So, I have a Prok that got decapitated by a rabbit and it is refusing to grow from its tiny scion, preferring to grow on its much larger rootstock. It’s only about 18 inches tall and planted about a year ago. Fall is coming and the stick is bare because I keep pulling out the rootstock shoots because it wont grow where it’s supposed to. Im not sure if it will winterize properly, come back next year, and most importantly, grow on its scion, so I was planning to just tear it out and plant a new bareroot Prok. Peaceful Heritage sells a 4 footer for $40. At that price I figure it doesn’t make sense to try to find some scionwood, graft it, and hope it will take next year. Plus I get a warranty to boot if the plant fails to thrive.
But, this is an opportunity. Prok is generally well regarded, but some describe it as bland, though it may depend on where it is grown. I’m zone 5b. I was wondering if people had any thoughts on a favorite persimmon. I only have room to grow one. Some contenders seem to be Early Golden and Yates. Should I stick with Prok? Any thoughts?
I’ll second @PharmerDrewee on 100-46, especially if you are feeling impatient for fruit after losing a year with your Prok. Excellent taste and precocious.
I like it enough that I planted a seedling in my neighbor’s yard (at his request) and grafted it to a 100-46 and also put 100-46 on a multi-variety tree a friend of mine has (the other variety is Saijo which of course won’t work for your zone 5).
Yates also seems well-liked, although it may take longer to fruit than 100-46 and Early Golden has been a favorite for a lot of people for flavor, but it does throw some male flowers which will give you seeded fruit down the road.
My Prok, planted in 2015, has grown well and fruited prolifically. But the fruit never really lose astringency. And they tend to taste bland. Some people have great success with Prok; others have results like mine. I can’t explain the difference.
I’ve top-worked Prok with other varieties, including the Americans H63A, Dollywood, Barbra’s Blush, and Morris Burton. Three of these four Americans seem likely to give me ripe fruit this year. Check back in October.
I also grafted JT-02, which has fruit that are already showing some color. If the Americans don’t work out, I may switch the whole tree to JT-02.
I can’t speak for others. I have tasted a total of one (1) JT-02 that I managed to ripen last year on a 1-year old graft. One fruit is not a lot to go on, but the flavor struck me as an improved Asian PCNA. Definitely worth eating.
As for size, again I ripened only one – though there are dozens on my Prok tree now. All of it suggests that JT-02 resembles a small PCNA kaki. It may be “huge” for an American but it is small for an Asian.
I got you. It’s a way for northern people to get a taste of asian. Glad you informed me. Everyone elses interest got me interested, but I have asians and don’t like them as much as the Americans.
for those who can grow asians, I can imagine there might be a sense of much ado. kakis are like unicorns here, so a larger fruited hardy persimmon that approximates the traits of a kaki is too good a thing not too pursue.
we were replying simultaneously, but yup. There is also some intrigue around combining the best traits of each. As you say, kaki tends toward a milder (some would say blander) flavor. Enthusiasts of american persimmon cant help but marvel (it would seem) at the degree to which kaki has been improved over time. As good as the best varieties available are, there is still potential to be realized, and these hybrids are also in some sense a notch in the belt of that process
I don’t remember exactly when I finish picking them all. This picture from last year suggests it ripens at the end of October in my climate. They all ripen and lose astringency for me before the tree defoliates. At the stage they’re in in that link, all astringency is gone. They can be picked when orange in color and finish losing astringency fine inside on the counter. @jrd51
I agree. I have Rosseanka and Nikita’s Drop. Rosseanka is fruiting the first time this year, so I will find out first hand. Nikitas Drop has been dropping all it’s fruit for years.
People have sung the praises of Nikita’s Gift (Drop). My friend, who grows Yates (that I enjoy) loved my NG.
I tasted NG (the two years that it held on to a few fruit), it was OK, nothing special. (I still prefer intense flavor of Yates). Maybe, I am biased against NG for dropping most fruit, most years or I have unrefined taste buds.
NG did not wake up this spring. I thought it was dead. There were several suckers at the base. Then, 3 ft up the trunk, way above the graft union, two new shoots come up. It should be NG. I am debating if I should cut the whole thing down.
My JT-02 had several fruit last year. Even soft ripe, I still tasted a bit of astringency. Will see if it will taste better this year.
If you read the hybrid persimmon thread, there are numerous reports of excellent taste on JT-02. Tony and smc both think highly of it. For zone 5, JT-02, Chuchupaka, and Dar Sofiyivki seem to be far and away the best hybrids for flavor and productivity.
I’ve tried grafting NG on at least 4 separate occasions (and multiple placements each time) with no success. I don’t think I’ll even try it again, especially with all the comments about perennial complete fruit drop.
At present, IDK that I have a ‘favorite’.
I like Yates; I like Prok, and have not noticed any residual astringency, at least not that I recall. Keener is good, and seems to have more ‘fiber’ in the flesh than most Americans, but I still think it’s pure D.v., and not a hybrid, as some have claimed. NC-10 has been a heavy bearer here for nearly 30 years, ripening early(mid-September), fruits are quite mild.
Rosseyanka has been a good producer for me, but is pretty bland - but it lends itself well to slicing and dehydrating if picked while still slightly firm.
