorful as Jewel or some of the others, but not bland or objectionable. In my experience it FAR outproduces typical floricane black raspberries 3 to 1. It’s also nice to be able to go out and pick them August until November. Super productive and hybrid vigor on the canes as well. I like them.
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Starting about 605 to about 615. There is obviously a LOT of great info outside of those posts so I’d recommend reading this whole thread (I did it over some days, with coffee).
However the great discussion and comments by/between @krismoriah @Drew51 @zendog and @PcChip around pruning was illuminating to me and IMO an excellent primer for anyone who wants a refresher on how to think about this.
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It gets pretty poor reviews on social medias and most folks dont like growing things with thorns…which is a shame. Good to see a positive review.
Here are a couple of videos that not many folks have watched… honestly there isnt a whole lot of talk about Niwot out there.
As it should. The primocane crop is almost foul to eat. On a scale of 1 to 10 they get a 2. I would not even keep them for processing. It should have been crossed again. It took me one cross to get superb primocane berries I would give it a 9 on Sterling black. The floricane berries are excellent too. Although nothing wrong with Niwot floricane berries. They are excellent.
I happen to know Pete Tallman who bred Niwot. He agrees with me. I crossed mine with Jewel Pete crossed his with Bristol. He sent me seeds.
He said they are much better than Niwot.
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Im not sure every one knows but if you are on this thread and click on the search glass up top you can search ‘in this topic’ or check the box for ‘seach this topic’ on a phone. So for instance if you want to know about Triple Crown or Heritage for instance you can just read about those things if you dont want to scroll endlessly. Maybe it will help someone.
i never mean to write such lengthy discussions but i try to simplify what i learn as i go… as this is a resource to me also.
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I thought that too but i learned myself to give things a few seasons to judge fully due to the chances of too much water or in some berries cases a poor crop until a 3rd year. I had my first taste of Ohio Treasure pcane crop last year and i thought they were pretty tasty but i had to fight the yellowjackets and paper wasps…
Not sure if others have figured it out yet but Sweet Repeat black rasp is Niwot.
So to find great reviews of Niwot you have to listen to people who probably have nothing else to compare it to…which in that case they would be ‘nice and juicy’ and ‘sweet’ which maybe it is in their location.
Last year Niwot got pretty good reviews on here from some folks that grow them… but not much followup. One guy said Niwot was his 2nd favorite fruit.
I would rather have a floricane crop myself. and enjoy my fall bearing yellow rasps instead of pcane blacks.
I added Black Delicous last fall… probably a dud but im going to try it.
Black Delicioius was discovered by Natasha and Jared Sinkowski in Columbus, Ohio. The fruits are medium in size, approximately 1/ 2 inch in diameter, an acceptable size for markets. Deep black have good firmness with small seeds with a creamy textured flesh. Flavors are intense and aromatic.
The fruits are easy to harvest because they are borne on the terminal ends of the stems. Stems are erect and self – supporting during the 2 week fruiting season which occurs in early July in Ohio.
Mac Black is my latest fruiting and one of my favorites… not much history i can find on it… i think i read somewhere where it was bred in Canada at some point and supposedly one of the most cold hardy… but nothing that i can quote.
Not many cultivars are actually bred… most are wild finds.
Allen is coming back into the market… it was super hard to find years ago. It is one of the few that were bred.
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I agree with that. Even longer for tree fruit. I gave Niwot 4 years. I think I got it in 2014 or 2015 and it died in 2019. I have had Niwot since its first release. Luckily I had made two crosses by 2019.
I didn’t find it to be anything special. Oh Black Mac thats Mac for Mackinaw. It’s a Michigan cultivar and very late ripening. Bristol is excellent, looking forward to growing out Pete’s seed.
I like the primocane black raspberries because they can be large and produce til the season ends…
Lynn’s black had three six foot canes six years ago.and produced its first crop. Still a beast today. Even tip rooting is impressive it produced 3 crowns with one tip root. I have no idea how? It stung though to give up primocane berries to tip root
Primocane berries (2019) one of three main branches.
Here is one of three laterals on main branch. The other two main branches had 2-3 laterals also.
Even the floricane crop can be big this photo was taken June 21 2021. Must be the floricane crop
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Any ideas on what happened here?
I took the photo on a hike in the cloud forests of Panama a while back. The plant almost looks soft and cuddly with all that fuzz.
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Very cool photo. It’s not Rubus occidentalis (black raspberry) it’s another Rubus plant. Hundreds of species in the americas. So I have no clue which one?
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This is a prime ark freedom plant I thought would give a good representation of what happens to the cane that had a primocane crop and now producing a floricane crop. The distal end flowered and had fruit in the fall and now the plant is flowering more proximal.
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That helped verify it… i think another site i read said it was from Canada or something. Here is more info on Mac Black and the others.
I liked your discussion about it and Niwot… i think that was before this forum.
i tried several techniques and wasnt happy with most of them. Im rooting some now and will post results next month or so. If this works i probably wont tip root anymore.
Since you like Bristol im rooting Clyde now which has Bristol as a parent
https://www.pubhort.org/aps/18/v18_n3_a9.htm
It would be nice at some point to have a reliable timing and method of rooting cuttings for Rubus folks… the fig and mulberry guys have a nice network going… i think it would be great if Rubus could also have that same potential.
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At first I did like it. But that was because I was unfamiliar with cultivated varieties. I spend decades foraging wilds and I was excited to see large fruit and larger quantities in one plant. It was quite vigorous at first. But after a couple years it refused to produce edible fruit. The fruit dried out before ripe. Probably my fault. It needed more water. It’s worth looking into for yourself. It does appear to be sensitive to viral infection.
I think I pulled it out or it died.
I too would like to find best practice for rooting. Good luck with it!!
Most domesticated blacks seem to die out in my yard. Not really an issue with reds, some though too don’t thrive here compared to others. The wild Ontario black was the only plant that produced and thrived year after year. I have since collected seed of six other wild blacks that seem to have potential in breeding.
I’m giving up on the domesticated cultivars. They all seem sensitive to viral infection. We need cultivars that are not killed by viral infections. That one can grow them for decades and decades. That is one of my goals in breeding.
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Seedling blackberries from MN zone 3b seeds. I plan to breed these to Chester. I consider it zone 3 as it has hit -40. Small fruit but does have a long fruiting period like the local 3b wild red raspberries. Growing these in 5b for breeding.
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Sometimes seed if not scarified takes forever to germinate so don’t give up on them if they fail to germinate this year. They could very well germinate next year. So don’t throw them out!!
It looks like you have them growing but if you do more and others could appear in this pot. Keep in mind you may have to wait.
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Josephine is an awesome raspberry.
I’m not sure why it left the market? Maybe late ripening? Anyway I sure enjoy it. It has huge very tasty berries
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Yes I added it in 2017. Still doing very well too. I count on it. But different locations may have different results.
Himbo Top has been in my garden since 2013 and has spread and thriving. So has Prelude. Prelude though can be tart. I use it for syrups which are amazing with prelude. Himbo is used for fresh eating. Still has the highest amount of production followed by Prelude. A friend has a patch which is 30 years old and thriving. I have been asking him for plants a few years now. I’ll get him to give me one eventually.
He has no clue what they are? They are great for fresh eating I have tried them numerous times.
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If your friends canes arent very thorny and spread like crazy… could be Latham. They are pretty bulletproof and have the classic red rasp flavor.
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I have a red raspberry that my great grandmother grew when grand coulee dam was being built. It is low production, and not particularly sour. Do you know what cultivars were commonly available then?
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