Grafted persimmon update


So I finally got out in the patch of trees again last night to catalog my grafted trees while I could still read the writing on the rootstock.
I had issues this year with refrigeration, and had some scionwood get way too warm and start sprouting and healing in the bags.
I also had trouble even getting out there because of all the other demands on my time.
What I can share is that my success rate with grafting on d. lotus is poor compared to d. Virginiana, and the survival rate is poor for d. Lotus too.
Planted 100 of each last year, tried to graft a few. I have 3 survivors on lotus (2 are K.B.S.) and 3 Prok on Virginiana from last year.
Current data this year show that early grafts on lotus probably failed because of a freeze about a week after grafting. Many of the lotus had black leaves, and I chose the stronger plants when grafting later.
After seeing the frost damage I put most of what I had and wanted on d. Virginiana!

MY RESULTS. on D. Lotus
100 d lotus planted in 2017.
3 surviving grafted last year.
6 young trees winter killed. (Hachiya and Gyombo)

19 total living grafted trees (counting 3 from 2017)
44 living root stock
Many (maybe 10) failed grafts this year but 37 empty spaces is a lot of dead trees!

RESULTS ON d. Virginiana

3 grafted survivors from 2017

This year as of 6/20/2018
64 living grafted trees (3 from 2017)
34 living rootstock
Maybe 3 empty spaces from dead trees.
(There were a couple small extra trees planted between drip emitters)

Thanks to everyone who sent me persimmon scion!
One name was unfamiliar to me looks like
Chiahaeha or something like that. Whatever it is I have three of 'em. :slight_smile:

I should be able to save scion myself from what is growing and graft or bud more trees.

This picture above shows the first four rows of d lotus…or rather a lot of empty spaces and weeds.

Picture below shows the four rows of d Virginiana. There is a tall ungrafted tree in the leftmost row of the four…almost 6 feet tall! Gotta graft it next year.


Minus lotus, not too shabby, Lady.

Did you get at least one of each of all the varieties you had?

Good job! Great success on virginiana.



The d lotus has been a disappointment.
But one I am happy to share.
I think we might be too cold, it also may not like the soil here. It is kinda heavy, and a bit on the alkaline side. I saw a few grafts die when the drip was run a bit too often…lotus might not handle that much water?
Live and learn and persevere!
gotta count the trees not the empty spots. Lol


You betcha. That’s the attitude!

You have a lot of persimmon trees! :grin:


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I think that could be the Chiabacha I sent.


Mystery solved! Thank you!
I also have several others grafted that you sent.
Including John Rick.
Thank you very much!

My spring was chaotic, and my summer so far the same.
My top project this year was 5 months yesterday. And here she is!

I’m just doing one day at a time…make that one moment at a time. :smile:

My grafted tomatoes are doing well. Melon patch all planted. And we are growing corn where we grew 11 foot weeds last year.
Work is crazy busy…with my guys doing many days two days worth of work (with help from three other great workers!)
Good thing I guess. Cool projects in the works including that trellised orchard…and prepping the place for the romance series cherries.

24 lambs this year…milk n butter too.

I like my crazy busy life!


What a little cutie! Great job on the orchard too!
John S

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Trenching today for the sprinkler system that will let us plant out persimmon trees! Yippy!
It will also water the pears, cherry trees, and some of the apricot and English walnut trees. :slight_smile:


Looking good Jolene!


After over a week of plugging away at this leveling the ground, laying it out, trenching, laying PVC pipe, measuring cutting and threading 3/4" steel risers, repairing the fittings today that got over tightened and cracked, we got the fun of backfilling ditches today in high winds. Then after using the tractor and bobcat, rakes and shovels to move dirt, hubby got on the tractor and used a drag to level things up…with a little extra weight of course.

In this photo you can see the dust blowing across the ground.

While two of the boys were riding around another helped me dig two holes and transplant a cherry rootstock, and then hubby helped me with another. They are leafing out but I plan on grafting them tomorrow, and I expect them to do just fine.

Before we came in for the night we ran some sprinkers to settle some dust. It’s been almost 20 years since there was a working system in that field. It is so satisfying to see this.

I was smiling so big I thought my face might crack! :-):grin:
With up to 40 mph winds in the forecast, and the wind whistling past the house even now at 8:22 pm we may not run them tomorrow. But we will soon.
There are 34 sprinklers on this system most of them about 39 feet apart. 3 inch pipe down the center line, 1 inch running 2 sprinklers on each side with 3/4 inch steel risers with a stake for extra support and a stainless steel hose clamp on each. Eventually we will pour concrete “donuts” to protect the heads. That way there arent worries if you run over them with the tractor or lawn mower, and its easier to find the valves in the grass.
Now…for a shower. I think we’re gonna sleep good tonight! :-):smile:


So for anyone interested its been 9 days since we ran those sprinklers overnight. It did a good job of wetting the soil and made using the auger and shovels easier.

