How to increase jujube fruit size + why I'm not getting rid of root stock bud

[joleneP]

Hi everyone,

My toddler and I have developed an addiction to these big dry jujubes that we buy. So I’ve been learning more about jujubes and thought I share some key points + get perspective on what others have experienced. (thinking of doing a yt vlog on it to share my experience too)

heat tolerance/Hardiness: I got a honey jar and Li shipped from CA in July to VA (yes, that was crazy but I was desperate). They were shipped in pots, I was a wreck as I monitored shipment progress () 5-6 days in a FedEx box (leaves arrived more yellow, I’m babying them and misting leaves to avoid leaf drop) *I read and saw some youtube videos that they love the heat, so I was betting on that. Shipping was covered in price, $80 (excld tax) for Li, but I think price went up since. ***luckily, weather was high 80 to low 90’s around the time they got here, any earlier and it was high 90s, 98F,

-per google- jujube grow zones- “USDA hardiness zones 6–9, which means they can withstand minimum winter temperatures ranging from -10–20°F (-23–-6°C)."

how to get bigger fruit: the below link was a great source that I found. Mr. Bill Adams list out jujube varieties and his observations on fruit development. A key note that peaked my interest was that “cross pollination created noticeable bigger fruit” especially in honey car and sugar cane. I watched a few yt videos on this, and found some growers with multiple varieties have observed bigger fruit as well. Although, I did wonder if mature trees made a difference, but one of growers I saw mentioned that only a portion of the fruits on her sugarcane was bigger- this phenomenon would be explained by cross-pollination.

More Than You Ever Wanted to Know About Jujubes

do you need two jujube trees for fruit?
I can’t rem his channel. But a master gardener from CA pointed out that from the literature he read, (I cannot recall exactly) he said jujubes do not self-pollinate, however, he pointed out that we “all” have two jujubes, wa-la! the rootstock to the rescue!!! he lets his rootstock grow and eats the less desired fruit, this could be a solution for those with one tree and no nearby jujube trees, or I guess you can also graft

My honey jar tree is skinny and still recovering from her journey, I also partially changed pots, and was concerned if I overstressed her. However, I noticed the rootstock was budding out (after a week), which was a relief… so to ensure fruit and help with tree recover, I will keep the root stock bud. If my Li also fruit, I plan on taking cuttings from the honey jar rootstock to experiment on and practice grafting. *never done it before, but I got cuttings down

I’m curious about everyone’s experience with rootstock suckers. I hear a mix things, and am wondering if the answer is that, if the graft is not good or grafted tree is unwell, the rootstock grows everywhere? this would explain what happened to my sugarcane or it could just be the rootstock is strong…

lastly, any other pointers or observations you made about your jujubes?

Re:photos- The skinny and more green is honey jar, it arrived last week. Li is the one I got yesterday and leaves are more Lime-green.

[BobVance]

@joleneP

“cross pollination created noticeable bigger fruit” especially in honey car and sugar cane

That’s true only in that without pollination they don’t produce fruit. So any that they make is bigger than 0

Check out the study from Prof Yao. She tested a number of different jujubes and most produced no fruit when blocked from pollination. Only Li and a few others can do it.

Jujube (Ziziphus jujuba Mill.) Flowering and Fruiting in the Southwestern...

Most rootstock fruit is pretty poor. Here’s one of the better ones I’ve had. While better than most rootstocks, it still had quite poor texture- pretty dense, but not crisp like Sugar Cane or Honey Jar. It was however quite productive and could get to high brix.

Here’s another rootstock which wasn’t too bad. The fruit is a bit more sour, but still palatable. And the tree is very productive (the other varieties grafted on it, not just the rootstock). I should probably try to propagate the rootstock and see if copies of it do just as well.

@joleneP

I plan on taking cuttings from the honey jar rootstock to experiment on and practice grafting. *never done it before, but I got cuttings down

Green cuttings can work, but it is quite difficult. I haven’t had any live, but Tony has had some success. Grafting is a much more reliable way to spread jujubes.

@joleneP

I hear a mix things, and am wondering if the answer is that, if the graft is not good or grafted tree is unwell, the rootstock grows everywhere? this would explain what happened to my sugarcane or it could just be the rootstock is strong…

You would want to remove most/all rootstock growth under the variety that you want to grow. Otherwise, the tree will get taken over by the rootstock, which isn’t a good thing.

On the other hand, healthy mature trees can send out suckers 5-10 feet away from the tree. I don’t think that is really a sign of a problem. You can let them grow a bit and eventually harvest them to graft to. I’ve grafted them in place, which works until the rabbits find the nice new growth.

