Well I ended up choosing Spartan, Williams Pride, Dayton, and I also got some scions of Ashmead’s Kernel, Egremont Russet, Rubinette, and Swayzie.
I hope I made some good choices. Choosing fruit varieties is exhausting.
9 Likes
So true. It is very time consuming and exhausting to choose wisely about what varieties will work out better in your location.
1 Like
It can take many tries to find varieties that work in your soil and climate, so just look on this as a starting point.
2 Likes
Lmao, I’m either gonna move away or be an old man before I know what works well.
I always tend to overthink everything and get super wrapped up in the logistics of everything and I forget to enjoy my “hobbies.”
Hopefully I’ve got luck on my side and I am just a couple years away from some tasty fruit.
1 Like
Here is my oldest apple tree. A Pink Lady with no other grafts. I am going for a modified central leader. Am I on the right track? I have the top of the leader bent over and I tipped it to try and get a nice upper scaffold going.
Should I take the whole upper leader out and shorten the tree by two or three feet? Or does it look correct the way it is?
It’s a bit hard to see how I have the top of the leader bent over. It’s got a wire tied to it pulling it down to about a 45 degree angle.
I hesitated to prune out the blind section of the leader because it has many fruit buds on it. I figured that would be a good fruiting area, and I have yet to fruit this tree so I felt I should keep them there. I also thought I could probably just take it out next season, although that sticks in my mind too because the trunk is only going to get larger, thus creating a larger wound.
What do you guys think?
1 Like
If you want a disease resistant mac-type apple, look no further than NovaMac! See my comment below for some more details, it’s my favourite apple:
1 Like
I would top the leader at a height above which you do not care to prune, thin crop, inspect for disease.
If willing to do ladder work and you want two sets of scaffolds, make sure the top scaffold is 5 or even 6 feet above bottom scaffold (per expert Alan H.) to avoid shading. It’s easy for top scaffolds to eventually dominate the bottom scaffold in vigor. It’s easy (ask me) to create top scaffolds way too low. While you still have a nice leader you can create top scaffold as high as it needs to be to avoid shading- this is usually higher than anyone thinks at the beginning.
2 Likes
Hambone, are you suggesting the form is not good on this tree? I headed the leader at about eight feet. I had to reach up and pull it down to cut it. It’s certainly higher than I really want to do any work.
Would you just remove the top section entirely to bring the tree height down?
I really don’t want the tree much taller than it is and I agree that the leader can dominate quickly, that’s precisely what has happened. The lower branches did not grow as much as I would have liked last year and instead grew quite tall near the top section. There was even more leader before I headed it back to an upright lateral branch as pictured.
Edit: I think I do understand what you’re saying. You’re suggesting that IF the tree is taller than I like then I should top it at the highest point I care to do any work, rather than trying to preserve the height just for the sake of fruit. I really don’t want to do any kind of ladder work. I want small trees.
So I should just cut the leader out, back to one of the scaffold higher up and create a candelabra sort of top? Like a modified center…right?
So I could cut at the red line and remove the highlighted section and then use the remaining upper scaffold section as my new leaders, creating the modified center… Is this correct?
I have a hard time visualizing the future when it comes to tree growth.
I think it depends a lot on the rootstock. If semi-dwarf (e.g., MM.111), then I agree with Hambone – it time to start pushing scaffolds. If dwarf, you could let the central leader get to 8-10’ then head it or maybe better yet bend the leader horizontal.
It is on m111.
What do you mean ‘pushing scaffolds?’
Do you just mean pruning out the leader to force more growth from the scaffold? Or do you mean pushing scaffolds up top from the heading cut up there?
Did you perhaps look at my photo I marked up?
I do currently have the last section of the leader wired down, not quite horizontal, but at an angle to try and get it to branch and behave better. I don’t want the tree any taller really.
Yeah, I saw the picture but couldn’t comment without knowing the rootstock.
Given a semi-dwarf tree, I would head it where you drew the red line (or maybe one branch lower because it seems that you have two scaffolds closely spaced both pointing left, which means that the top one will eventually shade the bottom one). It seems there might be 1-2 other places where you could eliminate similar redundancy.
<< Do you just mean pruning out the leader to force more growth from the scaffold? Or do you mean pushing scaffolds up top from the heading cut up there? >>
The former. Right now, the growth of the central leader diverts energy from the scaffolds. You have a nice basic structure, once the upper section of the central leader is gone. Then if you could select 4 scaffold branches in a lower tier and 4 scaffold branches in an upper tier, with the 4 in each group growing roughly NSEW, you’ll be set up with an ideal framework. Then you just have to get those scaffolds to grow out and up.
1 Like
The tree has been in the ground here since Fall 2022.
Im starting to think I didn’t do a very good job n shaping at. I feel like it has too many lower scaffolds and if I take the leader out it’s just going to be a globose tree that’s nice to look at and doesn’t bear much fruit. If I leave the leader I feel like it’s gonna just keep growing straight up.
Should I remove some of the lower scaffolds too?
I see what you’re saying about the redundant uppers. I agree the lower one could be pruned out. The bottom tier has four scaffolds pointing NSEW already. So you think pruning out the top section of the leader and then training the top to be another small scaffold would be ideal.
Here’s a photo I found online. I think this seems like the rudimentary form that this tree would take on if I did what I just outlined. Would you agree?
Also I’m curious why you would choose a different strategy if the tree were on dwarf roots.
Is it just because the tree would have less vigor the pump out that tall center wood?
I think you’ve done a good job of training. I’d probably cut at your red line, yes. To preserve your bottom scaffolds (a key goal here) you will have to constantly monitor, prune back, the top scaffolds or they will take over and bottom scaffold suffers. Alan considers the top scaffold as temporary, needing renewal every few years to keep it in check. I agree. That concept will help guide you.
On about half my semi-dwarf apples I have given up on baby-sitting the top scaffold and sawed off the leader at the top of the bottom scaffold, creating an open or vase structure with just the four lowest limbs. Makes life a lot easier, might reduce crop some.
2 Likes
I am experimenting with open center VS center leader with multiple trees. I have a semi dwarf golden delicious trained as a vase and so far it is doing well. It’s not as beautiful as a nice central leader tree but neither have fruited so I can’t speak to that regard.
I also planted a Spartan apple last night that was about 6 feet tall with a few branches. I took that sucker down to knee height with four little stubbed branches. That one will be trained as a tiny vase shaped tree I think. Hope it works.
1 Like
Yes and yes.
Dwarf trees can do well grown as a tall central leader that then is headed or bent. This permits ton of short scaffolds, which then allows dense spacing (eg 8’). The tree doesn’t want to be any taller, so the form matches its nature. Also dwarf trees usually need to be staked because their roots are shallow. Lots of weight far from the central leader can cause a dwarf tree to topple over.
Can anybody point me to a good pruning/training resource? I have watched so many videos on YouTube and read a few articles online, but nothing I can find actually document year by year progress of tree training.
I ordered six more trees of various kinds and really want to be as diligent as I can in training them correctly rather than just guessing anymore.
1 Like
1 Like
From Boyer Nurseries, pruning tips:
1 Like