We went and layed out the planting, and hubby opted for four rows instead of three. The American are planted on a 20 x 20 spacing, and the kaki are 15 x 20.
I planted the two Dr Kazas hybrids with the American trees. There are 22 trees in the American persimmon block. And 28 in the kaki block with an even 50/50 split planned for fuyu type non astringent and astringent.
The real fun started when we went to dig these out of the nursery. We found out that D. Virginiana likes to grow deep roots, and ya have to dig halfway to China to get under them. By the time we finished we were happy with trimming them a bit way down there.
Here is a 100-46 tree with a big root system.

This monsterous beast didn’t get grafted last year and was maybe 9 feet tall and well branched …in the nursery! I decided to use him as rootstock for a Tam Kam tree, so here he is in the nursery.

Here he is whiped back and dug out.

And here is the big bad boy getting planted.

Finally at the end of today we finished planting.
Yellow tags are some of the grafted trees, orange are rootstock I’ll graft in a couple weeks. With these big “rootstocks” that love our soil here I don’t expect any to die or fail…but we will have to see.

Now that we are much smarter, should we ever undertake another planting of persimmon trees, we will plant the cute little rootstock we bought from Lawyers where we want the trees, and field graft them the next year.
Live and learn. Lol
Next step graft, then get grass growing out there!
Always something to look forward to.


Your Orchard looked great. Hopefully they will produce in a few years and I would love to see those persimmon trees loaded with fruits. Strong hard work :watermelon::tangerine::green_apple::pear::cherries:


The big persimmon planting was an ambitous idea, and when we dug the first few trees most of us had sort of an “oh $#/+” kind of moment. Our boys hand dug about 50 apple trees this year and had the persimmon been like apple it wouldn’t have been bad.
It was our second son pictured with the monster tree (he is six feet tall) that helped give us all the shot in the arm needed to get it done yesterday.

I cant wait to see the trees leafed out and growing! I can already see them loaded with fruit…in my minds eye. The actuality of that is going to be awesome too.

If folks like you hadn’t been talking about how great persimmons were I’d have never ventured to grow them. So thanks to @scottfsmith for the forum and all the other great and helpful fruit enthusiasts here that shared their knowledge and experiences.

Next year I will be planting the Chocolate that Scott said was the best and some pvna cultivars on another property…so the fruit saga here continues. :slight_smile:


I planted three American persimmons four years ago. I think I’m to cold for them. One died back to the ground two winters ago, but grew a new leader to the same height. It looks like another has died back this year. They are only four foot tall. I would like to taste them, but it doesn’t look like it’s going to happen. I am impressed with all the trees you are planting. I’m looking forward to harvest pictures. Thanks for sharing

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Yesterday and today I finally got out there and grafted the persimmon rootstocks we moved.
Most were out nicely, bark slipping. One was pushing but not as far along…I grafted it anyways.
I had to change my plan a little. I grafted a Tam Kam tree a while ago, then did something thoughtless and left the scion loose in my toolbag to dry out. Re wrote the plan as even rehydrated I dont think the scion was viable. I grafted more Makaewa Jiro, and Jiro instead.
As of today all persimmon out there are grafted with one exception that looks dead. I will graft a replacement in the nursery in case nothing grows on that one. Grafted a back up Gwang Yang as the one we planted looks chancy.

Now I have a bunch of D.Lotus to graft in the nursery, and some Virginiana too.
I’m leaning toward doing a lot of Saijo and whatever non astringent I have extra scion of. Might try some Nikita’s Gift on Lotus???
Also Nishimura Wase, and Chocolate.
I have Russian Kaki and that did fine on Lotus.

Just thinking in type at the end of a long day.


Here is the final planting/grafting list.
One Rootstock to be Saijo is not showing signs of life, will graft a replacement.
Gwang Yang looks like it may be dying back or just dying. Grafted a replacement. The rest looked pretty good.

American persimmon 22 trees.
Morris Burton,
Deer Magnet,
John Rick
Ruby (2)
100-42 (2 )
Dr Kazas (2)
H-118 /Early Jewel (2)
Lehman’s Delight (4)
H63-A (4)

Astringent Kaki 14 trees
Miss Kim
Great Wall
Russian Kaki (2)
Pen (2)
Kiung san Ban Si (K B.S.) (4)
Saijo (4) one rootstock not showing life 3 trees look good

Non Astringent Kaki 14 trees
Tam Kam
Gwang Yang
Wase (2)
Matsumoto Wase Fuyu (2)
Jiro (3)
Makaewa Jiro (4)

Now the wait till the tasting!
Out in the nursery trees that were waking up when we planted have already grown …some of them over eight inches!


I thought my wife was pretty tough-you are impressive Jolene. What state are you in? I’m trying to imagine.
John S

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I’m not really that tough… I didn’t do that alone. I have a capable country guy hubby and we have a bunch of kids that help out.

We are actually in a bit over our heads as work away from home limits the time and energy we can put into the home place.

We are in central Arizona.


She’s a beauty!:heart: