Karmijn de Sonneville apple and Winnals Longdon perry pear trees

Posting a few pics of my 8 year old Karmijin de Sonneville apple tree and Winnals Longdon perry pear trees. It has been a bountiful year for my orchard here in southern Oregon’s Rogue Valley. THe Karmijins are really pretty with their russetted stem and red blush! This will be the first crop from the Winnals Longdon. Hoping to make a perry blend with some Hendre Huffcap and Barland perry pears,


I love KdS. I plan on buying a bushel at the “local” (2 hr. drive) when they go on sale.

I am contemplating ordering a KdS apple tree next spring. It sounds like it is a really good apple. The description says it is a really flavorful apple. I read it grows better in cooler weather. Your photo sort of proves otherwise since you are in zone 8. I am in zone 6a. Nice crop of KdS apples. Does it produce apples every year or is it biennial?

I’m getting nice KdS here in western Montana Zone 5b. Great annual production (although I should have thinned much more than I did.) Somewhat prone to what I think is “star crack disease”, a viral infection. Not sure how to treat that, but so far it hasn’t been too bad and I’m just discarding a few affected fruit.

I think it’s one of the best apples.


Hi Mike. It seems to tend towards biennial. This is the best crop the tree has produced yet. In previous years, I had problems with powdery mildew stunting leaf growth, and corky cracked spots on fruit that I assumed was scab. Last fall I started spraying horsetail tea as anti fungal and haven’t had any issues with either this year.
The fruit is beginning to drop now. They are very firm and tart when first picked. The good flavor develops after a few weeks in storage.

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@Ciderlady , I wonder if what you refer to as corky cracked spots is the same thing I thought might be “star crack disease”. I’ll try to get a picture later to show you.

This is a good example of what I get:

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I had that one year on the fruit one of my apple trees as well. I cannot remember which apple it was. Maybe my Zabergau. It just happened the one year and did not happen again. I never figured out what it was or what it was called. I just deleted the photos of my apples with that strange effect on them last week, I believe. I figured I did not need those photos again. Maybe I have them saved to my computer., I will look, makes me curious now.

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I’m envious of @Ciderlady’s KdS crop. I also have Winnals Langdon, but it’s still young and I haven’t allowed it to crop yet (perry pears don’t appear to be as slow to set fruit as dessert pears). I look forward to making a batch of Perry with it in a couple of years.

My experience with KdS runs about 15 years. The first apple it produced as a young tree was excellent. It was the only apple on the tree that year. Every single year after that when it set fruit, which was most years, the apples would crack, cork and rot. I never had even one worthy specimen achieve edibility after that initial apple. It’s hot and dry here, generally from early June until late September, although nights are comparatively cool. Anyway, confirmation that KdS is not likely to produce well where it’s hot.

Another high flavored Cox child you might consider that is a bit more resistant to heat is Suntan. It also cracks, corks and rots in some seasons, but other years it delivers fine apples, including one year where it produced the best tasting apples I’ve ever eaten. This year has the potential for something like that.

While not quite as boldly flavored, the one Cox offspring that regularly produces good to great apples in the heat is Rubinette.


I am not sure what state you live in but I am in SW Ohio and we get high heat during the summers and at times no rain for weeks at a time, like now. We have not had a decent rain in about 5 weeks and no rain is forecasted until maybe, maybe next week - only at a 30% chance for one day.
Sounds like the same type of weather we get here. Our hot and dry weather normally starts in late June or early July. This year it was in June. Temps usually in the high 90’s at times and very high humidity yet no rain just humidity. This year we had temps in the 100’s as did so many other states as well. That is why I am on the fence of trying the KdS even though I would love to have it in my orchard. All this feedback is very, very helpful in deciding to try it or not.
Thank you for the suggestion of Suntan. That is another one I had looked at , that and Kidd’s Orange Red since it is a Cox derivative, I believe.

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I’m in the western Great Basin in Reno, NV, so high desert, high elevation (4700’), almost no rainfall from June-October unless it’s a stray thunderstorm, and humidity in the teens and twenties. It’s definitely going to be different than anywhere in Ohio. I also have Kidd’s Orange Red. It’s sweeter and has less acid than Rubinette, which may work better in your area, but here, where my apples usually reach high Brix, it’s often too much on the sweet side. Rubinette reaches the same Brix as Kidd’s, but with enough acid to balance things out.

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