You may want to check out my 2 large jujube year in review posts:

Jujube 2022

My jujube are just about done and I’ve been going around clearing the last fruit from them…To (mostly) quote game of thrones: I’ve declared this great summer done at last… the (best jujube) summer in living memory. Looking at my notes, I ended up picking just over 300 pounds. That doesn’t include the massive amount I ate while picking, nor a few times where I forgot to keep track and didn’t start until a few weeks into the season, around Oct 1st. In terms of per-tree production: Most produ…

Jujube 2023

below is the video of her reporting of the “fake GA866” . On closer look the fruits seem to be more roundish and not pumpkin shape but maybe just a regional cause-effect

[joleneP]

Thank you Bob! I will check out your post and the linked article.

(will look up how to respond to quotes on this forum but, lol on your cross-pollination joke.) I’m using my phone…

thanks for the pics, those are very informative. I was startled by how big your rootstock’s fruits were, I always thought undesired fruit will be small, like wild avocado.

As for the cuttings… nooo!!! I actually snipped off a few pieces of honey jar, with a dash of rooting hormone - using coco coir as the medium. I saw Tony’s post, unless he altered those with 2018 AI tech, he’s just swimming in jujube cuttings! life can’t be too unfair that only one man can do it.

since I have it up, link to Tony’s jujube cutting post below

Jujube green cuttings rooting success

Here are the green jujube cuttings dipped in power rooting hormone and covered each cutting with a clear plastic cup for a good humidity condition and after two plus months that they’re definitely alive and well. So it was a success trialed. There you go. Try it. Tony Li, Autumn Beauty, Orange Beauty, Shanxi Li, and Honey Jar trialed so far. [15349480364771453178778829602436] [15349480725717652921198620104667] [15349481142367370607348587222270]

![IMG_9458|562x1000]

My cuttings - fingers crossed!

[danzeb]

@joleneP

he said jujubes do not self-pollinate

Wrong. Some can.

[BobVance]

@danzeb

Wrong. Some can.

Yes, the ones listed in the study I published above produce without external pollen.

And actually, technically, even the ones which produce without pollination aren’t self-pollinating, but exhibiting parthenocarpy. This is because while they have pits, they generally don’t produce seeds. Interestingly, even when there is pollen from other varieties, Li generally doesn’t produce a viable seed. I say generally, since Katy has noted a few (low single digit) with seeds in some years. It’s like bananas- how often do you find a see in one? But, from what I’ve read they do have them once in a while.

@joleneP

will look up how to respond to quotes on this forum but, lol on your cross-pollination joke.) I’m using my phone…

Just hold down on the spot you want to start the quote for a sec, then drag to the end. Once you let go, a “Quote” button should appear under the selection.

@joleneP

I was startled by how big your rootstock’s fruits were, I always thought undesired fruit will be small, like wild avocado.

Some rootstocks do produce tiny pea sized fruit. Even this fruit isn’t big. Maybe Honey Jar sized, which I’d consider small (but completely fine IMO). Sugar Cane would be mid sized and Li would be classed as large.

@joleneP

life can’t be too unfair that only one man can do it.

Maybe I’ve done something wrong, but I’ve tried it several times, once with well over a dozen cuttings. That time I had a couple which lasted longer than the others, but still didn’t make it to a tree. I would view growing cuttings as a nice-to-have play experience when your tree is growing too big (say 12+ feet) and you decide to prune it back anyway. Then there is nothing to lose by trying to root them. I actually did that a week or two with 3-4 cuttings from one of my trees,

Also, those look pretty small- I thought that the green stems would need to be a bit thicker. Maybe @tonyOmahaz5 can comment.

[Gkight]

Also a bit late now but Edible Landscaping located in VA has those varieties and more so would be a much closer option if indeed you need/want more or to replace them if they happen to die.

[joleneP]

@BobVance

Just hold down on the spot you want to start the quote for a sec, then drag to the end. Once you let go, a “Quote” button should appear under the selection.

you’re awesome, thank you!

[joleneP]

Thank you for the suggestion, I actually found out about Edible Landscape on this site after I already made the purchase. But, yes, that would’ve been better

[joleneP]

@BobVance

Also, those look pretty small-

Yeah, I didn’t have much to work with but figured I give it a shot since I’ve done even smaller with rosemary.

[joleneP]

@BobVance

Maybe I’ve done something wrong, but I’ve tried it several times, once with well over a dozen cuttings.

I was just joking based on everyone’s experience and yours, it is safe to assume that jujube propagation by cuttings is not easy nor the preferred method. I actually found another article, written by Dr. Yao (one of the co-authors of the study you shared) she walked through the process of jujube grafting and even how to start jujube seeds for rootstock.

Apparently, the growing season is a good time for Jujube grafting, and fun fact, “Jujube wood is 2 to 3 times harder than apple and peach.” (link below) *maybe that is why they’re hard to root?! I have noticed less woody plants tend to root easier

Jujube (Ziziphus jujuba) Grafting | New Mexico State University - BE BOLD....